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radical-one

Teammate War - Who's Winning ?

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In general, not just on points, who's ahead of who ?

Nico vs Hamilton - Nico ahead

Kimi vs Vettel - Kimi slightly ahead

Dan vs Max - Even ?

Bottas vs Massa - Massa slightly ahead

Kvyat vs Sainz - Kvyat ahead

Grosjean vs Steban - Grosjean ahead

Alonso vs Button - Even

The rest doesn't matter as of now...

Who's gonna make a big difference soon ?

Maybe :

Nico will continue to dominate Lewis ?

Kimi will be more steady than Vettel ?

Dan will get his revenge ?

Bottas will be overshadowed more ?

Kvyat will screw up ?

Alonso might make 6th place in Monaco ?

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So has Kimi but and is performing better than Seb ATM IMO.

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I think both Vettel and Hamilton have had some hardware hardships havent they?

Fair to say yes. But it's still is part of racing.

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Fair to say yes. But it's still is part of racing.

It is true as far as score sheet is documenting, and if that holds true as personal performance goes, then we have to accept that Kvyat whipped Ricciardo last year, because you cannot ignore 2 DNF(s) for Vettel with another two races with questionable strategies, and by the same standard excuse DR.

I've made a spreadsheet with results (I am not sure how to copy it here), and facts is, Vettel actually is ahead of Raikonnen, looking on results objectively.

Race 1 - V p3, R dnf

Race 2 - V dnf, R p2

Race 3 - V p2, R p5

Race 4 - V dnf, R p3

Race 5 - V p3, R p2 (Vettel was merely 0,8 sec behind, despite 3-stopper)

I do not want to read tea-leafs, but I can't see Vettel as underperforming.

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I don't think and said that Vettel is under performing, I just feel that Kimi is performing better than his last year's thus resulting in a little edge on Seb on my list - as pf the last race.

Hardware or hard-lucks are all part of racing. Everyone has one on one day or the other. If we will put that in context all the time then there's no real champion like Nico had more unfortunate races last year than Lewis.

in the end, result is result regardless of DNFs, etc.That's what recorded in history.

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I don't think and said that Vettel is under performing, I just feel that Kimi is performing better than his last year's thus resulting in a little edge on Seb on my list - as pf the last race.

Hardware or hard-lucks are all part of racing. Everyone has one on one day or the other. If we will put that in context all the time then there's no real champion like Nico had more unfortunate races last year than Lewis.

in the end, result is result regardless of DNFs, etc.That's what recorded in history.

I do agree with you that equipment performance is part of racing, just as I do agree that Kimi is performing better than in 2015, but at the same time, I do not see his edge over Vettel.

Out of 5 races, three contained DNF. Only China and Spain were races both drivers finished.

Consider those then:

China Vettel 18 Raikonnen 10

Spain Vettel 15 Raikonnen 18

Vettel 33 points, Rainkonnen 28

There is of course more to it than just rudimentary stats as shown, but I've always consider teammate comparison as an excercise in subjectivity. Equipment might be similar, however is never the same, conditions for each racer are unique, and one can continue listing pro and cons. In fact I think that teammate comparison as an indicator of racer's overall standing is poor, and misleading yardstick which is rather a solid reason for not to do it.

To clarify, for me there is life-long accomplishment worthwhile to discuss, individual races as well - good fun, but to disect some individual, selective fraction of events in one's life is doing rather disservice to that person.

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I know one thing Vettel is doing better than anyone at the moment and that's having a sook whenever anyone even has a look at trying to pass him.

Imagine Vettel on the regular road, the rage would be similar to this.

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Mercedes: Rosberg over Hamilton

Ferrari: both are doing their jobs just fine

Red Bull: only one race to judge by

Williams: Massa over Bottas

STR: only one race to judge by—but I think Kvyat should do better (not sure he will)

Haas: no contest lol

Force India: they're still on the grid?

McLaren: Vandoorne over both ;)

Renault: Magnussen over Palmer, and how

Sauber: Nasr over Ericsson

Manor: Wehrlein over Haryanto

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I had this theory last year, that Sainz is just as good as Verstappen is, or better. He had truckload of bad luck, and at least in one case there were team orders issued against him, if my recollection is correct. Now he will have opportunity to prove me right. Kvyat is on fire at the moment, so, good luck to both of them. Sainz seems to be more cool headed, more calculating, no stupid diving in to force the move or crush, etc. Not bad driver either, just overlooked right now with those two other guys in spotlight.

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It's worth noting that most of the issues with current and former WDCs are hardware-related whilst the wannabes are hindered mostly by their own psychi. The mentally strong will survive and the weak will fall away. There is much talk about Vandoorne replacing Button. He is certainly quick and most efficient with feedback but why change stuff for the sake of it? No one has a God-given right to climb straight into a hot car and as long as Button and Alonso are doing their jobs to the maximum, Stoffo will just have to wait or move. Despite being pranged by a flying drain cover in P1 and the fact that Nando has an upgraded drivetrain, JB still managed to pull 4/10ths on him in P2. Replace that, MF!

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Mercedes: Rosberg over Hamilton

Ferrari: both are doing their jobs just fine

Red Bull: only one race to judge by

Williams: Massa over Bottas

STR: only one race to judge by—but I think Kvyat should do better (not sure he will)

Haas: no contest lol

Force India: they're still on the grid?

McLaren: Vandoorne over both wink.png

Renault: Magnussen over Palmer, and how

Sauber: Nasr over Ericsson

Manor: Wehrlein over Haryanto

I agree with the McLarencool22.gif

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It's worth noting that most of the issues with current and former WDCs are hardware-related whilst the wannabes are hindered mostly by their own psychi. The mentally strong will survive and the weak will fall away. There is much talk about Vandoorne replacing Button. He is certainly quick and most efficient with feedback but why change stuff for the sake of it? No one has a God-given right to climb straight into a hot car and as long as Button and Alonso are doing their jobs to the maximum, Stoffo will just have to wait or move. Despite being pranged by a flying drain cover in P1 and the fact that Nando has an upgraded drivetrain, JB still managed to pull 4/10ths on him in P2. Replace that, MF!

All true, but there is perhaps an additional angle how one can look at situation at McLaren. Setting aside Alonso's mood whether he will, or will not ride for them in 2017, Button seat is a different matter. JB may be there for another year or two, and leave. Who will replace him when time comes? Vandoorne will not wait forever, he could secure a seat elsewhere, whereas signing him in 2017, he could potentially turn into an asset for next six years. (Basically at least two contracts). Bottom line, take end of 2017 and 2018 when JB might be on his way out, and predict who will be available and worth signing a team which wants to win the championship. I think Renault was faced with similar decisions, and their approach is different. Why pay expensive (bored to death) drivers now, when realistically car will be ready to fight with best only after 2017? I would let JB go to Williams, and sign up Belgian for the next season. Even better solution was to take him now, so he gets use to the procedures and feels equipment when nothing much is in stake, but ready to go head to toe with MV next year. He could learn of Alonso, but later this will be an opportunity lost.

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IMHO

Mercedes - Rosberg has proved so far to be far ahead of Hamilton but it won't last, Hamilton is their future and they will do whatever it takes to keep him happy. Who here thinks that Toto would have asked a struggling Hamilton to let Nico through last Sunday if the roles were reversed? I don't

Ferrari - Vettel way ahead but down on points due to pit wall blunders

McLaren - when it matters Nando delivers, Button seems to have the upper hand when they're not very competitive

Red Bull - so far Ricciardo has been much better than Verstappen, pity the puit wall has its own agenda. I can't see Ricciardo at Red Bull for long

Toro Rosso - quite even, the fact that they so obviously want to get rid of Kvyat (who I understand is talking with Williams for next year) will probably tip the balance in Sainz's favour

Williams - an odd one, Massa is a significantly better driver than Bottas but the team having (I believe reluctantly) to keep Toto happy means that often Bottas' inferior performances turn into better results than Massa (and Massa is prone to silly mistakes and is also quite unlucky)

Force India - Perez is significantly more talented than Hulkenberg, but Hulkenberg is a very good racer and so they are often even

Haas - no contest there

Manor - I was expecting a walk in the park for Werlhein but it's not happening

Renault - I don't understand why people say that Magnussen is doing so much better than Palmer, to me it looks as if the difference between the two is marginal, ie. I don't think that this is the strongest pair of drivers out there

Sauber - I forgot about them, and that gives away what I think of the team and their drivers, I'd say that Nasr is marginally better than Ericsson but both are basically irrelevant and look to me as being out of their depth in F1

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An interesting take. I am not totally in the clear about the alledged RBR agenda.

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An interesting take. I am not totally in the clear about the alledged RBR agenda.

Of course, because then it will question how the team was run in the Vettel/webber days wouldn't it? A leopard doesn't change its spots.

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Of course, because then it will question how the team was run in the Vettel/webber days wouldn't it? A leopard doesn't change its spots.

Perhaps then you can also confirm, that in 2014 RBR management was trying to get rid of Vetttel, and DR really had it easy, as MV has. That's the line of thinking you are presenting here, isn't it the truth?

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Nope, redbull wanted Vettel to stay and there was talks of extending his deal at the time. But when redbull got no response then finds out he had signed for Ferrari, then Vettel got upset because redbull weren't as involved with him in fear data would be taken to Ferrari, that's the truth.

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I think that in 2014 Red Bull wanted Vettel to go, he was becoming too big and so they helped Ricciardo and not him (Canada 2014 IMHO is very similar to Spain 2016). Vettel had also a difficult year for other reasons (he was very young and coming from 4 WDCs that must have been extremely stressful) and so he left.

Nowadays there's a lot of people who are suggesting that they handed the victory in Spain to Verstappen as a favour to Bernie who was finalising the last details of the new Heineken sponsorship.

Obviously what happened in Monaco has nothing to do with this, it was a very bad mistake by RBR

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Nope, redbull wanted Vettel to stay and there was talks of extending his deal at the time. But when redbull got no response then finds out he had signed for Ferrari, then Vettel got upset because redbull weren't as involved with him in fear data would be taken to Ferrari, that's the truth.

Well, unless Horner or Marko are your intimate friends painting true picture for you, then you think that's what RB wanted, but in reality Horner was talking about consideration of extending Vettel's contract after it was revealed to public, that Vettel signed with Ferrari. I do a lot of reading (in 3 or 4 languages) on daily basis what's going on with Vettel, and I am quite sure of sequence of events in his last a few months with RB. I can also reveal to you (ask Lyria), that there was short time, when I was also suspicious of conspiracy against Vettel just as you are about DR. Reason why they did not want him, because media pressure. Pro Anglo-Webber media were slugging Vettel for this or that on daily basis, booing by idiots, etc., was really no good for selling fizzy drinks, and Vettel had to go, or play second fiddle, so when Ferrari called on him, he first refused, but when Sabine talked to him some more, he took it, especially when he really wanted to emulate his buddy, Michael.

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