Today In F1

[f1gpfan 0]

All german line up next year for Mercedes. MS is back!

Isn't this a good news indeed. Should be an interesting season!

[mikathegreat2 2]

All german line up next year for Mercedes. MS is back!

Reference??

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

Sorry but you ARE worng. YOu suffer from a very common disease: colour tinted glasses.

Nah sorry Andres. That's bollocks.

I don't buy into all this: "modern drivers are better than old ones" nor for that matter the other way around. In the same way that fighter pilots in WWII are not as good as fighter pilots today. Its bulls##t. So what's changed, has the human race evolved in the last 50 years to become more adapted to F1 cars? No.

Fact of the matter is that Hill, Clark, Stewart etc were every bit as good as Hamilton, Alonso, etc. Sure some drivers stank. So some do today. Drivers argued and bitched then and now.

So what's the difference?

1) The technology - you are correct in that put an oldie in a modern F1 car now and he could probably not drive it as fast as a modern driver. Put a modern driver into an older car, they probably could drive it fast. As fast as an oldie driver... hmm dunno. I just think that for the given age, we have seen drivers rise to the surface who can deal with the technology at hand. In the same way that a WWII ace is no better or worse than a modern fighter ace.

2) The technology - no, not a typo. Depth of research, money, time, expertise has developed enormously - in some way positively, in others less so. Given the tight regs now its so much harder for a team to gain a technological advantage. In the 70s/80s, remember when Lotus brought in skirted cars, William active suspension, Renault turbos? Each gave the team a leg-up. Can't happen so easily now and the differences are less. Other teams copy it quicker too - take double diffuser as an example.

The cars are simply too regulated.

3) the technology - again? Well modern cars are hard to pass. This prevents some of the wheel banging, seat of your pants stuff.

4) The money. Root of all evil and all that. Has changed the sport from being something small, close to megabucks.... gone are the days when mechanics from one team would help another. Encourages cheating. Drivers are puffed up to being mega-celebrities. Everything has marketing-spin. Like music, money, marketing and mega-corps have changed the face of it. Doesn't mean that music these days is bad, just the way it is presented, delivered, etc.

5) All the scandals/FIA nonsense. the last few years have been one thing after another. Initially whilst there was some "ooh" I found myself this season, just going "oh for ****'s sake, not another scandal....." F1 needs to clean its act up. FIA needs to sort itself out. All the inconsistencies and personal agendas were just wearing.....

I agree its easy to wear rose-tinted spectacles and I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else. But I lack the passion for F1 I had when I was a kid. Something is missing and putting my finger on it, I would say it was in the transition from F1 being a sport to F1 being a business. Its all a bit too manufactured now.

There was a time when I *had* to watch the qualifying and race - would stay up late. Now I like to watch, but don't get that upset if I don't and frankly find some of the races boring. I've started watching and enjoying MotoGP and Indycar and finding them more enjoyable....

I still watch F1 though, can't help it. But I sometime do wonder why?

[dribbler 6]

I tried that earlier Steve... when people were arguing the toss about who should have won what, who's faster, who, allegedly, got 'screwed' by someone that pays his shagging wages... ffs!!!!!. The site should be named 'Cloud Cuckoo Land'. No twat was using evidence available from live timing sources (and the FIA times, weights etc), and no fecker would post a source when they posted something as a fact (i.e. not an opionion, which is fair enoughski). I just got fcuked off so don't bother now.

Mentioned earlier (the other thread on him is just mud now)... Kova-lame-one is a good example, how on earth could anyone believe that a team would pay a driver a few million squid, then make him look like sh1te on purpose? In fact, I believe that those posters are actually two people joined together with elephant spunk, 'cos not one person could possess so much fcuking stupidity. OK, whilst I don't agree with anything tonight, I will agree it's possible for a team to favour another driver (and in some cases should), but that doesn't go half-way to explain p**s poor consistency in race times - that's the sign of a driver that can't concentrate, isn't fit enough, or he gets uncontrollable hard-ons at the most inappropriate times. Fcuking fcuking stupid. Kova is a really nice guy, lovely, if I was a girlie I'd blow him, but he just isn't top bollocks material that could deliver within half a second (avareaged over the season) of the spoilt, fantastic, knob-head-but-sublimely-quick-when-he-isn't-overdriving bloke in the other car.

So now I'm Mr Calm, I use the Autosport forum for race natter, yeah, loads of nutters, but some great people (as there are here btw!) that back up their facts/reasoning and not too twat-headed to say they got it wrong when they do. I come here when the spittle starts to dribble down my chin

Was that arrogant enough? .........I'll get me coat

Enjoy Autosport, Mr Calm. I may pop in and ruin things, If you will allow me. When things get too factual, sensible and you find yourself over satisfied with common sense, do pop in here for a coffee, won't you?

Love, Spittler.

[jackgarrett 0]

Reference??

http://www.totalf1.com/full_story/view/327581/Schumi_has_signed_on_the_dotted_line/

[Persevere 0]

Quiet One and Grabthaw ("Are those real names?" questioned the naive American) both make a good case here with very valid points. Since I am considered a neutral on this forum I would therefore suggest that we have the boys step outside with duelling Shepard's Pies and turn the matter into a heretofore missing Monty Python episode.

But seriously ("You mean you thought you were being funny, Persevere?") I, for one, appreciate your opinions.

[Quiet One 15]

Nah sorry Andres. That's bollocks.

I don't buy into all this: "modern drivers are better than old ones" nor for that matter the other way around. In the same way that fighter pilots in WWII are not as good as fighter pilots today. Its bulls##t. So what's changed, has the human race evolved in the last 50 years to become more adapted to F1 cars? No.

Fact of the matter is that Hill, Clark, Stewart etc were every bit as good as Hamilton, Alonso, etc. Sure some drivers stank. So some do today. Drivers argued and bitched then and now.

So what's the difference?

1) The technology - you are correct in that put an oldie in a modern F1 car now and he could probably not drive it as fast as a modern driver. Put a modern driver into an older car, they probably could drive it fast. As fast as an oldie driver... hmm dunno. I just think that for the given age, we have seen drivers rise to the surface who can deal with the technology at hand. In the same way that a WWII ace is no better or worse than a modern fighter ace.

2) The technology - no, not a typo. Depth of research, money, time, expertise has developed enormously - in some way positively, in others less so. Given the tight regs now its so much harder for a team to gain a technological advantage. In the 70s/80s, remember when Lotus brought in skirted cars, William active suspension, Renault turbos? Each gave the team a leg-up. Can't happen so easily now and the differences are less. Other teams copy it quicker too - take double diffuser as an example.

The cars are simply too regulated.

3) the technology - again? Well modern cars are hard to pass. This prevents some of the wheel banging, seat of your pants stuff.

4) The money. Root of all evil and all that. Has changed the sport from being something small, close to megabucks.... gone are the days when mechanics from one team would help another. Encourages cheating. Drivers are puffed up to being mega-celebrities. Everything has marketing-spin. Like music, money, marketing and mega-corps have changed the face of it. Doesn't mean that music these days is bad, just the way it is presented, delivered, etc.

5) All the scandals/FIA nonsense. the last few years have been one thing after another. Initially whilst there was some "ooh" I found myself this season, just going "oh for ****'s sake, not another scandal....." F1 needs to clean its act up. FIA needs to sort itself out. All the inconsistencies and personal agendas were just wearing.....

I agree its easy to wear rose-tinted spectacles and I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else. But I lack the passion for F1 I had when I was a kid. Something is missing and putting my finger on it, I would say it was in the transition from F1 being a sport to F1 being a business. Its all a bit too manufactured now.

There was a time when I *had* to watch the qualifying and race - would stay up late. Now I like to watch, but don't get that upset if I don't and frankly find some of the races boring. I've started watching and enjoying MotoGP and Indycar and finding them more enjoyable....

I still watch F1 though, can't help it. But I sometime do wonder why?

And here's another guy who is worng!

Erm...nice, detailed reply. The problem is: you don't seem to be replying to my post. Most of what you say are things that I actually agree with (showbiz making things worse, technology differences that should be taken into account, etc.) Above all, I did not state in any place that today's drivers are better than yesterday's.

I do believe, though, that we tend to recall just the best moments of the old times, sew them all together in one continuous "Best Moments" clip and then think F1 was like that all the time.

My central thesis (spelling?) is that nowadays talent should not be underestimated. Technological differences are there. Show might be better or worse but drivers talent is there. Sometimes PR obligations and money driven culture ruins these kids (and old farts), but that does not mean that the guys have no passion or no raw passion. The rest was just me being lyrical ("He lied to us through song!" as Homer Simpson would have put it)

See? Going lyrical is a way of cheating.

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

Quiet One and Grabthaw ("Are those real names?" questioned the naive American)

Oh yes, absolutely real name; says so on my birth certificate:

First name: Grabthaw

Middle name: The

Last name: Hammerslayer

Father's occupation: Hammerslayer (family business)

A bit embarassing though when going through customs and people always get the spelling wrong, its Grabthaw, not Grabthar, OK?

I would therefore suggest that we have the boys step outside with duelling Shepard's Pies and turn the matter into a heretofore missing Monty Python episode.

That's Shepherd's pies and anyway, they would be no good for duelling, way too runny. A Pukka Steak and Kidney pie, ah now, that's a different matter.....

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

And here's another guy who is worng!

No I'm the best - oh hang on that one died out ages ago

But you are right I am worn g it has been a hard year lol

I do believe, though, that we tend to recall just the best moments of the old times, sew them all together in one continuous "Best Moments" clip and then think F1 was like that all the time.

Well one of the problems was that in my yoof we tended to see F1 like that. the only TV coverage in uk was 30 minute highlight shows. One good thing Bernie did was to expand this. Maybe this condensed view of the best bits coloured our memory. I think Edna Steph is right though, as the drivers seemed to have more presence and the racing seemed more real. Whether it is a combination of technology, tracks, talent (?) there are less wheel-banging moments it seems these days.....

My central thesis (spelling?) is that nowadays talent should not be underestimated.

Hmmm there is some talent, granted. But in 30 years time will people look back and go ah I remember the days of Kubica and Rosberg????

One other difference is that the good old days you had to work your work up through karting, junior formulas, etc. Whilst this still happens to a degree many young drivers are taken on with very little experience under their belt. Is this a good thing? hmmm

[Quiet One 15]

No I'm the best - oh hang on that one died out ages ago

But you are right I am worn g it has been a hard year lol

Well one of the problems was that in my yoof we tended to see F1 like that. the only TV coverage in uk was 30 minute highlight shows. One good thing Bernie did was to expand this. Maybe this condensed view of the best bits coloured our memory. I think Edna Steph is right though, as the drivers seemed to have more presence and the racing seemed more real. Whether it is a combination of technology, tracks, talent (?) there are less wheel-banging moments it seems these days.....

Hmmm there is some talent, granted. But in 30 years time will people look back and go ah I remember the days of Kubica and Rosberg????

One other difference is that the good old days you had to work your work up through karting, junior formulas, etc. Whilst this still happens to a degree many young drivers are taken on with very little experience under their belt. Is this a good thing? hmmm

Yes, there was more racing. Simpler days...

But I don't think it's the driver's lack of skills what is hurting nowadays F1. Like you say, there are lots of other factors.

And I agree that nowadays they keep grabbing "young talents" and all they do is ruin careers of young ones which my have had a better chance in a couple of years, and ruin the spectacle for us that are forced to watch an Alguersuari trying to tame an F1 car when the kid can barely write his own name (I know I can't)

As for Kubica and Rosberg, why not? We still remember guys like Pironi, Regazzoni, Laffite, Wurz, Frentzen...

[shampion 0]

Yes, there was more racing. Simpler days...

But I don't think it's the driver's lack of skills what is hurting nowadays F1. Like you say, there are lots of other factors.

And I agree that nowadays they keep grabbing "young talents" and all they do is ruin careers of young ones which my have had a better chance in a couple of years, and ruin the spectacle for us that are forced to watch an Alguersuari trying to tame an F1 car when the kid can barely write his own name (I know I can't)

As for Kubica and Rosberg, why not? We still remember guys like Pironi, Regazzoni, Laffite, Wurz, Frentzen...

We do????????

[Kopite Girl 0]

Oh come on!

Give the kids of today a car that men like Jim Clark or Gilles Villeneuve drove and they'd sh1t their pants. Where are the manual gears? The plain round steering wheels? Gone I tell you, gone.

So. My point is whilst F1 strives to get faster, the competition of the drivers gets lessened. Its not about the driver as much now. Most of the teams showcase their ability for technology these days. The driver doesn't really need to do the work as such. Oh yeah, he'll learn the car and its capabilities, but its the car itself that is being showcased and not the driver.

But seriously. Its silly to compare drivers from different decades. Totally new set ups. Totally new sport. I just want a driver who says, 'Ok. My car is bad. F*ck this.' and race his arse off. I haven't seen it yet.

@Chris - exactly. Thank you.

[cavallino 2]

Yes, there was more racing. Simpler days...

But I don't think it's the driver's lack of skills what is hurting nowadays F1. Like you say, there are lots of other factors.

And I agree that nowadays they keep grabbing "young talents" and all they do is ruin careers of young ones which my have had a better chance in a couple of years, and ruin the spectacle for us that are forced to watch an Alguersuari trying to tame an F1 car when the kid can barely write his own name (I know I can't)

As for Kubica and Rosberg, why not? We still remember guys like Pironi, Regazzoni, Laffite, Wurz, Frentzen...

I think I had Regazzoni pasta yesterday, And umm I think George Bush choked over a Frentzen. Never heard of the rest

[Quiet One 15]

Oh come on!

Give the kids of today a car that men like Jim Clark or Gilles Villeneuve drove and they'd sh1t their pants. Where are the manual gears? The plain round steering wheels? Gone I tell you, gone.

So. My point is whilst F1 strives to get faster, the competition of the drivers gets lessened. Its not about the driver as much now. Most of the teams showcase their ability for technology these days. The driver doesn't really need to do the work as such. Oh yeah, he'll learn the car and its capabilities, but its the car itself that is being showcased and not the driver.

But seriously. Its silly to compare drivers from different decades. Totally new set ups. Totally new sport. I just want a driver who says, 'Ok. My car is bad. F*ck this.' and race his arse off. I haven't seen it yet.

@Chris - exactly. Thank you.

So you haven't seen Alonso grabbing a podium in Singapore on a car that would have made a Lada designer cry? Haven't you seen Hamilton crashing at Monza not just because he is just an idiot, thought he is, but because he was pushing when anybody else would have just settled for what he had? Haven't you seen last year's Massa's drive in Brazil?

These guys had their cars changed almost on a daily basis contrary to the old days. Today you have traction control, tomorrow you won't. Grooves, no grooves, big slicks, low fuel, no refuel, KERS...always hoping that, somehow, the field will be levelled out of mere incapacity to keep up with all this messing around. Yet the guys hang in there and keep delivering excellent drivings which, regretfully, make things boring for us spectators.

It would be much more fun if they were clumsy as a De Cesaris, or an Ide. They make lots of amateurish mistakes, of course, but all in all they are not worse at all than the oldies.

Again, I have yet tto remember a season when you could have the likes of Alonso, Schumi, Hamilton and Vettel/Massa (your pick) racing against each other.

This does not mean that the show will be better. But it certainly will be because the drivers are bad.

[cavallino 2]

Errr Alonso and Singapore isn't the best example to bring up

[Kopite Girl 0]

So you haven't seen Alonso grabbing a podium in Singapore on a car that would have made a Lada designer cry? Haven't you seen Hamilton crashing at Monza not just because he is just an idiot, thought he is, but because he was pushing when anybody else would have just settled for what he had? Haven't you seen last year's Massa's drive in Brazil?

These guys had their cars changed almost on a daily basis contrary to the old days. Today you have traction control, tomorrow you won't. Grooves, no grooves, big slicks, low fuel, no refuel, KERS...always hoping that, somehow, the field will be levelled out of mere incapacity to keep up with all this messing around. Yet the guys hang in there and keep delivering excellent drivings which, regretfully, make things boring for us spectators.

It would be much more fun if they were clumsy as a De Cesaris, or an Ide. They make lots of amateurish mistakes, of course, but all in all they are not worse at all than the oldies.

Again, I have yet tto remember a season when you could have the likes of Alonso, Schumi, Hamilton and Vettel/Massa (your pick) racing against each other.

This does not mean that the show will be better. But it certainly will be because the drivers are bad.

Regardless. Alonso and co do nothing but bitch anyway. My point is: GET IN THE F*CKING CAR AND DRIVE IT!

[AleHop 0]

Sorry but you ARE worng. YOu suffer from a very common disease: colour tinted glasses. Bitching was always there. Alon Jones vs Reutemann, Prost vs Senna, Piquet vs Mansell...you name it. The difference? There were no forums and F1 was a much smaller business, that is why it wasn't the showbiz it has become now, it was not because of lack of whinners and moaners, it was because of lack of audience.

Don't say there are no more legends. You will be depriving yourself of the joys of nowadays F1...and in a few years you will look back towards this moment and bang your head against the wall because THESE were the best days. Granted, these are not the best days, but as far as drivers skills and talent, there have rarely been such a collection of hungry, skilfull and talented drivers. Remember that the great ones of the past rarely had the chance to compete against each other at the peak of their careers or in the best cars. A few years of Senna vs Prost made those seasons unforgettable. But at the moment people was also concerned about too much focus on those two and the obscurity of the remainbing drivers. Only with years some of them where barely recognized. Others (most) were completely forgotten.

Nowadays you have Alonso, Hamilton, a quickly maturing Vettel and a probable Schumi among the outstanding. Kubica, Massa, Glock, Rosberg, Button, Webber...a solid line of good drivers who might become great. Young promises like Kobayashi to look forward to. Trulli, Barrichello...the oldies but goldies. Guys like Heidfeld and Kova that...have a cool helmet. Ahem! Anyways, plenty of talent. PR and showbiz sometimes constrict the drivers too much but many of them showed more than once how raw can they be.

Being a fighter is a construction. Just like being a whiner. Kobay blocks Button? He has balls. Hamilton does that? He is a cheater. Alonso does that? What a sore loser! Trulli? He is useless! Kova? Finally he shows he has it! And so on.

Bias aside, many of those drivers can driver better than many of the past legends. Hamilton has nothing to envy from a Villeneuve, except maybe the charisma and the better judgement between being ballsy and being plain stupid. Alonso could be a Prost any day. Better than him when his ego allows him. Kubica could kick Piquet Srs. a## banging wheels all the way to the finish line.

No, talent is not something F1 lacks at the moment.

+1

[AleHop 0]

Nah sorry Andres. That's bollocks.

I don't buy into all this: "modern drivers are better than old ones" nor for that matter the other way around. In the same way that fighter pilots in WWII are not as good as fighter pilots today. Its bulls##t. So what's changed, has the human race evolved in the last 50 years to become more adapted to F1 cars? No.

Fact of the matter is that Hill, Clark, Stewart etc were every bit as good as Hamilton, Alonso, etc. Sure some drivers stank. So some do today. Drivers argued and bitched then and now.

So what's the difference?

1) The technology - you are correct in that put an oldie in a modern F1 car now and he could probably not drive it as fast as a modern driver. Put a modern driver into an older car, they probably could drive it fast. As fast as an oldie driver... hmm dunno. I just think that for the given age, we have seen drivers rise to the surface who can deal with the technology at hand. In the same way that a WWII ace is no better or worse than a modern fighter ace.

2) The technology - no, not a typo. Depth of research, money, time, expertise has developed enormously - in some way positively, in others less so. Given the tight regs now its so much harder for a team to gain a technological advantage. In the 70s/80s, remember when Lotus brought in skirted cars, William active suspension, Renault turbos? Each gave the team a leg-up. Can't happen so easily now and the differences are less. Other teams copy it quicker too - take double diffuser as an example.

The cars are simply too regulated.

3) the technology - again? Well modern cars are hard to pass. This prevents some of the wheel banging, seat of your pants stuff.

4) The money. Root of all evil and all that. Has changed the sport from being something small, close to megabucks.... gone are the days when mechanics from one team would help another. Encourages cheating. Drivers are puffed up to being mega-celebrities. Everything has marketing-spin. Like music, money, marketing and mega-corps have changed the face of it. Doesn't mean that music these days is bad, just the way it is presented, delivered, etc.

5) All the scandals/FIA nonsense. the last few years have been one thing after another. Initially whilst there was some "ooh" I found myself this season, just going "oh for ****'s sake, not another scandal....." F1 needs to clean its act up. FIA needs to sort itself out. All the inconsistencies and personal agendas were just wearing.....

I agree its easy to wear rose-tinted spectacles and I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else. But I lack the passion for F1 I had when I was a kid. Something is missing and putting my finger on it, I would say it was in the transition from F1 being a sport to F1 being a business. Its all a bit too manufactured now.

There was a time when I *had* to watch the qualifying and race - would stay up late. Now I like to watch, but don't get that upset if I don't and frankly find some of the races boring. I've started watching and enjoying MotoGP and Indycar and finding them more enjoyable....

I still watch F1 though, can't help it. But I sometime do wonder why?

+1

Both you and Andr

[lewisthegreat2 0]

A few days ago in F1 (anything to not talk about that guy. I will die laughing if he goes winless. Until we get an off-season of "he should sign for another year, the car let him down, blah blah blah" rubbish and 80 more years of "F1 sucks, Michael should come back!"), Peter Windsor said the US F1 chassis is complete. Here's a picture of it with Nick Craw, their lead driver.

So, Peter, is that really complete? Because I see, oh, I don't know, just a few minor issues.

Seems to me Windsor's defending himself a la Bernie with Bernie saying US F1 (and Campos) won't make it...just like Bernie once made up some random fun fact that all his friends are Jews to somehow become an okay guy, Windsor has "3,000,000 chassis complete Danica Patrick and we're going to move to a new purpose-built base Skunkworks that will be purpose-built for our team and our fans Marco Andretti and we're going to win every race Dan Gurney and Ken Anderson is an F1 legend Skunkworks and we're gong to confirm Jos

[AleHop 0]

A few days ago in F1 (anything to not talk about that guy. I will die laughing if he goes winless. Until we get an off-season of "he should sign for another year, the car let him down, blah blah blah" rubbish and 80 more years of "F1 sucks, Michael should come back!"), Peter Windsor said the US F1 chassis is complete. Here's a picture of it with Nick Craw, their lead driver.

So, Peter, is that really complete? Because I see, oh, I don't know, just a few minor issues.

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

Is that a 2008 spec rear... oh......

[Schumikonen 2]

Now wait a minute...!

And Kimi is not missing...he is lost

I thought you wouldn't notice the difference.

[lewisthegreat2 0]

Is that a 2008 spec rear... oh......

Well, some people were discussing how the drivers of old were sooooo much better and that Little Lewis would poo himself in one of their cars, so I guess whoever gets to drive for US F1 next year will know what a 1965-spec rear wing feels like...

[Schumikonen 2]

So you haven't seen Alonso grabbing a podium in Singapore on a car that would have made a Lada designer cry? Haven't you seen Hamilton crashing at Monza not just because he is just an idiot, thought he is, but because he was pushing when anybody else would have just settled for what he had? Haven't you seen last year's Massa's drive in Brazil?

These guys had their cars changed almost on a daily basis contrary to the old days. Today you have traction control, tomorrow you won't. Grooves, no grooves, big slicks, low fuel, no refuel, KERS...always hoping that, somehow, the field will be levelled out of mere incapacity to keep up with all this messing around. Yet the guys hang in there and keep delivering excellent drivings which, regretfully, make things boring for us spectators.

It would be much more fun if they were clumsy as a De Cesaris, or an Ide. They make lots of amateurish mistakes, of course, but all in all they are not worse at all than the oldies.

Again, I have yet tto remember a season when you could have the likes of Alonso, Schumi, Hamilton and Vettel/Massa (your pick) racing against each other.

This does not mean that the show will be better. But it certainly will be because the drivers are bad.

I think thecnlogy has leveled the field in F1 and now more than ever drivers are a big diference, if we go back in time we will find that cars were not as similar as the are today for example you can find car with 6-8 tires a car completely different from the rest but today cars are very similars and they will get even more similar if we get a set of rule that last for a couple of years and then we all see how much effect a driver have on car.

[Quiet One 15]

I think thecnlogy has leveled the field in F1 and now more than ever drivers are a big diference, if we go back in time we will find that cars were not as similar as the are today for example you can find car with 6-8 tires a car completely different from the rest but today cars are very similars and they will get even more similar if we get a set of rule that last for a couple of years and then we all see how much effect a driver have on car.

Yup. And nope.

Yes, the field is much more leveled now. Differences between 1st and 14th now are the same as 1st and 2nd in the old days. On the other hand, cars are both completely impossible to overtake and those tiny differences are even more impossible to surpass. If your car is 1/10th slower, you have no means of developing it besides some minor adjustements here and there that you can't test anyways...so it's all a big game of Lotto. Today the FIs are better, tomorrow the Maccas kick a##, yesterday the Honduhs were impossible to get. Drivers are important, but they are still powerless against the KERS vs no KERS differences, the double diffuser or a car that just is not good enough at qualy or is not stable enough.

Technology is still what makes the difference more than the driver. That said, it is true that drivers skills and vices were easier to spot on last years' cars.