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Oli

Honda Rescued!

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Without a buyer, how do you secure an engine deal, then redesign your car and make it competitive enough to be on the grid in three months from now? I must be missing something.

You are not - they can't. I am convinced they probably already have an engine deal awaiting confirmation once a buyer is found. I am equally sure that development had continued at a rate of knots. Hardly anyone of any significance has left Brackley, I can tell you that. I am less confidant that there are any serious buyers out there. The shops may be packed but you can't charge an F1 team to a credit card. People with 'real' money never spend it - that's why they always have it. I'm still waiting for Hyundai to come into play.

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It wont matter who buys the team, they will continue to be a mediocre racing team as long as Nick Fry is in charge. The only way this team will ever stand a chance of winning again is re-hire a b@stard such as David Richards. My advice is to stop looking at who or what might buy Honda because that is irrelevant. The real questing is: Can the team win with Nick Fry left in charge?

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It wont matter who buys the team, they will continue to be a mediocre racing team as long as Nick Fry is in charge. The only way this team will ever stand a chance of winning again is re-hire a b@stard such as David Richards. My advice is to stop looking at who or what might buy Honda because that is irrelevant. The real questing is: Can the team win with Nick Fry left in charge?

Happy New Year! Some people think Nick Fry has done a great job but they all work at Honda HQ, Tokyo! Brawn wanted a clean sweep when he got there but Honda resisted and Fry stayed on. Of course, any new owner would make wholesale changes and they certainly would not retain a CEO who had overseen three seasons of atrocious performance. Brawn is the jewel in the crown but Button is on thin ice. Jean Todt isn't enjoying his desk job, I hear - he could be a target for a new owner. However, I think Brawn can go it alone for a while, anyway; he has so much kudos and respect.

JB's contract with Honda is meaningless unless someone honours it. In advising Jens to take a year out, I believe Bernie knows something we don't - like,.....no serious bidders on the radar! He has been advising Hyundai/Kia on F1 inclusion since 2006, when they announced 2010 as a target entry date to coincide with the inaugural Korean GP. I doubt we'll see that now as [a] they tend to say one and do another - they came out of the WRC in 2003 saying they would be back in 2006 - it never happened and they announced further cuts in worldwide car production just two days ago - not a good omen. So, I believe it's down to privateers like DR or Greeks bearing gifts to s##t or get off the pot - now! I did heard a murmur that Peter Sauber is looking at creating a new team with Swiss backing and a BMW drivetrain. It's all smoke and mirrors though, with little substance. However, I think you can be absolutely positive of one thing. Unless Fry is involved in an internal buyout - he's out!

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Glad to hear that Fry is being (rightly) blamed for Honda F1's mess. Too bad Purnell can't be coaxed back into F1 to take Fry's place.

Brawn is good but if you spread him out too thin on the managerial side, you diminish his worth. What you need is a top team principal to free Brawn from all the red tape so he can concentrate on organizing the testing and racing teams.

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It's being reported yet again that a deal has been agreed to save Honda.

Hope it's true this time.

....and the source?

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It's being reported yet again that a deal has been agreed to save Honda.

Hope it's true this time.

Why do you hope it's true? Why do you want another lacklustre car on the grid?

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[quote name='Autumnpuma' post='279923' date='Jan 5 2009, 04:55 AM']Why do you hope it's true? Why do you want another lacklustre car on the grid?[/quote]

You would prefer to see them go?

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Why do you hope it's true? Why do you want another lacklustre car on the grid?

If it was going to be 'lacklustre', as you say, notwithstanding Honda's decision to pull out, [which, with the recent FIA/FOMA accord, they may regret], I hardly think Ross Brawn would have wasted a whole season developing it or Jenson Button would give up the last chance to extract himself from the whole mess by hanging around to drive it. It may not be the car Ross envisaged originally because it will have a new powerplant, if it runs. But, you can be rest assured that a Brawn car, built from the ground up will be a far more competitive ride than the 'garden sheds' that Jens and Rubihno had to contend with in the Honda years. I would have thought any Ferrari supporter would accept that particular argument. After all, without Brawn's brilliance I doubt the Scuderia would be where they are today.

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If it was going to be 'lacklustre', as you say, notwithstanding Honda's decision to pull out, [which, with the recent FIA/FOMA accord, they may regret], I hardly think Ross Brawn would have wasted a whole season developing it or Jenson Button would give up the last chance to extract himself from the whole mess by hanging around to drive it. It may not be the car Ross envisaged originally because it will have a new powerplant, if it runs. But, you can be rest assured that a Brawn car, built from the ground up will be a far more competitive ride than the 'garden sheds' that Jens and Rubihno had to contend with in the Honda years. I would have thought any Ferrari supporter would accept that particular argument. After all, without Brawn's brilliance I doubt the Scuderia would be where they are today.

Well said. I just don't understand anybody who propheces to be a fan of the sport who can hope for a teams demise. There are so many reasons I want to see Honda line up on the grid, not least because I want to see what Brawn can do away from his dream team. Maybe it's because Brackley is just down the road from me, but I don't want to see seven hundred unemployed either.

Why is it a problem if the car is lacklustre. Some team are going to be lacklustre next to the competition. Always have been, always will be. You want equal cars and equal driver ability? Hell, then it really will be boring.

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Well said. I just don't understand anybody who propheces to be a fan of the sport who can hope for a teams demise. There are so many reasons I want to see Honda line up on the grid, not least because I want to see what Brawn can do away from his dream team. Maybe it's because Brackley is just down the road from me, but I don't want to see seven hundred unemployed either.

Why is it a problem if the car is lacklustre. Some team are going to be lacklustre next to the competition. Always have been, always will be. You want equal cars and equal driver ability? Hell, then it really will be boring.

Who wants to see a grid wholly populated by manufacturers and their 'satellite' teams anyway? The most exciting things that have happened in F1 have emanated from underdog teams like Vanwall, Lotus, Hesketh, Tyrell, Williams, McLaren, Jordan, Sauber, BAR, Red Bull and STR and long may it be the case.

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Well said. I just don't understand anybody who propheces to be a fan of the sport who can hope for a teams demise. There are so many reasons I want to see Honda line up on the grid, not least because I want to see what Brawn can do away from his dream team. Maybe it's because Brackley is just down the road from me, but I don't want to see seven hundred unemployed either.

Why is it a problem if the car is lacklustre. Some team are going to be lacklustre next to the competition. Always have been, always will be. You want equal cars and equal driver ability? Hell, then it really will be boring.

They're the main reasons for me to Steve - I'm really curious to see what Brawn's come up with, especially their KERS system. As others have said, I hope it's all without Fry too, DR is a hard nut, but it's now they need someone like him.

RE: Team F1's comments...

It's being reported yet again that a deal has been agreed to save Honda.

Hope it's true this time.

I've picked it up from a number of forums, notably the Honda one.

If the site is realhondaf1.com, and there's any credence in the posts, then we should hear something between tomorrow and Thursday.

This Slim bloke. I can find lot's of stuff denying him buying the team, but nothing from him or Brawn to deny he wasn't at the factory.....

I remain a dreamer optimistic. ;)

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They're the main reasons for me to Steve - I'm really curious to see what Brawn's come up with, especially their KERS system. As others have said, I hope it's all without Fry too, DR is a hard nut, but it's now they need someone like him.

RE: Team F1's comments...

If the site is realhondaf1.com, and there's any credence in the posts, then we should hear something between tomorrow and Thursday.

This Slim bloke. I can find lot's of stuff denying him buying the team, but nothing from him or Brawn to deny he wasn't at the factory.....

I remain a dreamer optimistic. ;)

There's a lot of rubbish that comes out of there but it could be near the mark. The info I have this morning is that news that the team have been bought is circulating like wildfire within the UK-based F1 community and that an announcement will be forthcoming before next week. Slim was probably only there to discuss sponsorship for Senna and have a nose around. He may have since made an offer - who knows? This smells of DR to me. I hear there has been a resurgence in job offers from Grove and Enstone et al. to the talent at Brackley since this morning's rumours circulated. If he's on his way in, he'll have a bloody big axe in his hand!

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There's a lot of rubbish that comes out of there but it could be near the mark. The info I have this morning is that news that the team have been bought is circulating like wildfire within the UK-based F1 community and that an announcement will be forthcoming before next week. Slim was probably only there to discuss sponsorship for Senna and have a nose around. He may have since made an offer - who knows? This smells of DR to me. I hear there has been a resurgence in job offers from Grove and Enstone et al. to the talent at Brackley since this morning's rumours circulated. If he's on his way in, he'll have a bloody big axe in his hand!

I think that about Slim too, if there's a rescue it'll need a heavy backer (pay-driver) so makes sense...

Hope it does smell of DR, I struggle to like the guy, but he's got a good business brain and he'll know what a jem Brawn is to get hold of - and Fry will be gone. I hope they don't lose key members of staff whilst all this is going on though.

When is the next round of testing, does anyone know?

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That is where I got it from.

I hope it's true because strangely I fear for the future of F1.

If Honda does go, the grid is down to eighteen cars. A minimum of fourteen is needed to host an event and rumours abound that other team are considering their F1 input.

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Surely not Schumi!? I don't think so, but hey, it's the off-season. And as long as the outcome is a happy one, I'm happy.......... :P

Source:

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns21071.html

JANUARY 5, 2009

Michael Schumacher and Honda

One intriguing rumour to surface over the Christmas period is the suggestion that Honda Racing F1's Ross Brawn may have been talking seriously to Michael Schumacher about working together to save the Brackley team. Schumacher has plenty of private money but it is unrealistic to believe that anyone will spend their own cash to pay the running costs of an F1 team. However, the Schumacher name does have a great deal of clout in the commercial world and it is possible, although rather unlikely in the current financial climate, that his involvement in a team could bring in the kind of money needed to run Honda for the next couple of years. This would give the team the opportunity to show an improvement in performance and allow the global economy to rebound and would perhaps end up being a sound investment for him.

The big question therefore is whether sponsors will join the party. The Honda team is an impressive operation and it should be getting better in 2009. The package being developed will have to be slightly modified because Honda will not be supplying engines and so commercial arrangements will be necessary with another manufacturer. The obvious choice is Ferrari, but we believe that there are other options available, largely because of capacity that will become available as a result the F1 testing ban that will begin in March.

Our spies at Brackley tell us that there has been a lot of interest in the team with perhaps as many as 25 different enquiries. Probably five or six of these are considered to be serious. We do not believe that any of them are automobile manufacturers as the world's car markets are in such a mess that no company can even consider such a step, despite the fact that a great asset that is available at a fraction of its actual cost.

The details of who is involved in these five or six bids is not clear but we hear that some of them are big organisations which see F1 as a good investment to support their business development. A great deal of effort is thus going on at the moment to finalise a deal by the end of January, when engine contracts will need to be organised in order for the team to be ready to run in Australia.

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I partially agree with Mike here. I feel sorry for the guys that may lose their jobs. But from a purely sportive POV, Honda was a total failure.

Smaller teams with smaller budgets have achieved so much more in the past AND present. They are one of the top manufacturers in the world. The manufacturer pushed aside the smaller teams with their worldwide brands and insanely huge amounts of money. And they haven't accomplished that much.

What have Honda done in all these years, after all that money spent? Nothing but up the ante, forcing (along with the other manufacturers) to pour even bigger loads of money into F1. That made teams like SA disappear. Now is Honda's time.

I would regret if Renault pulled out because of my blind support for them. But I recon that if all manufacturers would leave and we should start from scratch with smaller teams then I would in the end be happy with that.

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Yes, smaller teams would be the second best thing. And I am also happy that Honda failed - they were a joke from the moment they hired Sato.

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I partially agree with Mike here. I feel sorry for the guys that may lose their jobs. But from a purely sportive POV, Honda was a total failure.

Smaller teams with smaller budgets have achieved so much more in the past AND present. They are one of the top manufacturers in the world. The manufacturer pushed aside the smaller teams with their worldwide brands and insanely huge amounts of money. And they haven't accomplished that much.

What have Honda done in all these years, after all that money spent? Nothing but up the ante, forcing (along with the other manufacturers) to pour even bigger loads of money into F1. That made teams like SA disappear. Now is Honda's time.

I would regret if Renault pulled out because of my blind support for them. But I recon that if all manufacturers would leave and we should start from scratch with smaller teams then I would in the end be happy with that.

This is one of the reasons why I'm really looking forward to Brawn & Fry finding the investment Andres, because it won't be Honda and that it will probably be a team closer to a Williams/Red Bull-type organisation - a competitive independent constructor but with (arguably) better people (Brawn, I hope!) at the helm. So (the bit in bold) if the manufacturers sell off their operations to companies (such as..) Prodrive we'll be back to smaller, budget conscious team that rely on sponsorship - all done with the minimum of redundancies and retaining the best of the facilities and people.

Honda have been incredibly stupid (along with Fry??), and the manner in which Honda announced this matches their weak on-track efforts - pathetic, leaving so little time to find investment, and using the excuse of the global ecomomy when they're still involved with bikes, boats and their US operations is hypocritical garbage. Fcuk 'em, I'm selling my lawn mower :P

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