Quiet One

Hamilton/trulli Controversy Re-opened?

199 posts in this topic

What good is it asking the bloody drivers though? Like they are not biased and gonna lie anyway!

That's like asking the criminal 'so, did you commit the murder?' and if they say 'no' you just accept it? Of course not. As soon as there was any conflicting reports between the drivers, they should have said 'okay, we'll look at the radio transmissions to corroborate your story Lewis'. Really simple, but they failed to do that. Such a flawed system. Having the transmissions available should avoid all this kind of bulls##t.

Exactly. The drivers/teams are the last people you should ask, not the first.

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:lol:

Sooooo, I guess that's a no then, the monthly cycle hasn't finished :whistling:

What bollocking websites do you read for bollockings sake??? I haven't seen any bollocks about Trulli being a bollocking cheater. All I have seen is Trulli 25s penalty. Trulli reinstated.

Stay away from the bollocking light and you won't get so bollocking hormonal :lol:

No no! I'm gonna kill ya! I'm gonna kill y'all!

ARGHHHH!!!

Ahhh I feel better now!

Sooo...has 2009 season started yet?

Edited by Quiet One

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May I have a Maure moment?

I am _smiling_ here. :P

I mean, McLaren/Hamilton are caught cheating in the worse way. Yet the focus has shifted to FIA's obvious incompetence. You _are_ aware that none of this lessens the fact that McLaren had hit rock bottom with all this, right?

Sorry, I feel compelled to _walk_ now.

That_made_me_smile_actually...

But the discussion shifted because Mclaren's stupidity was obvious from the beginning and everybody accepts that, yet the FIA's incompetence was not so obvious, we just had to pin down their liability in this sorry affair :P

Also, a deeper problem may have been revealed, i.e making a decision based on...which way the wind is blowing??

Hopefully we can agree that: 1) Mclaren acted stupidly and cheated unnecessarily, 2) the FIA/stewards decison-making process has some holes in it.

Now, practice for Malaysia is starting soon, onto the next controversy :P

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May I have a Maure moment?

I am _smiling_ here. :P

I mean, McLaren/Hamilton are caught cheating in the worse way. Yet the focus has shifted to FIA's obvious incompetence. You _are_ aware that none of this lessens the fact that McLaren had hit rock bottom with all this, right?

Sorry, I feel compelled to _walk_ now.

Oh for bollocking sake. Cheating in the worst way?? You reckon saying 'no, I didn't let him through' is equivalent to running another fuel tank, or having the plank too thin or copying Ferrari's designs, etc, etc?? It wasn't a perfomance enhancing lie, for bollocking sake :lol:

Here's a tip for you, if you want to know when a driver or a member of the team is lying, then this is a sure, fail safe way of detecting it - their lips are moving.

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That_made_me_smile_actually...

But the discussion shifted because Mclaren's stupidity was obvious from the beginning and everybody accepts that, yet the FIA's incompetence was not so obvious, we just had to pin down their liability in this sorry affair :P

Also, a deeper problem may have been revealed, i.e making a decision based on...which way the wind is blowing??

Hopefully we can agree that: 1) Mclaren acted stupidly and cheated unnecessarily, 2) the FIA/stewards decison-making process has some holes in it.

Now, practice for Malaysia is starting soon, onto the next controversy :P

We do agree on that!

Ok, next issue: is KERS acceptable by the Catholic Roman Church?

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That_made_me_smile_actually...

But the discussion shifted because Mclaren's stupidity was obvious from the beginning and everybody accepts that, yet the FIA's incompetence was not so obvious, we just had to pin down their liability in this sorry affair :P

Also, a deeper problem may have been revealed, i.e making a decision based on...which way the wind is blowing??

Hopefully we can agree that: 1) Mclaren acted stupidly and cheated unnecessarily, 2) the FIA/stewards decison-making process has some holes in it.

Now, practice for Malaysia is starting soon, onto the next controversy :P

Indeed. The McLaren thing was a certainty from the start of the thread, nobody has disagreed with that, so we had to move onto other things :lol:

It certainly makes some of the decisions a bit more understandable, if a bit more frustrating. Let's take the Alonso-Massa one from qualifying in whatever race it was. You know the one where Massa was in the first corner when Alonso was crossing the finishing line, but farted when he did so and started a turbulence that caused Massa to slow down. Well, I was one of the ones who thought that was ridiculous, but grudgingly admitted that Ferrari must have shown the stewards telemetry that proved that Massa was affected. Now, though, we have to admit that they didn't have telemetrical evidence at all, the whole investigation consisted of......

Stewards: Massa, were you slowed down by Alonso?

Massa: Yes.

Stewards: Penalty for Alonso.

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Hopefully we can agree that: 1) Mclaren acted stupidly and cheated unnecessarily, 2) the FIA/stewards decison-making process has some holes in it.

Yup. Both pretty depressing facts. Only redeemed by the fact that:

practice for Malaysia is starting soon, onto the next controversy :P
Stewards: Massa, were you slowed down by Alonso?

Massa: Yes.

Stewards: Penalty for Alonso.

:lol:

Well, I'm being kind by laughing. It would be funny if it weren't true.

Edited by Murray Walker

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No no! I'm gonna kill ya! I'm gonna kill y'all!

ARGHHHH!!!

Ahhh I feel better now!

Sooo...has 2009 season started yet?

No, not for Renault it hasn't :whistling::eekout:

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:lol:

Well, I'm being kind by laughing. It would be funny if it weren't true.

Actually, the more I think about it, the worse it becomes :lol:

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We do agree on that!

Ok, next issue: is KERS acceptable by the Catholic Roman Church?

Does the Pope s##t in the woods?

Indeed. The McLaren thing was a certainty from the start of the thread, nobody has disagreed with that, so we had to move onto other things :lol:

It certainly makes some of the decisions a bit more understandable, if a bit more frustrating. Let's take the Alonso-Massa one from qualifying in whatever race it was. You know the one where Massa was in the first corner when Alonso was crossing the finishing line, but farted when he did so and started a turbulence that caused Massa to slow down. Well, I was one of the ones who thought that was ridiculous, but grudgingly admitted that Ferrari must have shown the stewards telemetry that proved that Massa was affected. Now, though, we have to admit that they didn't have telemetrical evidence at all, the whole investigation consisted of......

Stewards: Massa, were you slowed down by Alonso?

Massa: Yes.

Stewards: Penalty for Alonso.

:lol:

I bet Mclaren wish they had applied a similar standard of investigation during Spygate :lol:

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We do agree on that!

Ok, next issue: is KERS acceptable by the Catholic Roman Church?

Yes. They will shag anything that has a pulse, even if it's just a battery pulse.

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:lol:

I bet Mclaren wish they had applied a similar standard of investigation during Spygate :lol:

Indeed :lol:

Stewards: Did you photocopy Ferrari's designs?

McLaren: What's a photocopy?

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:lol::lol:

I shoud have known I couldn't leave for 20 minutes :lol:

But I'm gonna catch some sleep before FP1, so see you in a couple of hours :)

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Indeed :lol:

Stewards: Did you photocopy Ferrari's designs?

McLaren: What's a photocopy?

:lol:

You mean

Ahhh I just finished watching a 3+ hour match between Nadal and Del Potro and the Argentinian guy won! Wooohooo!

Now you know what got me so grumpy! :lol:

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:lol:

You mean

Ahhh I just finished watching a 3+ hour match between Nadal and Del Potro and the Argentinian guy won! Wooohooo!

Now you know what got me so grumpy! :lol:

That's the one :lol:

Your online date said when she meets you she wants to run her fingers through your hair?? Oh, you meant the tennis match, sorry :whistling:

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Indeed :lol:

Stewards: Did you photocopy Ferrari's designs?

McLaren: What's a photocopy?

:lol:

:lol:

You mean

Ahhh I just finished watching a 3+ hour match between Nadal and Del Potro and the Argentinian guy won! Wooohooo!

Now you know what got me so grumpy! :lol:

:lol:

Ron's fave video right there.

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This article pretty much sums up my opinion on the subject.

http://planetf1.com/story/0,18954,3261_5133601,00.html

Yeah, that's a pretty good article, sums it up well. The FIA aren't breaking any fundamental principle of law though, just because they don't provide their evidence doesn't mean they don't have any. If Mclaren thought the FIA's case was weak they would appeal, the writer ignores that simple fact. The evidence probably exists, but the FIA are too idiotic and stubborn to share it.

Sadly the FIA don't have to provide their reasoning or the evidence they used, they have no legal obligation to provide it but they should obviously do it in the interests of transparency. It would be much better for the fans; so we will probably remain in the dark because as shown before, the FIA don't care about the fans.

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Yeah, that's a pretty good article, sums it up well. The FIA aren't breaking any fundamental principle of law though, just because they don't provide their evidence doesn't mean they don't have any. If Mclaren thought the FIA's case was weak they would appeal, the writer ignores that simple fact. The evidence probably exists, but the FIA are too idiotic and stubborn to share it.

Sadly the FIA don't have to provide their reasoning or the evidence they used, they have no legal obligation to provide it but they should obviously do it in the interests of transparency. It would be much better for the fans; so we will probably remain in the dark because as shown before, the FIA don't care about the fans.

The thing is f course that the evidence presented- in the form of the radio conversations- and made available do present a damning case against Mclaren- They lied, and did so knowing JT would take the fall for it in order to gain advantage. they are paying for it now

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McLaren definately lied - their lack of complaint when handed the penalty shows us that.

The fact that they thought they could and indeed should lie about the incident indicates how much of a joke the stewards in F1 have become.

The fact that the stewards docked Trulli 25 seconds seemingly soley on the basis of what Hamilton told them (did they have any other evidence that Trulli had done wrong?), shows them up as ignorant fools (no wonder then that teams feel they can take the p**s).

The fact that Toyota then dropped their appeal against that original decision demonstrates the sheer lack of confidence all teams have in the stewards.

The time it took for the obvious questions to be asked and the transcripts to come to light is absurd.

What do we get out of this?

i) Stewards are f***tards.

ii) McLaren will manipulate the system any way they can - even if that means cheating other teams out of hard earned points.

iii) Quite a few other teams on the grid would lie too (and have in the past).

F1 has become the home of crooks and fools.

With competent, consistent stewards, McLaren wouldn't have considered being dishonest (okay maybe they would :P ) and the results would never have been changed at all.

Finally...

I dispise the whole "at least the stewards got it right in the end" argument.

Bollocks!

The stewards should ****ing get it right - that's their bloody job. They shouldn't have to get everything wrong first time round, then change their minds later. We shouldn't be congratulating them for finally coming to an obvious conclusion that a ****ing child could work out. They still haven't withdrawn Vettel's penalty. They have proved time and time again to be fools not fit to tie their own shoe laces.

Well done the stewards - this time you've been very slightly less twat-like than usual.

Edited by adamstrags

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I don't care about any of this. It's so indicative of our litigious, blame culture world. When every fortnight on a sunday I sit down and watch motor racing, I want to forget all that sh!t, see a race and not hear all the non stop bleating, bitching, blaming and moaning that so many people see as an essential ingredient. It bores me to the core.

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I don't care about any of this. It's so indicative of our litigious, blame culture world. When every fortnight on a sunday I sit down and watch motor racing, I want to forget all that sh!t, see a race and not hear all the non stop bleating, bitching, blaming and moaning that so many people see as an essential ingredient. It bores me to the core.

But we're aloud to bleat, bitch, blame and moan about the non-stop bleating, bitching, blaming and moaning yes?

:P

PS - what you doing up at this time?

Edited by adamstrags

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Bah too much whining everywhere. At least the stewards got it right eventually this time.

I agree with adam......that's their job.

I accept the fact that they probably made the right decision and that there's no reason to suspect that McLaren aren't totally guilty of lying. I'm not being a fanboy here.

But if we accept the fact that the stewards are getting much more involved lately (which seems to be the case compared to previous seasons) then it would be nice to see total transparency- then we can accept that McLaren got a deserved punishment and move on.

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