pumpdoc

Idiot Of The Race

218 posts in this topic

I thought they were stationery before he hit kimi????

That is largely irrelevant, if there is another car in front of you, it blocks your view, as you should know the field of vision in an F1 car is narrow as it is

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Glad to see you admit Alonso is able to stay cold and calculate something. :D

BTW, where that monumental stupidity comes from? I mean, who? :rolleyes:

Oh Hammy for missing a red light. I mean come on, that is moronic.

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Massa made the same mistake last year without another car blocking his view, I guess that makes him a moron too?

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You drive down the pitlane. You're pumped up, massively. Your stop was slow. Your rivals jumped you. Your two rivals stop. Your instinct gets the better of you. You want to go past. You see a red light; too late. The available gap is down to your left, next to Kimi. You miss the gap, you hit Kimi.

Hit Kimi because of championship implications? In that split second? You have time to decide that? Please people, get real. This aint girls in a playground pulling pigtails, it's motor racing.

Yep, thats how I see it.

In Adelaide, Damon Hill was closing on him. No one else was. No one else was going to be champion other than Michael or Damon. It was clear. If Damon passed, Michael would lose. There's the motive to take out Damon. Michael had time to think

Jerez '97. Jaques is closing on Michael. No one else is going to be champion that year other than Michael or Jaques. Still, Jaques is closing. Michael has time to think. Time to calculate. Jaques makes his move, down the inside. Michael makes his move. Simple, calculated risk. It didn't pay off.

Michael had time to think.

Lewis had no time to think.

Anyone who believes Lewis decided to who to hit needs to stick to reading 'Heat' magazine and go for a girly gossip down the pub. F*cking morons.

Yep, a lot of them around at the moment.

We can talk about the penalty seriously. I don't think FiA should have penalised Hamilton but I am not surprised either. It is the way FiA's been handing out penalties for ages. If you want to understand FiA you need imagination. Imagine Kimi and Kubica hadn't been there, Hamilton would have passed by the red light and would have been black flagged. Probably Kimi would have scored 10 points and Lewis would have scored none... That's the way FiA is looking at it. We can agree on that penalty or not but we should agree FiA is consistent with what they've done in the past.

:dam:

Yep, good point

The world is a very strange place when a thread attacking one driver has already got to 3 pages. The fact that the thread was started by a moderator makes it doubly so. Anyway, I'm sure Lewis will not be reading it so...

Carry on bitching

-_-

Yep, and people wonder why there is so much bitching on the forum, when you have a moderator instigating it ?

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Massa made the same mistake last year without another car blocking his view, I guess that makes him a moron too?

No, I think Felipe drove straight past the stationary BMW of Robert.

Can anyone confirm???

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No, I think Felipe drove straight past the stationary BMW of Robert.

Can anyone confirm???

Correct Robert had stopped an Massa went right around him

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That is largely irrelevant, if there is another car in front of you, it blocks your view, as you should know the field of vision in an F1 car is narrow as it is

you claimed he was surprised by them braking late.... if they were stationery how could that have surprised him??? :huh:

I am aware that it is narrow..... but still.....

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No, I think Felipe drove straight past the stationary BMW of Robert.

Can anyone confirm???

From the ripped footage I have on my hard disk, all I see is Kubica stationary, with Massa and Fisi on their way, I cannot find a video of the whole incident, so its hard to say for sure

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you claimed he was surprised by them braking late.... if they were stationery how could that have surprised him???

I am aware that it is narrow..... but still.....

They where going down the put lane pretty much right in front of him :rolleyes:

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From the ripped footage I have on my hard disk, all I see is Kubica stationary, with Massa and Fisi on their way, I cannot find a video of the whole incident, so its hard to say for sure

Yeah Felipe drove straight past a stationary Robert, and Fisi followed in the Renault. Both recieved the black flag.

Edited by aussief1

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Yeah Felipe drove straight past a stationary Robert, and Fisi followed in the Renault. Both recieved the black flag.

Correct, If i remember correctly he said he couldn't see the light , think they made the lights bigger/ higher for this race??? But not 100% sure

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Y'all (well some of y'all, so not really y'all, I just like saying y'all) are forgetting that they would be driving close to 100km/h by the time they get to the exit line. I know that they have wicked good brakes, but can you stop your car at 100km/h in the sapce of five metres and not hit a car infront of you?

Lewis would be looking up the pitlane, then in his mirrors to check on Rosberg, then back up, then...WHOOPS! React as fast as possible, but distance vs time vs speed equaled crash.

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Y'all (well some of y'all, so not really y'all, I just like saying y'all) are forgetting that they would be driving close to 100km/h by the time they get to the exit line. I know that they have wicked good brakes, but can you stop your car at 100km/h in the sapce of five metres and not hit a car infront of you?

Lewis would be looking up the pitlane, then in his mirrors to check on Rosberg, then back up, then...WHOOPS! React as fast as possible, but distance vs time vs speed equaled crash.

I think that the speed limit is 60 in canada and they were not at the exit yet anyway.....

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Funny how Lewis gets a 10 place grid penalty yet kimi gets nothing for crashing into Sutil.

I guess Lewis had to be penalised for his carelessness so he'll just have to driver faster and hope for better luck next time round. Must say it was a bit odd that Charlie Whiting chose to deploy the saftey car having first decided against it. Losing a 6.5 second lead and the long pitstop obviously flustered the young lad

Oh well, at least Lewis has the opportunity to fight for the WDC whereas nando is languishing mid pack and making unforced errors left right and centre.

Sh!t happens

;)

Funny how people can not differentiate between hitting a stationary car that has stopped on a red light and hitting a car when yours is out of control at a very high speed. If you have a driver's lisence you'll know that the penalities are different even on the road anywhere around the world. Try hitting a car stopped on a red light in front of you.

Edited by F1_Fanatic

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Oh well, at least Lewis has the opportunity to fight for the WDC whereas nando is languishing mid pack and making unforced errors left right and centre.
Alehop, I don't waste my time bitching about multi-millionaire F1 drivers. Jealousy/Hatred, IMHO, is a wasted emotion so I don't bother with it. I genuinely do not dislike any driver on the grid as I'm of the opinion that you can't dislike an individual if you don't know them personally or if they haven't done anything of consequence wrong. When all is said and done F1 is about driving not about hatred or taking the p!ss out of drivers that have 10 times the talent of any of us on here.

:eusa_think:

Anyway, on to (slightly) more sensible matters...

For anyone who thinks Lewis shouldn't have got a penalty when Kimi didn't in Monaco...

RED LIGHT people RED FRIGGING LIGHT. Add to that PARKED CARS people PARKED FRIGGING CARS.

The severity of the penalty may be disputable - possibly 5 places for each driver rather than ten. But the fact that he got one is not.

From Hamilton himself...

...by the time they'd come to a halt, it was too late for me to avoid them. It's just unfortunate when stuff like this happens, but I have no argument with the stewards.

Listen to your idol. If he can accept he deserved the penalty - then so should you.

As for those on the other side of the debate who still wish to claim he "chose" to run into Kimi rather than Kubica...

That's just plain silly. He instinctively went for the gap to the left of Kimi having nowhere else to go - didn't make it and hit Kimi. S##t happens - that's racing.

Now I'll be in trouble with both camps - read my signature, but more importantly - actually read my post.

Edited by adamstrags

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:eusa_think:

Anyway, on to (slightly) more sensible matters...

For anyone who thinks Lewis shouldn't have got a penalty when Kimi didn't in Monaco...

RED LIGHT people RED FRIGGING LIGHT. Add to that PARKED CARS people PARKED FRIGGING CARS.

The severity of the penalty may be disputable - possibly 5 places for each driver rather than ten. But the fact that he got one is not.

From Hamilton himself...

Listen to your idol. If he can accept he deserved the penalty - then so should you.

As for those on the other side of the debate who still wish to claim he "chose" to run into Kimi rather than Kubica...

That's just plain silly. He instinctively went for the gap to the left of Kimi having nowhere else to go - didn't make it and hit Kimi. S##t happens - that's racing.

Now I'll be in trouble with both camps - read my signature, but more importantly - actually read my post.

Darn. And I replied to you on the other thread...you will hate me for that. We agree, of course.

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The other thing here is that Hamilton has a pit exit close to the end of the pits cause of Mosley, so he accelerates out wanting to go quickly. Ferrari cause of their "win" have one at the other end, same for BMW who were second in the championship. So both of those drivers have the whole pit straight to be told of the red light, and to slow down. Hamilton has only mere meters before he will have to brake, so he accelerates out the same as Raikkonen and Kubica, but cause of the shorter distance to the exit his braking distance is vastly increased. Thats the real issue here!

This is not correct. In fact, this particular track, Hami's pit box was closer to the pit entry, and Kimi's closest to the pit exit. You could even see Hami walking past the Ferrari mechanics,to his garage.If this logic were to hold true, then Kimi had the least amount of time to be informed of the red light and react to it.

Any which way, LH screwed up and he got a penalty for it.

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I think that the speed limit is 60 in canada and they were not at the exit yet anyway.....

I believe you'll find it's 60MPH. I'm talking 100km/h which translates closely to 60MPH, and the limit applies from pit entry to pit exit, after the exit you can put the boot down...can't see where your second statement is heading there???

*******************

I agree Adamstragler in what you are posting. It's just an unfortunate thing...but you live and die by the rules, and in this case Lewis and Rosberg have died.

I don't know why everyone is getting so jumped up about it. Cripes.

Edited by HandyNZL

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Funny how people can not differentiate between hitting a stationary car that has stopped on a red light and hitting a car when yours is out of control at a very high speed. If you have a driver's lisence you'll know that the penalities are different even on the road anywhere around the world. Try hitting a car stopped on a red light in front of you.

That's not the point and bringing up ridiculous ridiculous analogies doesn't help your argument. Penalties have been handed out in the past for incidents similar to Kimi'

s at Monaco, usually to lower grid drivers. Losing control of your car is never an excuse, or there will be nothing to prevent drivers from going banzai, especially drivers with little to lose, and when they screw up, they can claim that they just lost control. Imagine this - towards the end of the race, a driver in P9 tries a crazy manoeuvre to overtake the driver in P8. Going by your argument, if he loses control of of his car, by your logic, all he gets is a DNF, and if he's a top driver, P9 isn't worth anything anyway. Drivers have to be responsible for where their cars go at all times in the race, 'losing control' can never be an acceptable excuse.

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This is not correct. In fact, this particular track, Hami's pit box was closer to the pit entry, and Kimi's closest to the pit exit. You could even see Hami walking past the Ferrari mechanics,to his garage.If this logic were to hold true, then Kimi had the least amount of time to be informed of the red light and react to it.

Any which way, LH screwed up and he got a penalty for it.

McLaren was in Pit 5, Williams right behind them. Ferrari closest to the exit, with Bimmers next door. Can't remember who was in between, but Renault was one, not that they played a part in this, but someone has to bing Alonso up and it mighta s well be me this time :P

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Yes correct. The post to which I was replying implied that LH was closest to the exit, therefore less time for braking etc etc. and that's not true.

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:eusa_think:

Anyway, on to (slightly) more sensible matters...

For anyone who thinks Lewis shouldn't have got a penalty when Kimi didn't in Monaco...

RED LIGHT people RED FRIGGING LIGHT. Add to that PARKED CARS people PARKED FRIGGING CARS.

The severity of the penalty may be disputable - possibly 5 places for each driver rather than ten. But the fact that he got one is not.

From Hamilton himself...

Listen to your idol. If he can accept he deserved the penalty - then so should you.

As for those on the other side of the debate who still wish to claim he "chose" to run into Kimi rather than Kubica...

That's just plain silly. He instinctively went for the gap to the left of Kimi having nowhere else to go - didn't make it and hit Kimi. S##t happens - that's racing.

Now I'll be in trouble with both camps - read my signature, but more importantly - actually read my post.

Accepted it ages ago mate.

I expected something like this to happen as Lewis was getting very c#cky and overconfident. Life has a funny way of bringing us down to earth when we think we think we're walking on top of the world. Lewis thought he had won the race before it have even started.

Robert Kubica is a very good driver because he is not only fast, but he also makes very few unforced errors. He is also low profile, arrogant, but low profile nonetheless.

Kimi, Lewis, Massa are fast but sometimes make mistakes - we all do

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Another poor decision by the FIA to say the least. When every driving error someone makes can be called into question, it sets a dangerous precident. I feel sorry for both Lewis and Nico

I don't. They made silly errors of judgement. The only precident set, if any, is to remind drivers not to be silly arses in the pitlane.

I cannot agree with that, Lewis was just moving down the pitlane at normal speed, the only possible explanation is that his view of the lights was obscured, or he simply was not warned of them being on in time. I cannot believe that any driver would drive that recklessly in the pit.

Well, believe. Adrenalin can have an impulsive affect on the inexperienced.

Penalties are meant to be imposed for reckless driving, not accidents and I do not believe Nico or Lewis where being reckless, I believe they got caught out.

Yeah, caught out being reckless.

Driving out of the pitlane when you are right in front of the light is a totally different matter

I'm guessing you don't drive a car on the road.

"Sorry officer. I didn't mean to squash the old lady. I was right in front of the red light and so didn't see it". Sounds stupid, doesn't it?

Try chasing me with your bike closely while I am driving a car, then I slam the brakes after I see an old lady crossing my way and you brake too late, then after you have damaged my tailgate I will ask you to pay for the damage and remind you that all my tail lamps including the centrally mounted stop lights worked perfectly. Not only did you ignore my lights, you also ignored my huge stationary car.

:lol:

Vision is key in F1, and he clearly couldn\'t see them. Lewis, like all F1 drivers is only human, and he can only react to what he saw in front of him. Evidently, he also never got any warning from the team.

A bit worrying then. If he saw the red light and carried on, that's worrying. If he didn't see the red light, that's worrying too. The drivers are used to the lights system. They use it in practice and in qualifying. This is not like coming around a blind cornere and finding temporary road works at a piece of road you know very well. It should be drilled into their protocol to observe and obey the lights. There is simply no excuse. Relying on the team? Yes, a message would have been helpful but a driver should not rely on this, it's his responsibility.

I am not debating that it may have been a Mistake, I just feel the penalty is extremely harsh

I disagree.

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That's not the point and bringing up ridiculous ridiculous analogies doesn't help your argument. Penalties have been handed out in the past for incidents similar to Kimi'

s at Monaco, usually to lower grid drivers. Losing control of your car is never an excuse, or there will be nothing to prevent drivers from going banzai, especially drivers with little to lose, and when they screw up, they can claim that they just lost control. Imagine this - towards the end of the race, a driver in P9 tries a crazy manoeuvre to overtake the driver in P8. Going by your argument, if he loses control of of his car, by your logic, all he gets is a DNF, and if he's a top driver, P9 isn't worth anything anyway. Drivers have to be responsible for where their cars go at all times in the race, 'losing control' can never be an acceptable excuse.

so what they did at Japan 07 is perfectly illegal, hell there were cars aquaplaning all over the road. Driver's not in control of their cars. funny theory, this of yours....

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