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Teams & Drivers 2010

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A bit more realistic.

Brawn: Nico?? I guess he might be exchanged for Rubens

McLaren: Sutil??

Williams: pretty accurate, Hulkenberg deserves a Williams seat

Toyota: perfect

Ferrari: spot on

Renault: spot on

RBR: spot on

STR: probably will be but I don't think Alguersuari deserves a seat

Lotus: Trulli??

Sauber: Naka?? I think he might go back to Japan & race in Super GT.

Force India: Gary flippin Paffett??????????

Virgin/Manor: Anthony friggin Davidson??? Would like to see a Mick in F1 again

Sutil is Hamilton's big mate and I can tell you he is pushing for him. He doesn't want Rosberg or KImi and he will get his way. Rubens is a done deal at Williams and BGP need someone who can set a car up. Paffett was talked about when the FI tie up with McLaren was brokered and it's under discussion again. Ant is very good on development, quick and cheap!

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Are they behind in funding? As the last I heard, Brawn had signed a contract with a big-money company for 2010, thus meaning they would be safe in the future.

The money they will recieve from winning the championship (

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With a more-or-less stable technical rules package and continued limited testing, I would expect the teams with sharp aero guys who can design a piece for the car and have it work straight away to be on top. A lot is being said in the articles I'm reading about how the teams with all the advanced simulator equipment will be at the top, but I would remind everyone that BMW have some of the most advanced gear around...and they did squat with it.

I would guess McLaren and Red Bull to be a the sharp-end of the grid next season with Force India right behind (I'm basing this off of their good luck at rapidly designing a car update and it running well straight away). Brawn is not the place to be unless you want to fight for 4th place (as Steve has pointed out, their advantage is gone).

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Sutil is Hamilton's big mate and I can tell you he is pushing for him. He doesn't want Rosberg or KImi and he will get his way. Rubens is a done deal at Williams and BGP need someone who can set a car up. Paffett was talked about when the FI tie up with McLaren was brokered and it's under discussion again. Ant is very good on development, quick and cheap!

I don't think Hamilton has too much say in who Mclaren sign. If he did, Mclaren would in fact keep Heikki in the team! As it stands, Mclaren want the two best drivers available; I don't think Sutil qualifies as one of the best drivers available by a long way (sure, he's quick at times, but he's not as proven as Trulli, Glock, Button, Raikkonen et al). Certainly it would be an odd decision if Mclaren signed Sutil (who never looked anywhere near as strong as Lewis in their former experience as team mates) in replacement of Kova (who never looked anywhere near as strong as Lewis in their experience as team mates). There would be no point in doing that - not even a monetary one. The reason Mclaren are dumping Heikki (if indeed they do) is because they want a better driver in the car, it is just a bonus whether the new driver gets on with Lewis or not.

Rosberg goes to Brawn because he doesn't want to get beaten by his good friend Hamilton, and because Mercedes and Ross Brawn are partial to a fast German - I don't think that decision has anything to do with LH & co. Similarly, I think the only stumbling block for hiring Kimi is a matter of payment, not some veto by Lewis. If Lewis could handle Alonso in his first year, I think he can handle anyone in his fourth year, and while he would prefer a weaker team mate (who wouldn't?), I doubt it's a big issue.

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Sutil is Hamilton's big mate and I can tell you he is pushing for him. He doesn't want Rosberg or KImi and he will get his way. Rubens is a done deal at Williams and BGP need someone who can set a car up. Paffett was talked about when the FI tie up with McLaren was brokered and it's under discussion again. Ant is very good on development, quick and cheap!

What about Heidfeld? He's German, he's fast and he finishes races, which isn't always the case for Sutil. Sutil has a lot to prove in my mind yet before he deserves a top seat. His season in 2009 hasn't exactly been brilliant.

Edited by JHS

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What about Heidfeld? He's German, he's fast and he finishes races, which isn't always the case for Sutil. Sutil has a lot to prove in my mind yet before he deserves a top seat. His season in 2009 hasn't exactly been brilliant.

You could teach Adrian not to crash. You will never teach Nick how to go fast.

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You could teach Adrian not to crash. You will never teach Nick how to go fast.

Ouch.

Could anyboidy teach Sutil not to prance like a maiden in distress?

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I don't think Hamilton has too much say in who Mclaren sign. If he did, Mclaren would in fact keep Heikki in the team! As it stands, Mclaren want the two best drivers available; I don't think Sutil qualifies as one of the best drivers available by a long way (sure, he's quick at times, but he's not as proven as Trulli, Glock, Button, Raikkonen et al). Certainly it would be an odd decision if Mclaren signed Sutil (who never looked anywhere near as strong as Lewis in their former experience as team mates) in replacement of Kova (who never looked anywhere near as strong as Lewis in their experience as team mates). There would be no point in doing that - not even a monetary one. The reason Mclaren are dumping Heikki (if indeed they do) is because they want a better driver in the car, it is just a bonus whether the new driver gets on with Lewis or not.

Rosberg goes to Brawn because he doesn't want to get beaten by his good friend Hamilton, and because Mercedes and Ross Brawn are partial to a fast German - I don't think that decision has anything to do with LH & co. Similarly, I think the only stumbling block for hiring Kimi is a matter of payment, not some veto by Lewis. If Lewis could handle Alonso in his first year, I think he can handle anyone in his fourth year, and while he would prefer a weaker team mate (who wouldn't?), I doubt it's a big issue.

I personally don't give a monkeys who Macca sign. I've based all my listings on rumour, conjecture and paddock gossip as it shifts daily. I agree with Mike - Heidfeld would be my choice - he's reliable. quick and virtually anonymous.

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Ouch.

Could anyboidy teach Sutil not to prance like a maiden in distress?

:D I can't wait for that boyt to take the centre step on the podium. We have had the 'Schumi leap', how about the 'Suti mince'?

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Wednesday is upon us and a couple of things came past my ears last evening. Rumours abound that AABAR, an Abu Dhabi, state-owned corporation will act as proxy stakeholder of 75% of BGP, on behalf of Diamler AG until the Mercedes/McLaren tie-up expires in 2011. My understanding is that this is rock solid info and that senior Daimler managers will be meeting with both Ross Brawn and AABAR reps in Abu Dhabie this weekend. I believe Haug will push for a German in the second seat at Macca and I'm going to choose Heidfeld over Glock and Sutil. There could be some more fine tuning with Rosberg taking the McLaren seat and Heidfeld going to Brawn - after all, anything is possible.

Mercedes Brawn | Button/Rosberg

Team McLaren | Hamilton/Heidfeld

Williams Cosworth | Barrichello/Hulkenberg

Team Toyota | Glock/Kobayashi

Scuderia Ferrari | Massa/Alonso

Megafon Renault | Kubica/Kovalainen

Red Bull Renault | Vettel/Webber

STR Ferrari | Buemi/Alguersuera

Lotus Cosworth | Trulli/Fauzy

Qadbak Sauber Ferrari | R

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biggrin.gif I can't wait for that boyt to take the centre step on the podium. We have had the 'Schumi leap', how about the 'Suti mince'?

Sutil mince.... you know, I bought some of that from my local supermarket. Made a meal with it - cooked it with a dash of rosewater, a few pink marshmallows and some marigold petals. :)

Funny thing is, after eating it I got this strange craving to watch Annie, listen to Barbra Streisand and eat bratwurst.... eusa_think.gif

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OK, I have a soft spot for them I'll admit. Lot's of talk about Brawn not being the place to be next year, and honestly, I'm curious to see how the wind blows with them.

I mentioned last winter when they were on their arse, that one of my customers is a guy that's one of their suppliers, and his thoughts from comments he's heard make a great deal of sense.... And yes, 'sources' are bloody annoying, but he's the only one I've got :P

Comments about Brawn tend to centre around how much effort went into this year's car, "a year head start, no wonder they're so good" etc. It was nothing like as simple as that.

Their base line was so poor, and their calibration systems (not just tunnel, jigs they use too) were so fcuked up, that the first 5 months were spent catching up and simulating to a (theoretical) level that would have seen them (theoretically) well up the grid in '08. They achieved these levels with virtually no testing to confirm calibrations - they got it right without thousands of kilometers of testing.

Only at this point could they start on the '09 choice of direction - they had 3 main routes to follow, 2 for a KERS car and one for a conventional car. When Honda pulled the plug, they chose to run with the conventional car (fro obvious reasons). My point here is that they didn't have the advantage some might imagine, if say, they had the McLaren as a baseline, then spent a year developing it, I'd agree with the "but they had a coons age to get it right" gang.

Then along came the engine problem... The Merc lump was supplied, and then they found the first problem - 15mm would have to be removed from the back of the tub. The weight distribution was massively affected, the c of g was badly affected, the gearbox is set to work slower than it's built for (which we've seen problems with anyway),they were severely hampered with their choices of where ballast could go.... so, this car is an almighty c#ck-up in F1 engineering terms.

Because of all of that, and the fact that next year's car is so well advanced (a huge amount of their budget has gone into this since July), I think you're all wrong about next year :P BUT............

........Then we have the budget problem that's been mentioned here. And I really know nothing other than the guys at the factory are chipper about what they have been told (means nothing with sh1t management I know), but one thing has set the place on fire, and zat's ze meetinks at ze factory mit men in suitz, zat only arrive in Mercs und tork vunny.

Just one fly in the ointment stops me making predictions just now, and that is that Ross is as tight as a duck's arse with money, and it seems some of the rumours re unhappy techy bunnies could be true. IF they can sort that problem, I'm going for a top three in 2010, both WCC and WDC.

Edited by medilloni

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OK, I have a soft spot for them I'll admit. Lot's of talk about Brawn not being the place to be next year, and honestly, I'm curious to see how the wind blows with them.

I mentioned last winter when they were on their arse, that one of my customers is a guy that's one of their suppliers, and his thoughts from comments he's heard make a great deal of sense.... And yes, 'sources' are bloody annoying, but he's the only one I've got :P

Comments about Brawn tend to centre around how much effort went into this year's car, "a year head start, no wonder they're so good" etc. It was nothing like as simple as that.

Their base line was so poor, and their calibration systems (not just tunnel, jigs they use too) were so fcuked up, that the first 5 months were spent catching up and simulating to a (theoretical) level that would have seen them (theoretically) well up the grid in '08. They achieved these levels with virtually no testing to confirm calibrations - they got it right without thousands of kilometers of testing.

Only at this point could they start on the '09 choice of direction - they had 3 main routes to follow, 2 for a KERS car and one for a conventional car. When Honda pulled the plug, they chose to run with the conventional car (fro obvious reasons). My point here is that they didn't have the advantage some might imagine, if say, they had the McLaren as a baseline, then spent a year developing it, I'd agree with the "but they had a coons age to get it right" gang.

Then along came the engine problem... The Merc lump was supplied, and then they found the first problem - 15mm would have to be removed from the back of the tub. The weight distribution was massively affected, the c of g was badly affected, the gearbox is set to work slower than it's built for (which we've seen problems with anyway),they were severely hampered with their choices of where ballast could go.... so, this car is an almighty c#ck-up in F1 engineering terms.

Because of all of that, and the fact that next year's car is so well advanced (a huge amount of their budget has gone into this since July), I think you're all wrong about next year :P BUT............

........Then we have the budget problem that's been mentioned here. And I really know nothing other than the guys at the factory are chipper about what they have been told (means nothing with sh1t management I know), but one thing has set the place on fire, and zat's ze meetinks at ze factory mit men in suitz, zat only arrive in Mercs und tork vunny.

Just one fly in the ointment stops me making predictions just now, and that is that Ross is as tight as a duck's arse with money, and it seems some of the rumours re unhappy techy bunnies could be true. IF they can sort that problem, I'm going for a top three in 2010, both WCC and WDC.

All very interesting. To be honest though, even I, as one of the doomsayers would have a punt on a top three. Surely, if faith is had in Brawn's depth of ability and it's potential coffers, you should be putting money on a repeat of this year?

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Sutil mince.... you know, I bought some of that from my local supermarket. Made a meal with it - cooked it with a dash of rosewater, a few pink marshmallows and some marigold petals. :)

Funny thing is, after eating it I got this strange craving to watch Annie, listen to Barbra Streisand and eat bratwurst.... eusa_think.gif

Go, girlfriend.

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I like your pairings and I'll throw my thoughts into it.

Mercedes Brawn | Button/Rosberg

Assuming the car will be inherently the same as this year, it will need a bit of smooth driving in the hot races and a bit of aggression in the cold ones. Button has shown an inability to drive aggressive enough in the cold races and has suffered. By contrast, Rosberg is a bit like Rubens only moreso; he's aggressive. Rosberg will be strong in the cold but can he be smooth in the hot? That's the question. If the answer is yes, then I see Button being beaten by Rosberg.

As for Brawn, the rules stability will help them but their sometimes good, sometimes bad aero department will be their Achilles Heel.

Team McLaren | Hamilton/Heidfeld

I hope this pairing will prove true. I like Heidfeld at McLaren. Unlike most, I rate Ickle-Nicky pretty highly. He's fast, consistent and has a good work ethic. He'll surprise Hamilton on a few occasions and will be closer to the boy-god than Hickie was.

In my opinion, McLaren are the strongest team currently out there. They have proven that they can bounce back from technical foibles pretty quickly without any real testing and aren't really failing in any one area of their car. They'll not stumble over having to redesign their car around the missing KERS.

Williams Cosworth | Barrichello/Hulkenberg

Oh dear.

Team Toyota | Glock/Kobayashi

So Trulli is truly gone from Toyota? Unfortunate. He sucked in races, but he gave a good one-lap baseline for the car's speed and was moderately consistent. Without him, this is a weak pairing. Not enough experience. As a result, the team may be left chasing figments of their driver's lack-of-imaginations.

Scuderia Ferrari | Massa/Alonso

Massa fires off a shot at Alonso concerning his involvement in the Renault race fixing extravaganza. This is telling. Massa is getting his first shot in, hoping to destabilize Alonso early. This quite frankly won't work. Alonso is faster, more confident, more experienced.....just more than Massa in just about every area (and no doubt Massa knows it). If Ferrari listen to the two-times World Champion on car set-up, they'll move up the grid.

Megafon Renault | Kubica/Kovalainen

Hickie will be struggling with the car. It's likely been designed around Alonso and he likes an understeery car with a goodly amount of rear weight distribution. Kubica, on the other hand, will love it. He drives more like Alonso than any of the other drivers out there.

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Red Bull Renault | Vettel/Webber

With his leg fully-healed, I'll go out on a ...er.... limb and say Webber will overshadow Vettel.

In on-track penalties.

STR Ferrari | Buemi/Alguersuera

Why is this team still here? If it were a true small team, I'd be cheering. I'll not cheer for a Red Bull Driver Development Team. STR belong in a lower formula.

Lotus Cosworth | Trulli/Fauzy

I have no idea, but starting a team with Trulli will reap benefits if the team are paying attention. As I've said before, he's a good indicator of where a car is at, on a single lap basis.

Qadbak Sauber Ferrari | R

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All very interesting. To be honest though, even I, as one of the doomsayers would have a punt on a top three. Surely, if faith is had in Brawn's depth of ability and it's potential coffers, you should be putting money on a repeat of this year?

No Steve, my two bets on Brawn were half-laugh-half-once-every-ten-years-treat (really, I never bet!), any more... and where do you stop? Mrs Meds thinks I'm a friggin genius with the dosh from this year, she says the same as you, but F1 is too effing corrupt unpredictable to bet too often :D

Seriously, one of the main reasons I don't think they will slip into the midfield (longterm) is simply because Brawn has only ever known success, and will do whatever it takes to get out of it, he's Schumi-esque in his hunt for success - Williams could do to take some lessons from him.

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For the massive 0 people who might care, here's my list:

Ferrari

Massa and Alonso

McLaren

Hamilton and Heidfeld

Renault

Kubica and Kovalainen

Toyota

Raikkonen and Glock

Red Bull

Vettel and Webber

Williams

Barrichello and Hulkenberg

Brawn

Button and Rosberg

Toro Rosso

Buemi and Alguersuari

Force India

Sutil and Liuzzi

Lotus

Trulli and Fauzy

Campos

Di Grassi and Senna

Manor

Parente and Jani

US F1

I really have no idea......so Summerton and Busch?

Qadbak Sauber

Won't even happen probably, so Nakajima and Piquet.

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US F1

I really have no idea......so Summerton and Busch?

Just for the record, there is absolutely 0 chance of Busch racing for US F1 in 2010. The team would like to do a test or two with him, but have no interest in him actually racing until 2011 at earliest, and Busch has no interest in them period.

And they aren't even real.

Wurz has given up on them, stating that he doesn't think they'll make it, and all of their employees (including the team manager) are on monthly contracts to ease the laying off process when they release all 60 employees when the team doesn't happen.

On the off chance they somehow stumble onto the grid, they'll probably do so with zero US American drivers, the way it should have been all along. It's confirmed they need a pay driver (and a race shop and a car and a team and a budget), so expect Roldán Rodríguez or Nelson to be paired with another pay driver like Rodríguez or Piquet.

Or just expect US F1 to submit the wind tunnel model they won't complete in time for the Bahrain Grand Prix as the IndyCar chassis of the future, and get rejected because the IRL's folding anyway, and they'll all fold together and go to NASCAR. Team US SC (stock car), coming to a merry-go-round near you. Or something.

Edited by lewisthegreat2

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I'm feeling increasingly confident about my predictions, so I think it's time to unveil them.

McLaren - Roe/Wade

Ferrari - Cosmo/Dibbs

Red Bull - Bert/Ernie

Toro Rosso - Brad/Angelina

Williams - Ike/Tina

Renault - Hale/Pace

Brawn - Chas/Dave

Toyota - Laurel/Hardy

Force India - Daniels/Baker

BMW Sauber - Tom/Jerry

Lotus - Morecambe/Wise

Campos - Sonny/Cher

Manor - Fry/Laurie

US F1 - Abbot/Costello

EDIT - swapped the McLaren and USF1 drivers over - if there are going to be fireworks anywhere it'll be in the McLaren garage.

Edited by adamstrags

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I'm feeling increasingly confident about my predictions, so I think it's time to unveil them.

:D Only thing that worries me is that 8 of your drivers are dead, passed away, stiffs, bereft of life, joined the choir invisible, etc....

Does this imply some form of cheating (remote control?) or have you discovered a means of re-animation? :)

Zombie-F1!

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:D Only thing that worries me is that 8 of your drivers are dead, passed away, stiffs, bereft of life, joined the choir invisible, etc....

Does this imply some form of cheating (remote control?) or have you discovered a means of re-animation? :)

Zombie-F1!

have you not seen what they can do with cgi these days?

EDIT - hmmm - now you mention it... 6 of my drivers are either animated characters or puppets too - might need a rethink.

Edited by adamstrags

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okay okay - revised driver line up thanks to mr pedantic-aenioni-face (removing wholey or half dead pairings and animated characters or puppets)

McLaren - Roe/Wade Cheech/Chong

Ferrari - Cosmo/Dibbs Madonna/Ritchie

Red Bull - Bert/Ernie Ant/Dec

Toro Rosso - Brad/Angelina

Williams - Ike/Tina Penn/Teller

Renault - Hale/Pace

Brawn - Chas/Dave

Toyota - Laurel/Hardy Vera/Jack

Force India - Daniels/Baker

BMW Sauber - Tom/Jerry Kylie/Jason

Lotus - Morecambe/Wise Daphne/Celeste

Campos - Sonny/Cher Putin/Medvedev

Manor - Fry/Laurie

US F1 - Abbot/Costello Tucker/Zammo

Okay - that's it now - final 100% definite, unquestionably correct lineup for 2010 - anyone who disagrees is an idiot.

Edited by adamstrags

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