Schumikonen

The Official Chinese Grand Prix

419 posts in this topic

That's the point and no other. thbup.gif

Let every driver race as he pleases and we might have a few ballsy moves every race everywhere.

Is this F1 or demolition derby?

Tommy, I'm refering to what Bernie says as "isn't this sport all about racing" comment.

Edited by JHS

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Is this F1 or demolition derby?

Tommy, I'm refering to what Bernie says as "isn't this sport all about racing" comment.

I thought that but it is like Steph said, if they give too many penalty people will complain and if they don't then people will complain too, this is F1 but there have to be a tolerance margin in everything, had they penalized every "mistake" then probably Rosberg would have been the winner but even the press will be talking about how many penlaties were given in the race.

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if you have another cable provider then I won't be able to help you with that as that's the only cable provider I have ever had in USA.

Ah, I have DirecTV, not Comcast.

SPEED HD is really only availabe on DIRECTV (SPEED and DIRECTV are owned by News Corp) in all markets. Comcast and Dish Network are hit or miss, and I have no clue if it's available on any others.

That's good info! Now I need to take a peek and see what I missed. Hopefully the next race will be in HD for me! :D

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I thought that but it is like Steph said, if they give too many penalty people will complain and if they don't then people will complain too, this is F1 but there have to be a tolerance margin in everything, had they penalized every "mistake" then probably Rosberg would have been the winner but even the press will be talking about how many penlaties were given in the race.

Fair point, but when a driver breaks a rule on the track or in the pitlane, it's normally pretty obvious. As I said in a previous post, you can't have a set of rules for one driver, and another set for 23 others.

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Fair point, but when a driver breaks a rule on the track or in the pitlane, it's normally pretty obvious. As I said in a previous post, you can't have a set of rules for one driver, and another set for 23 others.

yes it must be the same for everybody.

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Some of the drivers should have been penalized. And the second safety car was NASCAR style B* witch cost Rosberg and Kubica.

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I am not sure what point are you refering to right now but if it is about the waving, they are only allow to one direction change but yesterday Rosberg made two directions changes on lap 36 while Hamilton was trying to pass him, Speed commentators talked about but noone else seems to have noticed that, HAmilton could have won the race had he made that pass one Rosberg at that point, but we can not prejudge the result but certanly Rosberg made more than one move on that lap to prevent Hamilton's pass.

:lol: problem is that some of these guys talk out of the asses..you see, when their favourite drivers are getting beaten they start so much bitching and whining...and some of them are also p**sed of that their favourite drivers are not in racing anymore....

some of the would even claim to support no drivers or teams at all, but they are so biased...and they wouldn't admit it..

A certain guy here would vote Alonso DOD even if he stops in the middle of the race and poops in the car, because he had the courage to do it....thats the kind of guys you are dealing with...atleast you, Tommy have the balls to admit you are biased...but they don't...

if their favourite driver had won the last race, I am sure there would have been less bitching in this thread...but funny to see these babies cry and yet get no milk.....poor poor babies....they need to be cuddled....:(

Edited by Jean Todt

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Bernie is correct. My guess as to why the other drivers moan so much about Lewis' driving? Well, I agree with Martin Brundle, it's because he's faster than most of them. Also, the fact he's put so many moves on almost every driver out there. That's the main reason they don't like him, I imagine.

:thbup:

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Bernie is correct. My guess as to why the other drivers moan so much about Lewis' driving? Well, I agree with Martin Brundle, it's because he's faster than most of them. Also, the fact he's put so many moves on almost every driver out there. That's the main reason they don't like him, I imagine.

With so much going on I am not sure who I should reply to first and, frankly, some views are so strongly biased it is impossible. So, I randomly picked one guy to reply to and...surprise, surprise.. it was you, George! :D

I don't agree with you here, but you are one of the few intelligent enough with whom i can agree to disagree so, you are worth the disagreement.-

Faster than most of them is Alonso, which reduced a 70 seconds margin from the lead to a 4th position in just some laps. The SC helped? Take it out of the equation, he was still...what? 8th by the time? 12th? Doesn't matter. Yes, yes...he is an ogre. He pushed Massa out of the way which is in some paralell Lewis-centric universe so much worse than pushing out Vettel, then being released from the pits alongside Vettel (which is as forbidden as a jump start) and let Vettel be blamed for pushing a guy THAT SHOULDNT BE THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE towards the pits because "it's dangerous"(????). anyways, back to Alonso...he also is arrogant and has an ugly face.

Button: Button was faster than anyone else. Somehow. And brake tested the whole field. Not a nice thing to do.

Petrov: he is a rookie. He is there only because he brought loads of money. And yet he is going around overtaking cars? Are you kidding me? Go back to Moscow, you georgeless communist!

Vettel: He is an infant for George's sake! Go back to the kindergarten! Worst of all, you are making Webbo look incompetent and he is everybody's friend. He even calls us Formula One driveridoos!

Yet...nobody (or at least, few of their fellow drivers) hates them. Why? Because even the evil Alonso (the only among these guys that has a "dark" personality") reaches the level of bullying Lewis has and yet gets away with it. The "he is a figting driver, that's what everybody wanted isn't it" is wrong. Hard fighting is great, but is not a black and white situation. The battle with Vettel in the pits was not something I like. It was dirty, it was coward. It's like punching someone below the belt. I agreed with the jump start penalty for Alonso even though I am against th penalty fests. Some limits are ok. As few as possible, but still I don't wanna see a guy bring a bazooka and just kill everybody else at hte starting grid. Last race's weaving was also rather tasteless, if still on the edge of legality. Much like Alonso's pass on Massa was tasteless, even if legitimate it seems.

The difference? Alonso (and I am picking him as an example here NOT BECAUSE I AM A FAN OF HIM, BUT BECAUSE HE IS THE SECOND DIRTIEST DRIVER IN THIS RACE) has his "moments" but they are few and far between. Lewis goes from one to another. Don't ask me...everybody thinks he is an accident waiting to happen. Button's move under the SC was also tasteless but nobody thinks as lowly of him as they think of Lewis.

Did Lewis deserve a penalty for any single one of his actions? Tough call. The unsafe release is a simple rule: you release the car when another car is within certain radius, that's an unsafe release. Just like "you start before the lights go out" it is a jump start, doesn't matter if it was imperceptible as Alonso's jump start was. Again, the difference? Almost nobody respects the unsafe release radius, otherwise the pitstop frenzy would take hours to clear up when they all dive at the same minute. But this was not the case, there were two cars only, and the intention was pretty obvious. There wasn't too much to discuss. Let's say you want to be lenient on this one. And lenient on Alonso vs Massa, and lenient on Button under the SC...when you will stop? The only other option is a Nazi-Mosley like draconian legislation? Not necessarily.

IMHO: Lewis should have been penalized but the reason I think he should I am not sure even exists in the sporting regulations: what in football is known as reiterated minor infractions (I don't know how to call it in English) which basically means "Ok, none of the fouls you committed were murderous, but we are all fed up with your abuse and so you get a penalty so if you wanna keep being a bully this is the limit". If there is no such thing then maybe the warnings they give to Lewis should be more specific: you do another "grey area" move and we will interpret it the worst possible way. You can be a brilliant sportsman without having to act like an a##.

We were talking about Borg on the other thread. Choose federer if you like. Both brilliant, both gentlemen. McEnroe was a dirty SOB, Lendl was the same. Lendl was despised by everybody despite his undeniable talent. McEnroe got onto everybody's nerves but never was quite as hated as Lendl. If you can understand why (and no, it wasn't because one was Czech and the other was American) then you will understand why few people outside Uk really respects Lewis, despite his enormous talent.(I am even willing to admit that he is the most brilliant driver on the track nowadays, even if has just the tiniest of margins above Alonso)

NOTA BENE: Before any of the less gifted members will reply with some single line derisive comment. Read this carefully, and at least try to respect the effort taken to be as objective as possible within the limits of my own admitted bias (something many people doesn't admit) THEN you might reply and I will try to understand your point of view and make appropiate comments. Otherwise, you will be told to STFU even if that gets me a warning or a banning. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

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Yet...nobody (or at least, few of their fellow drivers) hates them. Why? Because even the evil Alonso (the only among these guys that has a "dark" personality") reaches the level of bullying Lewis has and yet gets away with it. The "he is a figting driver, that's what everybody wanted isn't it" is wrong. Hard fighting is great, but is not a black and white situation. The battle with Vettel in the pits was not something I like. It was dirty, it was coward. It's like punching someone below the belt. I agreed with the jump start penalty for Alonso even though I am against th penalty fests. Some limits are ok. As few as possible, but still I don't wanna see a guy bring a bazooka and just kill everybody else at hte starting grid. Last race's weaving was also rather tasteless, if still on the edge of legality. Much like Alonso's pass on Massa was tasteless, even if legitimate it seems.

If Hamilton did that, he would get a warning and the incident will be punishable next race onwards. laugh.gif

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This place does my f*cking fractured nut in sometimes.

Andres. There's a reason why Alonso is a champion. Its because he's willing to do what others are not to get that championship. That sets him apart in a different class.

The same is said for Hamilton. He works on the same mentality. He's a champion, yes?

The first time I saw Button actually act like a champion was on Sunday, backing those cars up. He's shown he has that same mentality. You moan about him being too nice (and I'm not just talking to you here Andres) and when he does something thats not so gentlemanly, there's ructions. Well f*cking stuff that. Its laughable.

I commend Button for doing what he did, because he's not such a nice guy. Good for him. Go get that championship Jens.

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I think is "funny" how people are calling for LH to be penalized for this mistake that is was not his mistake, he is not the one who take the decision on when to be released from ther pits, that's the team's job, if a penalty should have been given it was to the team, not the driver yet everybody is still hunting Lewis down, why is that? because some fans just wanted their drivers to finish up higher in the race and in order to see that they need a penalty, I don't see any comment from them saying the points shoud be taken away from the team or something like that, no, they want LH to be penalized, well, I'll go with Kaliman in this one, he says "is better to forgive a guilty person than to punish an innocent"

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Indeed.

Who's next, Tommy? Thanks again for your insight and brilliant report! I enjoyed this race the most so far.

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This place does my f*cking fractured nut in sometimes.

Andres. There's a reason why Alonso is a champion. Its because he's willing to do what others are not to get that championship. That sets him apart in a different class.

The same is said for Hamilton. He works on the same mentality. He's a champion, yes?

The first time I saw Button actually act like a champion was on Sunday, backing those cars up. He's shown he has that same mentality. You moan about him being too nice (and I'm not just talking to you here Andres) and when he does something thats not so gentlemanly, there's ructions. Well f*cking stuff that. Its laughable.

I commend Button for doing what he did, because he's not such a nice guy. Good for him. Go get that championship Jens.

Look, you are not going to intimidate me just because you are half human, half metal! :P

My point is that you can drive with an attitude, with passion and giving everything you can WITHOUT having to be a dumb missile roaming around a track. There are nuances. Fierce is not the same as being a psychopath killer, right? Well, the best half of Lewis fierceness is the one where he overtakes lots of cars even when sometimes he has to get almost to the point of touching. If he had just overtaken Vettel and Webber the way he did, without all the other things, I would have praised him for showing the RBRs that they were showing too much respect.

Lewis overtook Schumi with all kind of precautions (needless ones, we later realized) yet it was a beautiful pass and a beautiful battle.

As for Button brake testing the whole field, Alonso pushing a wounded Massa on the grass and Lewis doing whatever he does every farking race, where's the beauty about that? They can all be better than that.

Bernie has just enforced the idiotic side of F1 with his comments. Now it is the macho thing to accept "winning at all costs". Now will come the vindications for MSC old antics, for Senna/Prost pushing each other out, etc. **** Bernie and his ignorance of what is true sport. I want a strong fight, but clean. I admire Senna despite him punting Prost off the track, not because of that. Sometimes drivers battling wheel to wheel is great. Last year's Trulli vs Glock, for example. But they both were at tthe same level. Make a rule clarification allowing EVERYBODY to perform unssafe releases, to push drivers on the grass etc. and you will see Kovalainen being a Lewis.

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Indeed.

Who's next, Tommy? Thanks again for your insight and brilliant report! I enjoyed this race the most so far.

Thanks Steph

I'll let this open, so the person who want to report the next race may come forward and put himself or herself in th line of fire,(that's will let me release all my bias again) so is anyone is interested in the next report just have to post it here, the first to do it will be the winner, now let's wait and see who that one will be :P

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Fierce is not the same as being a psychopath killer, right?

Not that I'm agreeing or disagreeing with anything you've said but...

If it is a situation of Fierce vs Psychopathic Killer - which one's going to win?

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And excellent reporting Tommy!

Thanks for the updates and proffessional objectivity - I know it was hard ;)

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Not that I'm agreeing or disagreeing with anything you've said but...

If it is a situation of Fierce vs Psychopathic Killer - which one's going to win?

Well, let's say that Fierce is Dirty Harry and Hannibal Lecter as the Psychopatic Killer (which would be funny, because Dirty harry is a psycopathic killer himself but anyways).

It will all go down to which one will get the "fireballs shot from the eyes" superpower first.

I hope that helps.

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And excellent reporting Tommy!

Thanks for the updates and proffessional objectivity - I know it was hard ;)

Thanks Adams, yes it was hard even more than what I thought.

EDIT:I am willing to keep doing this for money so if you know about any channel/program that needs a commentator just let me know, I am even willing to say that Alonso hace nicer eyebrown now. :naughty:

Well, let's say that Fierce is Dirty Harry and Hannibal Lecter as the Psychopatic Killer (which would be funny, because Dirty harry is a psycopathic killer himself but anyways).

It will all go down to which one will get the "fireballs shot from the eyes" superpower first.

I hope that helps.

:P I was thinking that when I read his name I even have to read it twice to make sure I was getting the right idea.

Edited by Tommy

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Well, let's say that Fierce is Dirty Harry and Hannibal Lecter as the Psychopatic Killer (which would be funny, because Dirty harry is a psycopathic killer himself but anyways).

It will all go down to which one will get the "fireballs shot from the eyes" superpower first.

I hope that helps.

I see a problem here...

Eyebrows don't mix with that special move.

Edited by adamstrags

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I see a problem here...

Eyebrows don't mix with that special move.

An astute observation. Or should that be hirsute :eusa_think:

Edited by pabloh20

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Some of the drivers should have been penalized. And the second safety car was NASCAR style B* witch cost Rosberg and Kubica.

Was it though? I would have hated to see the result of a puncture on that 200mph back straight as a result of running over the stuff that was on the track.

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Was it though? I would have hated to see the result of a puncture on that 200mph back straight as a result of running over the stuff that was on the track.

The second SC came as result of the dedris left by Alguersaury in the pit entrance when he lost his front wings, there was no other way to have safely cleaned that out, maybe closing the pits would have been another way but I think they took the right decision with the safety car.

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f1-20100418131534-6861.jpg

I don't see any difference between this move an cutting a chicane.

Here is what Brundle think about Stewards decisions, I like te part that he said that BOTH Vettel and Hamilton should have been penalized.

F1 - Stewards too lenient on drivers claims Brundle

Martin Brundle says that he would push for harsher decisions and penalties if he was a Formula One steward.

So far this year - to give additional credibility to the officials' adjudications - experienced former drivers including Alain Prost, Johnny Herbert and Alex Wurz have acted as race stewards.

Although Brundle argues that the ‘brutal and sometimes unfathomable penalties’ of the recent past have now been eradicated, he thinks the stewards are now being too lenient.

The former McLaren driver, a full-time commentator for British television since retiring in 1996, wrote in his BBC column that Sebastian Vettel and Lewis Hamilton should have been penalised for their pitlane antics in China.

"They both received a reprimand, but what does that mean,” questioned Brundle. “How long does a reprimand last and how many are you allowed to collect before a real penalty? They are lucky I wasn't the resident driver steward for the weekend because I would have strongly recommended dropping them both some penalty places on the grid for the next race in Barcelona.

"The decision taken has set a very dangerous precedent.”

Brundle also said race winner Jenson Button deserved a penalty for unduly slowing behind the safety car prior to a race restart.

"I wouldn't have been a popular steward with my former McLaren team but that job is not a popularity contest,” he concluded.

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