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Max Mosley

Some Very Funny Comments

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The stupidity of your posts says more about your stupidity than anything else. Have we got pathetic name calling out of the way or are we going to have a full on slanging match? Seriously how stupid are you to respond to a perfectly reasonable post with a personal attack? What the f#ck is your problem? You're pathetic.

Schumacher faced very clear discrimination among both F1 'fans' and the english press, mainly due to his nationality, perceived 'German' characteristics - he was described as arrogant, teutonic, robotic, soulless etc. And now judging by the very thin reasons peolpe give for being against Vettel, the same ugliness is rearing its head. Look at insider's post above - Vettel has achieved far more than Hamilton did at his age, yet we have a rant about how Vettel is not 'complete'. With Kubeetza out, he is more complete than anyone else around, and that's saying quite a lot.

Is'nt that the very reasons why you also hate Kimi, and he's far from being german

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People love Vettel because he's winning...

People hate Vettel because he's winning...

I think people are too sensitive.

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The stupidity of your posts says more about your stupidity than anything else. Have we got pathetic name calling out of the way or are we going to have a full on slanging match? Seriously how stupid are you to respond to a perfectly reasonable post with a personal attack? What the f#ck is your problem? You're pathetic.

Anyway - lets be grown up - To me, your original post was almost correct. Some, perhaps even many people dislike Vettel purely because of his nationality - that statement I can sadly agree with. But to say that can be the only reason people dislike him means that anyone who doesn't like Vettel is essentially racist. That is incorrect. A small difference, but an important one.

If your original statement where correct there would be some German Schumacher/Sutil supporters who don't like Vettel because of he's German.

Now - best solution...

You reasonably clarify the meaning of your original post to match that which makes sense (i.e. "Some / many people dislike / like drivers based on nationality.") We can all agree and tut together about what a unpleasant world we live in and (like adults) we can move on.

Alternative solution...

You call me stupid and pathetic again and I ignore you.

Good day. ;)

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Strange, I've never come across anyone who disliked Schumie because he is german, as a matter of fact, I have never seen or heard so many people from all walks of life endear themselves towards Schumacher as a winner. NOT ONCE had I personnaly encountered someone who hated him because he's german, but maybe it's just because of demographics. So, what has this taught me. Schumie was a WINNER first and foremost. He not only knew what it took to win, but build up a formidable team with so many different nationalities that operated like no other team had ever had, and will do I feel. His most loyal fans were that of another nation, the most endearing of fans worldwide, the tifosi. All aspects and characteristics as to why he's such a winner are like "by-products" evidents of facts as to what makes his THAT good. Hating Schumie because he's winning and blaming it on him being german is a by-product, a secondary aspect because they can't cope with the fact with what he's achieved. It's like being a racist which has nothing to do about the colour of the person's skin but about self-esteem. In advertising we call it the central human truth. To me Schumacher embodies what the human body can/could achieve at the higest point of racing, and him being german has no place in it.

I see the same thing happening with Vettel nowadays. People don't hate him cause his german, they hate him cause he's WINNING. He has disrupted the order of things. He has broken records that their fav drivers were suppose to have. and I tell you what, they are scared of what he still going to achieve! Look at all the nonsense going on about the RBR front wing flexing issue, it derives from the fact that the team is winning!

If people really disliked Schumie or Vettel because they're german then they must be very stupid people indeed. I would not want to associate myself with them and hopefully there are only a small amount of them living on this planet earth.

There are people who dislike Vettel purely on the basis of his nationality and not because he's winning, just like there are people who dislike Lewis over the colour of his skin and not because he's winning. Its called prejudice. No reason or rhyme for it. Its pure hatred at its worst, and unfortunately this kind of behaviour is rapidly expanding throughout the world and people turn a blind eye to it every day.

You made a comment in jest - "don't mention the war" - unfortunately, there are people who really think like that. Bury your head in the sand, but that my lovely is the world today.

Makes me sick.

I've come across plenty of people on forums, at work, strangers in the queue at the bank making the odd comment "****ing stupid german schumacher/Vettel - hate him" plenty of times. And with all due respect to you, coming from South Africa, you've seen and lived with prejudice yourself.

Look right into your heart, question yourself, and tell me I'm wrong, babes. I mean no offence either.

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People don't like Alonso because he's Spanish? Cav don't like Alonso. :unsure:

Cav ain't racist dude! He's a pain in the arse (THE arse, not my arse before it gets twisted!).

Well, I already defended him today. He can't have it all. :P

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Is Vettal the new Fangio and Webber the new Stirling Moss? or is Vettel the new Schu and Webber the new Barrichello?

Even though Vettel beat Webber at the last race, Australia beat Germany in the Football 2-1.

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There are people who dislike Vettel purely on the basis of his nationality and not because he's winning, just like there are people who dislike Lewis over the colour of his skin and not because he's winning. Its called prejudice. No reason or rhyme for it. Its pure hatred at its worst, and unfortunately this kind of behaviour is rapidly expanding throughout the world and people turn a blind eye to it every day.

You made a comment in jest - "don't mention the war" - unfortunately, there are people who really think like that. Bury your head in the sand, but that my lovely is the world today.

Makes me sick.

I've come across plenty of people on forums, at work, strangers in the queue at the bank making the odd comment "****ing stupid german schumacher/Vettel - hate him" plenty of times. And with all due respect to you, coming from South Africa, you've seen and lived with prejudice yourself.

Look right into your heart, question yourself, and tell me I'm wrong, babes. I mean no offence either.

You're right, did'nt think of it that way...

my thinking stemmed from the fact I never heard anything like that about Schumie, even in SA, and formed a theory around that. and I still think there's some truth in the winning aspect....

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You're right, did'nt think of it that way...

my thinking stemmed from the fact I never heard anything like that about Schumie, even in SA, and formed a theory around that. and I still think there's some truth in the winning aspect....

I guess you're right too. The UK has this stupid a## mentality, once you've made it and become successful, jealousy starts to creep in. With jealousy comes bitchyness and backstabbing. After that comes the whole who-the-hell-do-they-think-they-are kind of attitude from people. I call it the knock-on effect. The reason why is because British media like to build you up and knock you right back down again like a house of ****ing cards. The western so called "civilised" world is obsessed with celebrity culture. The most powerful man in the world isn't the President of the United States. Its his publicist.

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Most people don't care about nationality, at least not as much as to hate someone like Vettel just because he's German. Normal human beings usually dislike an F1 driver when he's very good or very bad, Heidfeld being the exception to the rule (Ooops, he's German but I promise I'm a normal human being, mostly). :P

I travel to Germany quite often because I have family there, my nephews are half Spanish and half German. I know people/media/press hate Alonso there but it's not because he's Spanish. They don't like Hamilton either since he's a threat for Vettel, not because he's British. Many people don't like Hamilton in Spain because he's a threat for Alonso, like is Vettel although the 2007 season still makes Hamilton more controversial around here. I would say people fears Hamilton more than Vettel, some people in Spain think Hamilton is nearly as good as Alonso. :D

I personally never liked Vettel, not even in 2007 and I won't change my opinion just because he's winning, as I won't change it if he gets killed racing. I'm not going to like Vettel if he proves he can drive in the middle of the pack, overtake on equal terms and put a bad weekend upside down but I will recognize he's a great racing driver. Last year he didn't help me change my point of view about him but I don't hate him either. I just think Hamilton, Alonso or Kubica would have won last year's championship Schumacher's style, they wouldn't have had to worry about Webber all season through. :)

Last year Webber could have won the World Championship, it was all the help Vettel received from the team what made the difference? Very few points but enough to make him win? The front wing gate was just an anecdote. Webber got all cold faces since Turkey and we all know that accident was Vettel's fault. Maybe Red Bull is not helping people to like Vettel. Last year Webber was just 1 tenth down in Australia, now Vettel's time is kind of Senna's at Monaco '88. Can that be real nowadays? :eusa_think:

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Strange, I've never come across anyone who disliked Schumie because he is german, as a matter of fact,

It's more subtle than that Brad, obviously people won't come out and say it and most won't even realize it themselves, everyone is free to passionately support any driver they want, and actually, it is not of any consequence, so it's not even racism per se.

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Anyway - lets be grown up - To me, your original post was almost correct. Some, perhaps even many people dislike Vettel purely because of his nationality - that statement I can sadly agree with. But to say that can be the only reason people dislike him means that anyone who doesn't like Vettel is essentially racist. That is incorrect. A small difference, but an important one.

If your original statement where correct there would be some German Schumacher/Sutil supporters who don't like Vettel because of he's German.

Now - best solution...

You reasonably clarify the meaning of your original post to match that which makes sense (i.e. "Some / many people dislike / like drivers based on nationality.") We can all agree and tut together about what a unpleasant world we live in and (like adults) we can move on.

Alternative solution...

You call me stupid and pathetic again and I ignore you.

Good day. ;)

Semantics. You knew exactly what I meant, and so did most people here, I don't have time to write long explanations or disclaimers.

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I don't like Vettel, not because he is German, BUT because he needs a damn good haircut. Scruffy bugger!!! :D

Actually I don't don't like him. He's alright.

And what the hell was that thing Lewis was wearing on his chin???!!! Looked like someone had got a magic marker and drawn a line on his chops whilst he was asleep..... :D

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Semantics. You knew exactly what I meant, and so did most people here, I don't have time to write long explanations or disclaimers.

No semantics to it. What you wrote is what you wrote. If you meant something different, you should have written something different. You have problems either way...

2 mutually exclusive options...

1) Accept my clarification that what you meant was "Many people dislike Vettel because he's German"

PROBLEMS

It means your original post was wrong.

It means that some people can dislike Vettel for other reasons.

It means your sebsequent posts saying that people were making excuses if they said they disliked Vettel for other reasons were also unjustified.

2) Return to support you original post "People only dislike Vettel because he's German"

PROBLEMS

It means some German Schumacher supporters dislike Vettel because he's German.

It means that you are accusing people who dislike Vettel of being racist.

Your last post looks rather silly because you were implying that I was incorrect in what I thought you meant but now you'd be saying I was correct after all.

I recommend you choose option 1 - you at least avoid looking slightly racist.

For future reference, a simple correction of your very first post would have been a good idea before calling Sean and I pathetic and stupid.

Not making your original post at all would have been by far the best option - perhaps try thinking before posting extreme hyperbole in future. ;)

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Oh, that's so stupid and pathetic

:D :D :D

You know me so well.

And what the hell was that thing Lewis was wearing on his chin???!!! Looked like someone had got a magic marker and drawn a line on his chops whilst he was asleep..... :D

Here we agree, I'd forgotten about that. What is it exactly? Do we call it a beard? Surely it doesn't quallify. Is it just two extremely long sideburns? I'm confused.

EDIT - forgot to change your name(s)

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:lol: Jenson's bumfluff looks awesome next to that!

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I hate those fucking Australian bastards....

:roll: :roll: Awesome man, I'm still laughing hard.

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remember extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
People will respond negatively to Vettel because he is German. That is the only reason he will be disliked for being a winner. It has nothing to do with how much he is winning or anything like that.

:whistling:

Oh get a life, I have about a million better things to do than splitting hairs with you.

So why did you reply? Oh yes - to tell me to get a life. Bravo - how can I ever answer such a clinically logical argument. :lol:

Anyway I guess you realised your statement above was incorrect long ago (as did everyone else), so I'll leave it there.

Auf wiedersehen mein freund.;)

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:whistling:

So why did you reply? Oh yes - to tell me to get a life. Bravo - how can I ever answer such a clinically logical argument. :lol:

Anyway I guess you realised your statement above was incorrect long ago (as did everyone else), so I'll leave it there.

Auf wiedersehen mein freund.;)

Next time don't begin the discussion with 'this says more about you than anything else' - I don't know what exactly you meant, but everything I can possibly imply from it assured me that it is futile to try to have a reasonable discussion with you. Whatever else anyone might accuse me of here, it's not an unwillingness to back up my claims. If you had left it at 'this is an absurd claim' I would have plenty to say. You dragged this discussion through the mud with a response like that, next time attack the post not the poster and I will have something to say. There are too many here who aren't worth trying to have a discussion with, I respond to people exactly the way they respond to me.

There is plenty to back up my claims - have you seen the level of adulation Vettel received after last year vs Hamilton - and Hamilton's title win was far far more unconvincing.

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Is'nt that the very reasons why you also hate Kimi, and he's far from being german

Yes I hate Kimi I hate Alonso - you guys seirously overrate the importance of those figures in my life. They are both overrated and get by too softly among the press and posters here so I tend to bring them up. Plus I won't deny it, it's fun to stir up their fans if only because their passionate defences are so absurd and easily refuted.

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- have you seen the level of adulation Vettel received after last year vs Hamilton - and Hamilton's title win was far far more unconvincing.

Not sure how you measure and compare adulation. What are you referring to, the British press, the BBC? Saying that Hamilton's title was less convincing than Vettel's is pretty subjective. Way too many variables to open that tin o' worms. For what it's worth, I think they both deservesd their titles because they are arguably two of the best guys out there.

I loved Michael Schumacher, back in the day. Now I simply like him a lot. Used to make me smile and shudder all at the same time when my Grandad used to sneer everytime Michael appeared on the TV. I guess seeing your comrades floating in the sea, begging for you to pick them up after their ship had been sunk by a German U-boat, had to leave an affect. For me, Michael being German meant about as much as Jimi Hendrix being black. They are/were just humans who are/were very good at things I would like to be good at. They get my admiration and respect as a result.

But then I'm doing that Maure thing - "Love me for demonstrating how liberal and accomodating I am".

In truth, all f*cking Germans all need shooting, especially the black ones.

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Not sure how you measure and compare adulation. What are you referring to, the British press, the BBC? Saying that Hamilton's title was less convincing than Vettel's is pretty subjective. Way too many variables to open that tin o' worms. For what it's worth, I think they both deservesd their titles because they are arguably two of the best guys out there.

I loved Michael Schumacher, back in the day. Now I simply like him a lot. Used to make me smile and shudder all at the same time when my Grandad used to sneer everytime Michael appeared on the TV. I guess seeing your comrades floating in the sea, begging for you to pick them up after their ship had been sunk by a German U-boat, had to leave an affect. For me, Michael being German meant about as much as Jimi Hendrix being black. They are/were just humans who are/were very good at things I would like to be good at. They get my admiration and respect as a result.

But then I'm doing that Maure thing - "Love me for demonstrating how liberal and accomodating I am".

In truth, all f*cking Germans all need shooting, especially the black ones.

:lol: Good stuff.

I think this thread/argument went off track (at least from my first post which first raised the idea) when people started trying to put something subjective, like why people do or don't like a driver, into an objective framework. It's why I didn't bother trying to answer these questions in my post, and said that these are just things to be aware of, rather than something you can actually answer or quantify in any meaningful way. In other words, I don't think it is important why other people like/dislike a driver, the point of the post was to make myself and whoever else, think about why we ourselves dislike certain drivers, if those reasons are good reasons, and whether we are consistent in those reasons. For once, I was not trying to make an argument with a conclusion, and then everyone went off and tried to do it anyway :lol:

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