Quiet One

Replacing Massa

326 posts in this topic


I will something good about Massa (for a change!)

The guy has been ridiculed, not just by me and a few others but by 90% of the whole F1 world, be it either the fans, the media or personalities. He has been asked the same questions about his future over and over again. Speculations about who is going to replace him has been done gazillions of times in the open as if he was never there. Yet, every time he is asked about it he calmly replies that he is not affected, although he has every right to be affected and most probably is. But he manages to maintain his dignity and keep his chin up even in this situation.

I don't rate him as a driver, but must admire his dignity in a scenario where many others would have failed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will something good about Massa (for a change!)

The guy has been ridiculed, not just by me and a few others but by 90% of the whole F1 world, be it either the fans, the media or personalities. He has been asked the same questions about his future over and over again. Speculations about who is going to replace him has been done gazillions of times in the open as if he was never there. Yet, every time he is asked about it he calmly replies that he is not affected, although he has every right to be affected and most probably is. But he manages to maintain his dignity and keep his chin up even in this situation.

I don't rate him as a driver, but must admire his dignity in a scenario where many others would have failed.

lovely stuff!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will something good about Massa (for a change!)

The guy has been ridiculed, not just by me and a few others but by 90% of the whole F1 world, be it either the fans, the media or personalities. He has been asked the same questions about his future over and over again. Speculations about who is going to replace him has been done gazillions of times in the open as if he was never there. Yet, every time he is asked about it he calmly replies that he is not affected, although he has every right to be affected and most probably is. But he manages to maintain his dignity and keep his chin up even in this situation.

I don't rate him as a driver, but must admire his dignity in a scenario where many others would have failed.

Pah, you Massa fans..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, I really like Massa, for similar reasons. No one believes in him but he's really okay with that. He's had success, even if it was a total fluke, he was set back by his injury and he still came back anyway when it would be so easy to say "I've got a wife, I've got a kid, I'm set for life financially, let's not risk this." He did a really cool thing back at Brazil 2008, if you remember, giving spare Ferrari uniforms to other teams' crew members, suspecting that after the race ending, there may be some violence targeting those who beat Massa for the title. I admire that Massa plays this game with so much heart...but that doesn't mean it would stop me from firing him. I'd love to have him in my team in some role of little consequence as a motivator of sorts, maybe have him be a third driver and just attend the races and keep everyone in high spirits, but I'd never hire him as a driver.

Mostly, I really just refuse to ever say anything good about my favorite drivers, and fortunately I don't often have to because most of my favorite drivers barely have better racing résumés than I do. :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well Eric, it's no fun supporting the guy who always wins... I used to like Vettel and then he did that nasty trick on me :P

But not saying anything good about your favourite drivers for fear of being biased is a bit depressing, waiting to hear from the people "biased in another direction" to see if they also think the same as you or maybe they're disappointed...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:lol: Not a fear of being perceived as biased, you guys know I'm biased.

Wait until Robert Wickens gets on the grid. Look at guys like Scott Speed, or Joey Hand in DTM. When they race in U.S. series, they're my least favorite guys. When they race in Europe, I love them. They do something in the U.S., I'll tell you it's cheap, I'll tell you they're jerks. When they do that same thing in Europe, I'll tell you it's American grit, and that these guys are just self-confident, bold, and determined, unyielding to tired old gentlemanly standards that hold no bearing. What I say about Speed on NASCAR forums and what I've said about Speed here during his time in F1, are the total opposite, and he's still the same guy. But nationality blinds me from almost all I can fault a driver for (other than something serious, like an actual criminal conviction outside of racing). An American among Americans, I hate these guys, but an American taking on the world? Beautiful, gets me every time.

All this to say: I'm the absolute worst and I'm not even ashamed of it. :P

It's just more fun for me to try to see drivers in the other light on here than I see them when I'm in front of my TV. Or I just enjoy being overly critical of and demanding too much from drivers. ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't rate him as a driver, but must admire his dignity in a scenario where many others would have failed.

Dignity comes easy if they are paying you millions to drive a Ferrari.... :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dignity comes easy if they are paying you millions to drive a Ferrari.... :)

I'm trying to say something positive about Massa too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm trying to say something positive about Massa too.

He still has more hair on his head than his father?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dignity comes easy if they are paying you millions to drive a Ferrari.... :)

Tell that to all the other drivers that failed even to do that despite earning as much or more than Felipinho under much lighter circumstances :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He's foregone a trip to be with his family in Brazil to spend time with the engineers in Maranello.

He either:

1) Really cares and wants to get this together.

2) Hates his family.

3) Wants a second career in team management.

4) Wants a second career as a cashier and the engineers are teaching him basic math.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

5) His family said they didn't want to see him

6) He was scared that he'd have to drive in Brazil and wouldn't know how

7) He is as bad at making flight arrangements as he is a formula one driver

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if i were perez i'd jump on the ferrari money bandwagon asap. it may never come around again.

Ferrari hasn't offered him anything at this point.

Also there are manny obstacles to this move:

1) Perez has no need to jump from a car that is on the rise, consequently raising his stock value, to a car that has ony won a chaotic race under the rain, but that might well be considered the 5th or 6th car on the grid (James Allen dixit). He can watch it crash and burn whereas he can be a hero at Sauber by merely finishing in the points.

2) Ferrari is already in troubled waters and they will gain nothing by bringing in Perez too early and making him fail by making him ride a dog of a car mid season. Rather have him since start of next season and let Massa carry the blame for all that is wrong this year (I still think that all this over protecting Felipinho is the way they will justify blaming him more later)

3) Many of he former detractors might have forgotten, but the Mexican Marvel of today was just the friggin' Mexican pay driver of old. Carlos Slim would not be too happy to continue funding a team that no longer has the Mexican guy whose seat he paid for. Negotiations with Sauber will be delicate.(BTW, what happened to the "pay drivers are ruining the sport" crowd?)

4) The kid did great at Malaysia. But he is still a rookie and it's not as if has put Kamui to shame (yet). He has all the time in the world, and time is on his side. Ferrari si not urging him, and he has no urge to swap rides. If the occasion presents...then we will see.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ferrari hasn't offered him anything at this point.

Also there are manny obstacles to this move:

1) Perez has no need to jump from a car that is on the rise, consequently raising his stock value, to a car that has ony won a chaotic race under the rain, but that might well be considered the 5th or 6th car on the grid (James Allen dixit). He can watch it crash and burn whereas he can be a hero at Sauber by merely finishing in the points.

2) Ferrari is already in troubled waters and they will gain nothing by bringing in Perez too early and making him fail by making him ride a dog of a car mid season. Rather have him since start of next season and let Massa carry the blame for all that is wrong this year (I still think that all this over protecting Felipinho is the way they will justify blaming him more later)

3) Many of he former detractors might have forgotten, but the Mexican Marvel of today was just the friggin' Mexican pay driver of old. Carlos Slim would not be too happy to continue funding a team that no longer has the Mexican guy whose seat he paid for. Negotiations with Sauber will be delicate.(BTW, what happened to the "pay drivers are ruining the sport" crowd?)

4) The kid did great at Malaysia. But he is still a rookie and it's not as if has put Kamui to shame (yet). He has all the time in the world, and time is on his side. Ferrari si not urging him, and he has no urge to swap rides. If the occasion presents...then we will see.

Indeed. The more I think about it the more I hope it doesn't happen this year. It could really hurt his career to be under such scrutiny from everybody and against a guy like Alonso. Let him grow and develop at Sauber and it'll pay better dividends for Ferrari later on, if they decide they do want him. If they must change Massa for somebody I hope it's somebody who has nothing or very little to lose. Plenty of old guys like Heidfeld would meet that criteria, or someone like Alguersuari. But please leave the Mexican Marvel alone for now!

Edited by Rainmaster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Sergio should go to Ferrari as soon as he can. Why? Why not? He might learn from Fernando. If he doesn't he might just (whisper it) beat him. If he isn't allowed to but looks like he could, it will up his stock value even more. Then he could go anywhere. In the meantime, Ferrari might improve and give Sergio a real chance to pick up some wins.

All this 'he isn't ready for Ferrari yet' is romantic bollocks.

He won't go there this year anyway. Ferrari may be calling the shots on keeping him at Sauber, for now. The danger is if they maintain the grooming campaign, he might be picked up by someone like Moo Rouge when Mark is ready to go (if Seb allows it, of course, and doesn't deem him a Mexican ghercumber who is just a little too fast). Then there's McLaren, I suppose, if Lewis really does end up at Mercedes.

Or Sergio might go rallying/lesbian bobbing/git tipping.

Who knows?

Seriously, that wasn't rhetorical. Does someone actually know?

No.

Forum guess work; we are all just guessing monkeys.

I'm certainly rambling more than normal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to say, I admire Ferrari's take on supporting Massa through this tough time. There is a lot of blood baiting from fans, forums and the press at large and the Maranello of old would have kicked Felipe out. But he must be trying very hard indeed. There must be tangible struggles the team can see that he is trying to overcome. I also suspect dear Rob will be banging the drum as loud as he can. Heartening for Felipe that LDM asked for a round of applause back at the factory to show support for him.

I'm sure this is Massa's last year dressed in red. But if and when he goes, it will be a good thing that Ferrari didn't act irrationally. This speaks volumes about how they are trying to react generally. It may also give a glimpse into what Fernando is calling for publicly (i.e. support for Felipe) and behind closed doors.

Let's be honest; Alonso's win wouldn't have looked so brilliant had Felipe finished right behind him, would it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to say, I admire Ferrari's take on supporting Massa through this tough time. There is a lot of blood baiting from fans, forums and the press at large and the Maranello of old would have kicked Felipe out. But he must be trying very hard indeed. There must be tangible struggles the team can see that he is trying to overcome. I also suspect dear Rob will be banging the drum as loud as he can. Heartening for Felipe that LDM asked for a round of applause back at the factory to show support for him.

I'm sure this is Massa's last year dressed in red. But if and when he goes, it will be a good thing that Ferrari didn't act irrationally. This speaks volumes about how they are trying to react generally. It may also give a glimpse into what Fernando is calling for publicly (i.e. support for Felipe) and behind closed doors.

Let's be honest; Alonso's win wouldn't have looked so brilliant had Felipe finished right behind him, would it?

Although my vision on all this over protecting of Massa is more cynical than yours, I still agree that it is still impressive how much Ferrari gave to Massa in the past couple of years, considering how little Felipinho was able to give back. Any team, nazi or ally, would have kicked his driver for much less, accident or not. "Look, pal, it was a horrific accident, so sorry. We love you and always will. Now GTFO, we need somebody who can at least convincingly beat the Caterhams". That would have been said by his own father, if his father owned the team, and as back as 2010, if the Caterhams weren't named Virgin Branson Mega Funded Super Technologically Marvel F1 by then.

As for Alonso, I doubt there is any love between him and Felipe. But even if Nando was unforgiving enough to be still mad at Monza's penalty in 2006 (I doubt it very much but somebody, some time will bring that up) or if Massa's personality is brittle enough to be crushed beyond repair since Germany 2010 (ditto) it is still uncomprehensible that he has any actual primadonna reason to prefer Massa over any other driver he could get along better, who will be willing not to overshadow him and still do more for the team than Massa (Trulli and Fisico, first oon that list...Sh#t, even Liuzzi would be a better option!)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to say, I admire Ferrari's take on supporting Massa through this tough time. There is a lot of blood baiting from fans, forums and the press at large and the Maranello of old would have kicked Felipe out. But he must be trying very hard indeed. There must be tangible struggles the team can see that he is trying to overcome. I also suspect dear Rob will be banging the drum as loud as he can. Heartening for Felipe that LDM asked for a round of applause back at the factory to show support for him.

I'm sure this is Massa's last year dressed in red. But if and when he goes, it will be a good thing that Ferrari didn't act irrationally. This speaks volumes about how they are trying to react generally. It may also give a glimpse into what Fernando is calling for publicly (i.e. support for Felipe) and behind closed doors.

Let's be honest; Alonso's win wouldn't have looked so brilliant had Felipe finished right behind him, would it?

It could be argued that by not getting rid of him this year, or even having him even in their car at all after last year, is irrational. I'm sure Rob Semdley still has a great relationship with Massa but we know from the camera cutting to the pit-wall that he is disappointed with Massa's driving, with all those shakes of the head.

As for Perez I'd say he's not ready for a top team just yet, he's still a rookie after all and the mistake on Sunday showed that. As much as Ferrari's second car should not be a mobile retirement home (Massa), it is not a driving school either, and the Mexican Marvel (as he shall forever be known) has much to learn. The pressure at Ferrari is worse than anywhere else, and with the difficulty of a mid-season change for any driver, that could be a disaster for his career. So I think there are good practical reasons that going too soon would not be wise. Obviously, there is always the possibility he'd rise to it, but the odds would be stacked against him. If it came up, I'm sure he'd have to take it, but I hope it doesn't.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Sauber is a much better place for Pérez ATM. The problem is in the red team and they have to solve it on their own.

The season looks good for the Mexican in Sauber and could be frustrating and disappointing in Ferrari. Let's see what happens with the F2012 in China, Bahrain and Spain. If Ferrari are still in trouble by then it's game over no matter who is driving the cars.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now I KNOW all of you guys are on drugs, or crazy. Ferrari did not offer Kubica a seat for 4 years, but will offer one to Perez after ONE podium???? :wtf:

Edited by Piotr

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now I KNOW all of you guys are on drugs, or crazy. Ferrari did not offer Kubica a seat for 4 years, but will offer one to Perez after ONE podium???? :wtf:

Maybe because Ferrari has a bias towards drivers with four functional limbs, those racists.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe because Ferrari has a bias towards drivers with four functional limbs, those racists.

I see you conveniently forgot about 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, and 2010. Of course, we'd rather forget 2007, and 2006 was really only 1/2 season. a triffle compared to one podium finish.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see you conveniently forgot about 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, and 2010. Of course, we'd rather forget 2007, and 2006 was really only 1/2 season. a triffle compared to one podium finish.

Like you said, I conveniently forgot about those.Otherwise, the joke wouldn't have worked :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now