Belgium Gp - Spa-francorchamps

[MannTecV10 0]

As much as I am for fairness, if i recall, Mr Hamilton let Mr Raikenon past and a full car lenght in front, before lining up his next over take. Now, what exactly did Hamilton do wrong? Someone please justify the penalty? I understand if you gain a position by leaving the track you must then seed the position back to your rival. This was done. That Raikenon then couldn't make his newly recovered lead stick is his problem alone. Besides did he then not park the car in a crash barrier? following a spin on track? I am baffled and m beginning to join the masses in claiming the FIA is the Ferrari Interests Agency?

Discuss.

[Rainmaster 7]

It's not the end of the title run for Raikkonen. It was worse last year after all.

I'm afraid they might give some more pentailies as Alonso, Heidfeld, Kubica and Vettel were under investigation too.

True, but last year the competition wasn't as tough.

[Medilloni 6]

He got an advantage by short cutting the chicane and then he did let him go but the advantage that he got was not negated by letting KIMI go through , he started attacking kimi very early.

Am not sure if KIMI passed Hami fully.

Hamilton slowed down to let him past - he pulled out from behind of Kimi to overtake, therefore Kimi was fully in front. There is no precedent for 'how early' you can try to pass again.

[Anti-Ferrarist 0]

I totally agree with the masses claim about FIA being Ferrari Interest Agency. It's incredible in a sport like this to be witnessing such miserable acts. For how long the formula 1 will keep ridiculizing themselves as being Ferrari's watch dog.

This is a mistreatment for all the fans, not only McLaren fans, but all F1 fans. This Hamilton victory was fair and square, Hamilton has shown that he is the best driver in the rain and it was a fair movement regardless of what the partialized stewards said.

It's a shame!!

[la force supreme des mclaren 0]

Instead of Hamilton and Mclaren replying with a "we're disappointed with this penalty" they should completely diss the FIA in the press.

[Ayrton Senna 1]

Hamilton slowed down to let him past - he pulled out from behind of Kimi to overtake, therefore Kimi was fully in front. There is no precent for 'how early' you can try to pass again.

If that's the case, maybe all drivers should start overtaking like Hamilton did today. Cut the chicane intentionally, "give back" the position on a straight line and do a banzai move on the next corner. It's much easier.

Lewis wasn't pushed away on the chicane, he used the run off escape, I'll say it again: INTENTIONALLY to do the trick. The punishment is fair and deserved.

[Sudarshan the shumi fan 0]

If that's the case, maybe all drivers should start overtaking like Hamilton did today. Cut the chicane intentionally, "give back" the position on a straight line and do a banzai move on the next corner. It's much easier.

Lewis wasn't pushed away on the chicane, he used the run off escape, I'll say it again: INTENTIONALLY to do the trick. The punishment is fair and deserved.

Cmon guys , he got an advantage . No one can deny that.

Ferrari always tops in the straight line speed , so if they were racing normally then no way would Hamilton would have passed him there. After short cutting the chicane he carried more speed (advantage) therefore he could overtake KIMI.

It was not a clean overtaking.

[Ayrton Senna 1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmL9ODG1ZPY

He totally abdicates of staying on track to take advantage of the run off escape. I like Hamilton a lot as a driver but this is an intentional cheat attempt, he should be glad he wasn't black-flagged.

[Max Mosley 2]

Well I always defended Max in his scandal but now I can go back to railing against the FIA and their Ferrari bias! Let's hope Bernie can do something about the FIA.

[raw 0]

I thought most people were under the impression overtaking was dead and races are boring ffs?

1. Lewis was alongside on entry to the chicane, on the outside into a right hander. That is the racing line.

2. Kimi probably did squeze Lewis, Hamster would probably have done the same. It's also possible that Kimi didn't have the grip to stay on the r/h side, enabling to come back at Lewis on the inside of the exit of the following right hander.

1. No it isn't.

2. Why he would want to stay on the r/h side? He would have to be insane to do that. He took proper line to defend himself and shut the corner nicely to prevent Hamilton catching him and outbraking on the straight.

Somebody in the earlier stages of the race showed how to overtake on this chicane from outside. And you can not do that the way Hamilton wanted unless it's James May who's being overtaken, Lewis was just too far.

[Anti-Ferrarist 0]

If that's the case, maybe all drivers should start overtaking like Hamilton did today. Cut the chicane intentionally, "give back" the position on a straight line and do a banzai move on the next corner. It's much easier.

Lewis wasn't pushed away on the chicane, he used the run off escape, I'll say it again: INTENTIONALLY to do the trick. The punishment is fair and deserved.

Sorry pal, the punishment was unfair and undeserved. It was another sad story of the Ferrari domination in this political sport. It's as simple as if you look at history, everytime Ferrari was in a position of loosing the championship something like this happens. and of course in favour of the italians. I wish I was wrong but I'm not.

[Sudarshan the shumi fan 0]

Sorry pal, the punishment was unfair and undeserved. It was another sad story of the Ferrari domination in this political sport. It's as simple as if you look at history, everytime Ferrari was in a position of loosing the championship something like this happens. and of course in favour of the italians. I wish I was wrong but I'm not.

We have the video evidence.

I wont say that as cheating, its a sad sporting incident. The penalty might be harsh , but the fact is that he had an advantage.

[Rainmaster 7]

Bah. Why should racing always be totally fair, it's not in the nature of the beast.

[Kopite Girl 0]

Popular comments so far...........

1. Lewis was offline/didn't have the racing line

2. Kimi pushed him offline/wide

3. They touched/rammed each other

4. Lewis gained momentum through the move

5. It wasn't legal

6. Lewis didn't have to do it

7. Bring back the gravel trap

I thought most people were under the impression overtaking was dead and races are boring ffs?

1. Lewis was alongside on entry to the chicane, on the outside into a right hander. That is the racing line.

2. Kimi probably did squeze Lewis, Hamster would probably have done the same. It's also possible that Kimi didn't have the grip to stay on the r/h side, enabling to come back at Lewis on the inside of the exit of the following right hander.

3. It was wet, they were on dry tyres with less than ideal tyre pressures. They were probably hyped up to fcuk too, do we expect not to see contact under those circumstances? Didn't we rave when Senna and Mansell (and our other favourite racers) do the same?

4. He did, he was then right under the wing of Kimi for a good few yards, therefore travelling at the same speed - but of course, he'd get a tow. Did he gain an advantage? What's to say he wouldn't have had the same tow by following him through the chicane? Kimi was outbraked, not overtaken with superior straightline speed.

5. This comment is nonsense, they were completely side by side, neither of them in front of the other. As in 1., if you are side by side there might be tears, but there's no 'right of way' when you're completely alongside - that's motorsport.

6. Yes he did, he wants to race, to win! It might be the wrong thing to do, immature, not clever, but he's proven to be a racer whether you like him or not. And for the record, I think they're both great drivers, but I like neither, imo Kimi is a lazy sod with the character of a sloth to match, Hamster is a gobby kid that needs to grow up

7. Maybe so. So what? I'm sure people would think of other 'it's not fair's' if they brought the gravel trap back.

And now we see Hamster penalised 25secs, the FIA continue to be a laughing stock.

Disclaimer: I watched it once, after examining replay's on freeze frame I might backpedal slightly. But I doubt it

1. No, he wasn't. Kimi was ahead on the entry. Kimi had the racing line, not Lewis.

2. How could Kimi have squeezed him when Kimi had the racing line. See point 1.

3. If Kimi had an ounce of common sense, he'd have rammed Lewis right off into the wall.

4. How could he gain when he gave nothing back to Kimi in the first place?!

5. They were not completely alongside. Watch the replay.

6. If he wants to win the race - by all means! If he wants to win the WDC - THINK A LITTLE BIT FIRST, DUH!

7. No relevance whatsoever to me.

Nothing against you Medalloni, and I think you're a top bloke - but I just don't see your reasoning. If it was reversed, and Kimi was in Lewis' shoes - I'd be saying exactly the same.

[pabloh20 1]

Popular comments so far...........

1. Lewis was offline/didn't have the racing line

2. Kimi pushed him offline/wide

3. They touched/rammed each other

4. Lewis gained momentum through the move

5. It wasn't legal

6. Lewis didn't have to do it

7. Bring back the gravel trap

I thought most people were under the impression overtaking was dead and races are boring ffs?

1. Lewis was alongside on entry to the chicane, on the outside into a right hander. That is the racing line.

2. Kimi probably did squeze Lewis, Hamster would probably have done the same. It's also possible that Kimi didn't have the grip to stay on the r/h side, enabling to come back at Lewis on the inside of the exit of the following right hander.

3. It was wet, they were on dry tyres with less than ideal tyre pressures. They were probably hyped up to fcuk too, do we expect not to see contact under those circumstances? Didn't we rave when Senna and Mansell (and our other favourite racers) do the same?

4. He did, he was then right under the wing of Kimi for a good few yards, therefore travelling at the same speed - but of course, he'd get a tow. Did he gain an advantage? What's to say he wouldn't have had the same tow by following him through the chicane? Kimi was outbraked, not overtaken with superior straightline speed.

5. This comment is nonsense, they were completely side by side, neither of them in front of the other. As in 1., if you are side by side there might be tears, but there's no 'right of way' when you're completely alongside - that's motorsport.

6. Yes he did, he wants to race, to win! It might be the wrong thing to do, immature, not clever, but he's proven to be a racer whether you like him or not. And for the record, I think they're both great drivers, but I like neither, imo Kimi is a lazy sod with the character of a sloth to match, Hamster is a gobby kid that needs to grow up

7. Maybe so. So what? I'm sure people would think of other 'it's not fair's' if they brought the gravel trap back.

And now we see Hamster penalised 25secs, the FIA continue to be a laughing stock.

Disclaimer: I watched it once, after examining replay's on freeze frame I might backpedal slightly. But I doubt it

Indeed, Sir.

Mind you, I think the reason why there is so little overtaking in F1 has been answered. Apparently, if you make a mistake trying to overtake, even when racing under fairly treacherous conditions and you take the run off and give the place back, you can still get a drive through penalty. Let's just give the WDC to the driver who does the least overtaking during the year - yay!!!

[Kopite Girl 0]

Sorry pal, the punishment was unfair and undeserved. It was another sad story of the Ferrari domination in this political sport. It's as simple as if you look at history, everytime Ferrari was in a position of loosing the championship something like this happens. and of course in favour of the italians. I wish I was wrong but I'm not.

Yes. You are.

I'm sick to s##t of people saying "Blah blah FIA loves Ferrari" and all that nonsense. Cut the conspiracies, accept the facts and get on with life! Its easy.

McLaren/Hamilton got what they deserved. Good. And I'm not even anti-Hamilton.

[Medilloni 6]

1. No it isn't.

2. Why he would want to stay on the r/h side? He would have to be insane to do that. He took proper line to defend himself and shut the corner nicely to prevent Hamilton catching him and outbraking on the straight.

1. If you're saying the correct place to be for a right hander is the middle of the track (in the wet you're off the grease), then I understand your comment. I understand the conventional ideal place to be for maximum corner speed is the outermost point before turning in to apex. They were both completely alongside each other on entry, they were at the apex and they were at the point Hamilton left the track.

2. As mentioned, he might have had no choice (due to grip levels), but you can't shut the door unless you're ahead. I'd agree with you if Kimi was ahead, but this isn't the case. As for why he would want to stay on the right hand side in the middle of the chicane....... if someone dives down the inside on an early entry, as Hamster would have been had they continued, the 'thinking driver' will take the tight inside line on exit, where he could have hung Lewis out to dry on the outside as they hit the straight.

Somebody in the earlier stages of the race showed how to overtake on this chicane from outside. And you can not do that the way Hamilton wanted unless it's James May who's being overtaken, Lewis was just too far.

Yes someone did - great move. Neither of these two were great at any point during this move/incident.

[pabloh20 1]

1. No, he wasn't. Kimi was ahead on the entry. Kimi had the racing line, not Lewis.

2. How could Kimi have squeezed him when Kimi had the racing line. See point 1.

3. If Kimi had an ounce of common sense, he'd have rammed Lewis right off into the wall.

4. How could he gain when he gave nothing back to Kimi in the first place?!

5. They were not completely alongside. Watch the replay.

6. If he wants to win the race - by all means! If he wants to win the WDC - THINK A LITTLE BIT FIRST, DUH!

7. No relevance whatsoever to me.

Nothing against you Medalloni, and I think you're a top bloke - but I just don't see your reasoning. If it was reversed, and Kimi was in Lewis' shoes - I'd be saying exactly the same.

The racing line going into the chicane is the outside line, the line Lewis was on. Kimi squeezed him off track by giving him nowhere to go in the 2nd part of the chicane. Nothing wrong with that, I just don't know where people expect Lewis to have gone. He couldn't brake anymore, he couldn't turn inside Kimi as there is not enough lock to do so, so he either crashed or took the run off area.

If it had been any 2 drivers I have watched over the years, even ones I disliked, I would never in amillion years expected to see a penalty handed out to a driver who did what Lewis did.

[Medilloni 6]

Mind you, I think the reason why there is so little overtaking in F1 has been answered. Apparently, if you make a mistake trying to overtake, even when racing under fairly treacherous conditions and you take the run off and give the place back, you can still get a drive through penalty. Let's just give the WDC to the driver who does the least overtaking during the year - yay!!!

Agreed Pabloh.

[Kopite Girl 0]

The racing line going into the chicane is the outside line, the line Lewis was on. Kimi squeezed him off track by giving him nowhere to go in the 2nd part of the chicane. Nothing wrong with that, I just don't know where people expect Lewis to have gone. He couldn't brake anymore, he couldn't turn inside Kimi as there is not enough lock to do so, so he either crashed or took the run off area.

If it had been any 2 drivers I have watched over the years, even ones I disliked, I would never in amillion years expected to see a penalty handed out to a driver who did what Lewis did.

But he wasn't equal to him on the entry! He was half a car behind!!!!! It was stupid of him to even attempt a move when he knew Kimi had the racing line. If it was me, I'd have waited, knowing that I had more speed into the next corner, and then made my move.

[Medilloni 6]

1. No, he wasn't. Kimi was ahead on the entry. Kimi had the racing line, not Lewis.

2. How could Kimi have squeezed him when Kimi had the racing line. See point 1.

3. If Kimi had an ounce of common sense, he'd have rammed Lewis right off into the wall.

4. How could he gain when he gave nothing back to Kimi in the first place?!

5. They were not completely alongside. Watch the replay.

6. If he wants to win the race - by all means! If he wants to win the WDC - THINK A LITTLE BIT FIRST, DUH!

7. No relevance whatsoever to me.

Nothing against you Medalloni, and I think you're a top bloke - but I just don't see your reasoning. If it was reversed, and Kimi was in Lewis' shoes - I'd be saying exactly the same.

OK GR, I think I've riled you Raw, but I stand by my comments on who was where during the whole thing. I will watch the replay and apologies will be gushing to all if I'm wrong (pah! yeah right ), but frankly, we'll all have a different take on what's fair and what's not, what's a fair line, when should they yield - all that stuff.

3 and 6. I really don't think either of them were running on common sense, just outright 'in the moment' stuff. And quite honestly (bearing in mind I'm a fan of neither ) I'm glad - it was great to watch.

[Boily 0]

In as much as I wanted to see Phil win , I can not believe the stewards gave out such a penalty , it is an unfair judgement !!!!1

To be honest at the start it looked as tho the team had traded cars without the knowledge of the drivers , Phil's car was working so much better yesterday and then Kimi takes off like he was in Phil's car .

[freaky2 1]

Lewis had to go out in the run-off, but he should have given back the position, but no... as many say, it wouldn't have made much of a difference then, but now it's been +25 seconds for him.

[Anti-Ferrarist 0]

It was unfair because Hamilton did not take any advantage of this move to win the race. What about the final two laps that he had to take the car to the finish line??? Did he cut any chicanes or provoked Kimi's spin?? Com'on it's clear that the purpose of this, call it conspiracy or what you like, but to give damage limitations to their bosses.

It was clearly business not personal..I'm aware of that!..;-)

[Sudarshan the shumi fan 0]

In as much as I wanted to see Phil win , I can not believe the stewards gave out such a penalty , it is an unfair judgement !!!!1

To be honest at the start it looked as tho the team had traded cars without the knowledge of the drivers , Phil's car was working so much better yesterday and then Kimi takes off like he was in Phil's car .

Mclaren have filed an appeal , lets see.

Might not be over yet.