121 replies to this topic

[Massa]

Anyway, those new DTM cars are really ugly.  Not saying the old ones weren't.

Of course they'd be pretty if Wickens and Hand would just win the races or something.

[JHS18]

Nah, an Exide livery should be like this:





It's funny - I was reading on Ten Tenths that a lot of people prefer the look of the cars this year. I agree that they certainly look...purposeful and striking, but I'm not sure if they're "attractive" racing cars.

The one thing I'd wish more than anything that they'd do is get rid of all the aero rubbish that's around the cars, just the random little aero pieces of the bumpers and stuff. Being a big BTCC fan I'm probably biased - but they hardly have any aero pieces like that, and the racing is a lot more exciting. It's no wonder that there's perhaps not as much overtaking in DTM as there should be when there's all that sh*t all over the cars.

Have you seen Wickens' livery by the way? It's red and white. JUST LIKE THE CANADIAN FLAG OMG THEY'RE SO CLEVER.

Edited by JHS18, 03 May 2012 - 08:59 PM.

[Massa]

Man, Exide Europe sure likes bland liveries.

Blue's my favorite color, but blue and white is overdone.  Exide needs pink or it isn't Exide.  This was probably the worst Exide paint scheme: http://www.johnnyben...7 23 and 00.jpg

Of course I shouldn't diss blue and white, since those are the national racing colors of the United States (I think it's blue with two white stripes, but it may be white with two blue stripes).

Anyway, I should be fair and say that the BMW M3, Audi A5, and Mercedes C-Class are all very ugly cars as road cars (well, I guess the Mercedes isn't as ugly as the other two), in my opinion, so I guess that doesn't help them in translating to racing cars.

Hadn't seen Bobby's car, thanks.  It will be the worst paint scheme he's ever had if he doesn't win, and the best if he does.  Just win.  That's all I ask.  Win every single race and the title and go to F1.

[JHS18]

Extremely close practice times from the Euro Speedway - BMW 1-2 with Tomczyk fastest and Hand second.

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/99348

[JHS18]

Spengler takes pole, with Augusto Farfus completing an all BMW front row.

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/99384

Whilst in WTCC, Muller leads the predictable Chevrolet domination.

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/99386

Edited by JHS18, 05 May 2012 - 03:28 PM.

[Massa]

Why do Hand and Wickens suck so much?

[JHS18]

Massa, on 05 May 2012 - 03:34 PM, said:

Why do Hand and Wickens suck so much?

Haha, give them time. I'm sure they'll get up to speed soon, they can't be easy cars to get used too.

Look at Farfus - pretty anonymous last weekend, now on the front row this weekend.

[JHS18]

Well, it didn't take them long...Spengler wins for BMW in only their second race.

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/99412

Plus watch this from the second race of WTCC at Hungary. Home hero Norbert Michelisz wins, crowd goes mad.

I believe from memory the track has given tickets away for WTCC in the last two years, or they've been priced very cheaply. Seems to work, attendance on par with F1 attendance...

[Massa]

I give up.  Wickens is never going to F1 and Hand's heroics in ALMS are tarnished.

[JHS18]

Massa, on 06 May 2012 - 03:47 PM, said:

I give up.  Wickens is never going to F1 and Hand's heroics in ALMS are tarnished.

Wickens had been running in the top ten (in the points!) till a mechanical failure 4 laps from the end. Hand, no idea.

[JHS18]

Someone's been nice and illegal and uploaded the race in full if you're interested:

[JHS18]

Two races in, and there's already rumours that a fourth manufacturer could join for 2013. Hot favourite at the moment seems to be Alfa Romeo.

Of course, Alfa does have a DTM history. In fact, one of the most famous cars from DTM history was an Alfa.

[Massa]

I know this isn't where it goes but Audi, Miguel Molina, Europe, close enough.  It's really cool.

http://www.youtube.c...bSLswc#t=04m34s

[JHS18]

Massa, on 11 May 2012 - 01:40 AM, said:

I know this isn't where it goes but Audi, Miguel Molina, Europe, close enough.  It's really cool.

http://www.youtube.c...bSLswc#t=04m34s

Not sure whether that's terrifying or just damn cool...

Thanks for sharing.

[JHS18]

DTM Qualifying results for Brands Hatch:

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/99706

[JHS18]

Paffett wins DTM at Brands.

Surprise surprise, very little action to speak of. It is ridiculous that DTM use the Brands Hatch Indy track to be honest, it doesn't suit the cars at all, and in a series where it is hard to overtake anyway, putting them on a circuit with few if any overtaking places it is a recipe for a very dull race.

There's two or three good overtaking spots for something like BTCC on Brands Hatch Indy. Even less for DTM with all the aero rubbish on the cars. Either use the GP loop, or find another venue because there's many that'd be better than Brands Hatch Indy.

And I'm not just saying that because Brands happens to be the track furthest from where I live, either...

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/99733

In happier news, the Chevrolet domination show goes horribly wrong in the last few laps in Austria:

Edited by JHS18, 20 May 2012 - 02:41 PM.

[Rainmaster]

As if they don't use the GP layout. That Sh#t cray.

[Massa]

Race them somewhere where Wickens and Hand won't suck so much.

[JHS18]

Mortara and Tarquini start on pole for the DTM and WTCC races tomorrow.

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/100063
http://www.autosport...t.php/id/100072

[Massa]

Well, that's better for Joey Hand.

Just a question...do DTM and WTCC ever not run on the same weekend?  It seems to me they always have conflicting dates and that doesn't make a whole lot of sense when they probably share a lot of the same fans.

[JHS18]

Haha good question. I don't think it is intentional, but yeah, it is a bit strange. I don't think the FIA are really doing themselves any favours by having their dates on the same days as DTM - a series that is heavily backed by Germany's three largest car manufacturers.

But, I don't think it really is an issue. Both series have different markets really, different audiences. You only have to look at how different the cars are in both championships. It'd be a different story if say, they were both S2000 based championships, but they're not, so...

Honestly, it is hard to say which championship is in a better position right now. DTM has big budget manufacturers spending loads with easily the superior driver line-up. But then again, WTCC has Chevrolet, Ford and Honda will be joining in the fun in 2013. WTCC has an American race that absolutely no-one will care about, DTM had a round in China in the past that absolutely no-one cared about. I'd say though, despite Chevy's dominance, WTCC is a lot more exciting in terms of on track action. Shame then that DTM has the more exciting cars (at least on paper).

What that has to do with your original question, I have no idea.

Looking ahead on both calendars, there's only one more date clash. But that's ages away on the 21st October when WTCC is racing in Japan and DTM's racing at Hockenheim, so with the time difference even that isn't a real clash.

Edited by JHS18, 02 June 2012 - 10:43 PM.

[Massa]

Hand and Wickens still suck.  Wickens should have taken the GP2 offer he had...Mercedes isn't a free pass to F1 if you are going to be this awful.

[Massa]

One week after Norbert Haug publicly threatens to release Wickens for lack of performance, Coulthard defends him.

http://www.theglobea...306/?cmpid=rss1

Coulthard can say that, but some guy named Paul di Resta was just fine in his first year of DTM after formula cars.

Wickens is destined for IndyCar, if there's even an IndyCar when Mercedes cuts him.  Doesn't have what it takes.  Too bad.  I almost got to have a driver I really liked and followed for years and years before F1.

[JHS18]

Second DTM race is a row that's actually been quite entertaining. A wet/dry/wet/dry race at the Norisring street track. Jamie Green takes the lead of the race from Tomczyk on the last corner on the last lap.

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/100853

Hopefully someone will upload the finish of the race, but whilst you wait, here's a clip of the first corner chaos:



Have to say though, the English commentators (think I was watching an ESPN stream) are dreadful. Seriously annoying voices. Nearly gave me a headache so muted it and played music over the top instead.

[JHS18]

And here it is, a video of the finish:

[Massa]

Cool finish, thanks for posting.

Figures that Wickens finally gets points but is so far behind his teammate, some old guy whose day job is going deaf to Ben Edwards.

Kid can't catch a break (because he can never make his own breaks...I guess both North American talents, Wickens and Alex Rossi over in WSR, have been exposed for what they really are this year...two guys who would dominate IndyCar if there were an actual future for IndyCar, but aren't going to get the time of day in the big show).

[Massa]

Furthermore, I hope you didn't think I was going to make a post in this thread that wasn't lamenting Wickens' decision.

[JHS18]

I saw the Wickens/Hand post coming from a long way off I'm afraid.

But on a serious note, I've criticised DTM before - but Brands Hatch aside, this season had been kinda okay so far, which is surprising. The last race at the Red Bull Ring (what was the A1 Ring before) was a good race too, with Mortara taking his first win in a three way scrap that went down to the wire. That was in dry conditions too. Hockenheim and Eurospeedway were decent races as well.

I don't think you should be too critical of Wickens. I guess I'm right in guessing that this is the first year he has raced a car with a roof? That probably takes some getting used too, especially when (according to David Coulthard) c#ckpit temps were reaching 50 degrees in practice.

Also, you have to consider the tiny margins that split DTM - you look at qualifying and the top 17-18 or even more are covered by a second. It is probably one of the closest championships in the world right now in terms of that aspect of it. Lastly, there's more experienced rookies (if that makes any kind of sense) who Wickens seems to be matching - so I wouldn't say he's doing terribly. If he was two seconds a lap off the pace, maybe, but I wouldn't say it is too bad right now.

[JHS18]

Relevant: Nissan may do WTCC or DTM:

http://www.touringca...cle.php?id=7833

They don't really have a model in Europe right now that'd meet FIA regulations to do WTCC...plus the way that series is looking right now (on shakey ground to put it lightly) it may not be the best long term investment they're looking for.

DTM would be interesting. People forget that it IS open to manufacturers who aren't German. Opel raced in it till about 2004-2005 before it became Audi vs Mercedes for years. Again, I'm not totally sure what car they'd use. On the basis that there's still talk of a link up between Super GT and DTM and the cars are pretty similar, logic dictates that they'd run the GT-R.

I still think though, whatever they do that a sports car programme is the most likely way they'll go. They've upped their support, particularly in LMP2, in recent years and they gained great exposure from the Deltawing. Plus in sports cars more than any other form of racing, there is the platform to develop new hybrid technologies that they can use on their road car market, so it makes sense. But we'll see. It is great to see Nissan looking at so many different forms of racing. I did hear talk that the WRC was something else they were looking at as well.

[Massa]

Opel is a German manufacturer, though.

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