Lewis Hamilton

[pabloh20 1]

He is just venting his frustration there. It's ok.

My main complaint is about his (and Brawn's) obviously overacted lamentations over the YDT banning. Seriously, they got away with the tiregate thanks to the leniency of the IT. The most decent thing to do would have to just shut up and try to keep a low profile. Their exagerated claims that missing the Silverstone test will be a disaster for them is both completely unvbelievable and highly disgusting. "Pity our martyrdom, oh ye, for we will not be able to give our prepubescent kids that won't be racing anytime soon some track time, just because we have 1,000 more km proper testing than any other team! It hurts so much!" These guys and RBR are making Ferrari look decent in comparison. Enough said.

They should leave the crap talk to Lauda. He is good at it.

No team is that bad

I believe Brawn and Lewis' comments are in direct correlation to Horner's constant bleating, I think he is forcing the retorts, otherwise they probably would say nothing. Brawn is a smart cookie and knows they got off lightly, so I suspect he would love to let it just die down, however, the more Horner says about the leniency of the penalty, the more they are going to say how terrible it is that they can't do the ydt and how limiting that is, although we all know that is rubbish. They are hardly going to come out and say 'yep, we got off lightly, the tribunal are a bunch of suckers, in your face little Jack Horner', as amusing as that would be for a change.

[Quiet One 15]

No team is that bad

My point, exactly!

But you must admit that since Domenicali is in charge, Ferrari's profile has lowered a lot.

I believe Brawn and Lewis' comments are in direct correlation to Horner's constant bleating, I think he is forcing the retorts, otherwise they probably would say nothing. Brawn is a smart cookie and knows they got off lightly, so I suspect he would love to let it just die down, however, the more Horner says about the leniency of the penalty, the more they are going to say how terrible it is that they can't do the ydt and how limiting that is, although we all know that is rubbish. They are hardly going to come out and say 'yep, we got off lightly, the tribunal are a bunch of suckers, in your face little Jack Horner', as amusing as that would be for a change.

Well, the fact is that they got off lightly! So Horner has a good reason (for once) to complain. They, on the other hand, would look much better looking contrite but saying nothing. I guess not a single soul in the world believes them when they say that missing the YDT "sucks". So they have the choice to STFU, and should do exactly that.

[rwgordon 0]

I don't Hamilton is struggling for cash not being a fan of his is a little hobby of mine.....

[Angellica 0]

Hamilton is a fantastic talent and if you disagree,you're from a different planet as its clear as day the guy is Fnnn fast. But like most people here have said, it's his big mouth,his demotivational attitude and the effect of not being able to keep his personal life out of the sport, has made most future employers turn there head in disgust, as its an image that there media personal and sponsors don't like. Brawn hired Hamilton thinking he could mould him into the next Schumi. Far from it, Schumi was hard as a rock, showed no sign of weakness, lewis in the other hand gives a massive opening for his rivals to take advantage of by just having to be a tad rougher out on track against him for him to crack.

I do agree, he can drive really well, but then again he also let's his temper get the better of him sometimes and has at least a couple of crashes as a result. He does seem to have calmed that donw more recently though. His attitude and so on is a major problem for him. I mean tweeting the teams telemetry was hardly likely to make future employers warm to him was it? I seriously don't like him, he just annoys me with the way he behaves and his whining.

Oh and Christian Horner does have the right to complain right now, all the other teams do as Mercedes broke the rules and pretty much got away with it scot free.

[Emmcee 0]

Hamilton seems to get this way when he is getting beaten, he was in a similar state of mind when jenson was beating him early in 2010. After the first four races that year jenson had already won two grandprix to hamilton's none, he can't seem to dral with it.

[pabloh20 1]

My point, exactly!

But you must admit that since Domenicali is in charge, Ferrari's profile has lowered a lot.

Yep indeed, I quite like Domenicali, he seemed to struggle to start off with, but he's toughed it out and is doing ok.

Well, the fact is that they got off lightly! So Horner has a good reason (for once) to complain. They, on the other hand, would look much better looking contrite but saying nothing. I guess not a single soul in the world believes them when they say that missing the YDT "sucks". So they have the choice to STFU, and should do exactly that.

Horner is like the boy who cried wolf. He has complained that much this season alone over complete bollocks, it's hard to take any legitmate complaint, which this is, from him seriously. The thing is, he should say his piece after the verdict and then leave it alone. Only he hasn't, or he can't and this has forced Merc to retort. I still think Merc would like nothing better to put their tail between their legs, run away and forget about it, but they obviously feel they have to answer the complaint in a roundabout way. I think they would be better off saying nothing as well, but constant criticism doesn't always bring the best response.

I am guessing that the first outing of the independent tribunal was not a resounding success.

[KoolMonkey 0]

Yep indeed, I quite like Domenicali, he seemed to struggle to start off with, but he's toughed it out and is doing ok.

Horner is like the boy who cried wolf. He has complained that much this season alone over complete bollocks, it's hard to take any legitmate complaint, which this is, from him seriously. The thing is, he should say his piece after the verdict and then leave it alone. Only he hasn't, or he can't and this has forced Merc to retort. I still think Merc would like nothing better to put their tail between their legs, run away and forget about it, but they obviously feel they have to answer the complaint in a roundabout way. I think they would be better off saying nothing as well, but constant criticism doesn't always bring the best response.

I am guessing that the first outing of the independent tribunal was not a resounding success.

You do realise all the "accusations" that have been leveled against RBR. How so many times legal parts of their car that have passed the FIA and Charlie Whiting's inspections, but in person and written, have then been deemed "illegal" after the fact. He has every right to raise his concerns. It's so popular to criticise Horner and RBR these days, and yet they keep on winning. How's that for a giant bag of Winning.

[Quiet One 15]

Yep indeed, I quite like Domenicali, he seemed to struggle to start off with, but he's toughed it out and is doing ok.

Horner is like the boy who cried wolf. He has complained that much this season alone over complete bollocks, it's hard to take any legitmate complaint, which this is, from him seriously. The thing is, he should say his piece after the verdict and then leave it alone. Only he hasn't, or he can't and this has forced Merc to retort. I still think Merc would like nothing better to put their tail between their legs, run away and forget about it, but they obviously feel they have to answer the complaint in a roundabout way. I think they would be better off saying nothing as well, but constant criticism doesn't always bring the best response.

I am guessing that the first outing of the independent tribunal was not a resounding success.

Yes, SD reminds me a little bit of MW, both seem rather nice which, unfortunately, tends to be considered the same as dull and incompetent. I understand that it was a lot more pintoresque to have Ron Denis, or Flavio Briatore around, but at the same time I quite like team principals that are not complete arseholes.

And as much as I consider Horner one of the most brilliant students at the Briatore School of Obnoxiousness, I must agree with KoolMonkey here to a degree. The Mercs were found guilty. The RBRs were not, so they hold the moral ground, ridiculously as it seems.

And regarding the IT, yup not their finest hour. But then again, we all knew that nothing good could ever come from IT

[pabloh20 1]

You do realise all the "accusations" that have been leveled against RBR. How so many times legal parts of their car that have passed the FIA and Charlie Whiting's inspections, but in person and written, have then been deemed "illegal" after the fact. He has every right to raise his concerns. It's so popular to criticise Horner and RBR these days, and yet they keep on winning. How's that for a giant bag of Winning.

No, I am completely oblivious to any previous happenings in F1. I don't even like F1, can't stand the sport at all. I only know about this incident because I accidentally clicked on a link about Horner. I didn't think the H and P on my keyboard where anywhere near each other, but hey ho, there you go.

I frankly couldn't give a flying bollocks whether it's peopular to criticise Horner/RBR or not, that has no influence on my opinion of him moaning this year. I am not criticising the RBR team either, just commenting on how much moaning Horner has done this year. Yes, he has every right to raise his concerns, but do them through the proper channels instead of feeding the info to the 'British trashpapers' which you so love.

Obviously, me saying Horner is a moaner is a direct slur against RBR and by continuation, Vettel, who you rate as a driver. So, therefore I must hate Vettel and the fact that he is always winning. I think you will find this is a really giant bag of 'oh bollocks how wrong can you be'

[pabloh20 1]

Yes, SD reminds me a little bit of MW, both seem rather nice which, unfortunately, tends to be considered the same as dull and incompetent. I understand that it was a lot more pintoresque to have Ron Denis, or Flavio Briatore around, but at the same time I quite like team principals that are not complete arseholes.

And as much as I consider Horner one of the most brilliant students at the Briatore School of Obnoxiousness, I must agree with KoolMonkey here to a degree. The Mercs were found guilty. The RBRs were not, so they hold the moral ground, ridiculously as it seems.

And regarding the IT, yup not their finest hour. But then again, we all knew that nothing good could ever come from IT

Well, I was never a fan of Ron Dennis as you know and Briatore........well, you know I only liked him when he was wearing his leopard-skin thongs. But yes, I agree, team principals who are not complete arseholes are much better, even if they seem a little dull by comparison.

I don't think anybody is questioning the fact that Merc are guilty, or got off lightly. As for RBR holding the moral ground, yes in this case they do, but we know this is because they, like every other team in F1, have not been caught with any of their infringements yet

As I said above, they have every right to question decisions, they even have the right to moan on and on like a dripping tap, but it doesn't mean it's always the best thing to do.

Nope, nothing good ever comes from IT

[The Shadow 0]

You do realise all the "accusations" that have been leveled against RBR. How so many times legal parts of their car that have passed the FIA and Charlie Whiting's inspections, but in person and written, have then been deemed "illegal" after the fact. He has every right to raise his concerns. It's so popular to criticise Horner and RBR these days, and yet they keep on winning. How's that for a giant bag of Winning.

I find it fascinating to see how often people think that like/dislike or support/vendetta for a team/driver is directly proportionate to that team's success. It must really burn you up when team A wins a championship and even 1% of the fans still choose to support other teams.

The nature of sport is competition. If one is to be considered a fan, one has to have passion for the sport and a certain partisanship. The ones that have the passion but no partisanship, we call journalists, marshalls and stewards. There can only be a strong passion when there is strong competition. Every fan has a reason they support a team, which is sometimes personal to them. So ridiculing others by bringing up your favourite team's success is really not an argument that holds a candle for the matter at hand.

[Jean-Pierre 0]

What a contrast today: Nico on top and Lewis whining about the car, far behind! I suspect the situation will stabilise for Lewis in two or three GPs and he will start hedging Nico on a regular basis. But may be Nico is stronger than everydody thought and may be he will dominate Lewis for the rest of the year. I would then have, like most F1 fan, to revise my list of top three drivers.

[pabloh20 1]

What a contrast today: Nico on top and Lewis whining about the car, far behind! I suspect the situation will stabilise for Lewis in two or three GPs and he will start hedging Nico on a regular basis. But may be Nico is stronger than everydody thought and may be he will dominate Lewis for the rest of the year. I would then have, like most F1 fan, to revise my list of top three drivers.

It would also make Schumacher's comeback stronger, if you were to do so

I think Nico is a handy driver, but I think Lewis' arrival at the team has made him up his game. And therein lies the problem for me, he should have been on the top of his game the whole time, not just because he has been forced to by Lewis' arrival.

Mind you, I still think talk of revisionism after 7 or 8 races, whatever we have had, is a tad premature. For all his whining and moaning, he is still leading Nico in the standings, so his race craft must be ok, even if the balance, 1 lap pace, etc, etc, aren't.

[Quiet One 15]

I completely disagree with you, Paul.

Ok, now I'm gonna read your post...mmmh...let's see...

Ok, I still disagree . I doubt Nico has raised his game that much. Frankly, this is one of the simplest cases in my eyes of a driver flattered by his car. Beside the rather average win at Monaco how many amazing overtakes you saw him do? How many great manoeuvres under pressure? All I see is a guy doing better or worse according to his car's whim.

Regretfuly, that only makes Lewis' underperforming even more evident. Lewis could/should be at Vettel's level, probably pushing for Alonso's. But he isn't. He has an immense natural talent, that much is obvious, but his mental state is a mess. Everything upsets his performance during the season. Be it his dog, his pussy, his trophies, his twitter, etc he always look like an abandoned puppy.

Lewis should be making mince meat of Nico. He only shows here and there glimpses of talent and then goes sulking again.He lacks mental strength.

[pabloh20 1]

I completely disagree with you, Paul.

Ok, now I'm gonna read your post...mmmh...let's see...

Ok, I still disagree . I doubt Nico has raised his game that much. Frankly, this is one of the simplest cases in my eyes of a driver flattered by his car. Beside the rather average win at Monaco how many amazing overtakes you saw him do? How many great manoeuvres under pressure? All I see is a guy doing better or worse according to his car's whim.

Regretfuly, that only makes Lewis' underperforming even more evident. Lewis could/should be at Vettel's level, probably pushing for Alonso's. But he isn't. He has an immense natural talent, that much is obvious, but his mental state is a mess. Everything upsets his performance during the season. Be it his dog, his pussy, his trophies, his twitter, etc he always look like an abandoned puppy.

Lewis should be making mince meat of Nico. He only shows here and there glimpses of talent and then goes sulking again.He lacks mental strength.

Basically, what we are saying that even at the weekend, you still talk complete bollocks. An I thought it was just during the working week. Ah well

Don't forget, Alonso put in quite a few sub-standard performances after 2007 up until he joined Ferrari in 2010. Was it the car, or lack of mental strength?

[Quiet One 15]

Basically, what we are saying that even at the weekend, you still talk complete bollocks. An I thought it was just during the working week. Ah well

Don't forget, Alonso put in quite a few sub-standard performances after 2007 up until he joined Ferrari in 2010. Was it the car, or lack of mental strength?

The car: Even you know that!

[pabloh20 1]

The car: Even you know that!

Yes, obviously it was

[Quiet One 15]

Well, you tell me how many of his races in the awfuls R28 and R29 were affected by his love life, his dog, his father or anything like that?

And, mind you, he was astronomically superior compared to Nelsinho and Romaain those years. You can bring back the Crashgate, and laugh about Nelsinho. Even with those consideration there were light years between Nando and his team mates.

His worst year mentally, the one that really overwhelmed him was 2007. And still was a lot better than Lewis 2011 season.

You might try to make a point regarding speed, qualy performances or whatever as I already stated that Lewis has an enormous talent and for me was the second best driver (although already surpased by Vettel and being closely pursued by Kimi), but you simply cannot compare focus. Sorry

[Rainmaster 7]

I tend to agree with baldy about Hamilton. All the talent in the world but there's definitely something lacking in his application. Not a problem Vettel or Alonso have, who both have the mindset of any of the great drivers you can think of from Senna to Prost to Schumi. Not being harsh on Hamilton, I don't think many drivers have the focus of Vettel and Alonso, I don't think Kimi does, for example. The reason Lewis always stuck out is because it feels like he should have it, he should be a performer like those two, and yet he isn't.

[Emmcee 0]

Well he did a ripper of a qualy lap today nearly half a second quicker than anybody

[pabloh20 1]

Well, you tell me how many of his races in the awfuls R28 and R29 were affected by his love life, his dog, his father or anything like that?

And, mind you, he was astronomically superior compared to Nelsinho and Romaain those years. You can bring back the Crashgate, and laugh about Nelsinho. Even with those consideration there were light years between Nando and his team mates.

His worst year mentally, the one that really overwhelmed him was 2007. And still was a lot better than Lewis 2011 season.

You might try to make a point regarding speed, qualy performances or whatever as I already stated that Lewis has an enormous talent and for me was the second best driver (although already surpased by Vettel and being closely pursued by Kimi), but you simply cannot compare focus. Sorry

That makes it even worse. He had no excuse for some of the sub standard drives he did during those years, he was just plain bollocking ordinary at times.

There is also light years in difference between the quality of team mates Alonso had during those years and the quality of Lewis team mates, when you say he has been sub-standard. At no time during those years did Alonso have to deal with a former world champion, for example.

Maybe Lewis does not have the talent you think, nobody knows for sure. Maybe he does lack focus at times, maybe he is not mentally the best, but it's nothing any of the other drivers have not exhibited at times and Alonso is a prime example of that, especially if you rate him so highly now. And his worst year mentally was not 2007, it was the floundering years at Renault 2008 - 2009.

[pabloh20 1]

I tend to agree with baldy about Hamilton. All the talent in the world but there's definitely something lacking in his application. Not a problem Vettel or Alonso have, who both have the mindset of any of the great drivers you can think of from Senna to Prost to Schumi. Not being harsh on Hamilton, I don't think many drivers have the focus of Vettel and Alonso, I don't think Kimi does, for example. The reason Lewis always stuck out is because it feels like he should have it, he should be a performer like those two, and yet he isn't.

I agree Vettel has not shown any issues in this regard, but as I said above, Alonso lacked application at Renault in 2008 - 2009, his standard of driving during that time was not a patch on what it has been since he joined Ferrari, or indeed during his championship winning years and it was definitely not all down to the car.

I disagree about Kimi to an extent, mainly because I don't think he needs to focus the same as the others to be bollocking quick.

[Emmcee 0]

No kimi doesn't your right, kimi seems to get faster and faster the more relaxed he is.

[Quiet One 15]

I think your fondness for Lewis is not letting you understand my point. I've said in almost every post that I truly believe that Lewis is one of the top 3 when it comes to raw talent. Now, you don't hear me saying that about Van Der Garde, or even Button or Webber do you?

I am not bashing Lewis, quite the contrary. I found it frustrating that the guy that I consider capable of some of the most masterful drives on track can be so inmature and not because of sudden fits (like Vettel and cucumbers or Alonso and chose your favorite thing to hate about him).

If you look at those three dispassionately, you will have to admit that no matter how many anecdotes from both Vettel or Alonso you bring and transform into a proof of whinging or whatever, they still are more stable than Lewis.

Lewis seems always upset by things happening outside F1. Vettel and Alonso don't.

As for the 2008 and 2009, sorry but you are completely off the mark there. I cannot believe you are seriously arguing that those 2 years were bad because of Alonso. Let's see:

R28: A very bad car despite a promising pre season. And improvement came very slow. Yet they managed to finish 4th in the championship certainly not thanks to Nelsinho, who failed to score a single point in 14 of the 18 races (9 of them because of DNFs). Take out Singapore, as I don't want to spend the rest of my life arguing about that race. He still won at Suzuka (from 4th on the grid), he overtook 5 drivers on the last lap at Spa (including Vettel and Kubica...) He did made what for me was his greatest blunder outside McLaren, crashing against Heidfeld at Monaco. Canada was bad luck, Bahrain was caused by a failure in Lewis car...Awful, really? In the last 8 races he was the driver that scored most points. In that year's Renault! Imagine the same happening with one of the Force Indias this year, to understand that.

R29: The worst car Renault made in its last reincarnation. Unlike the R28, none of the updates made any difference. If any, it got worse. Still a midfield car, like the Williams now. It managed to finish in the top 10 only 12 times. ELEVEN of those were from Alonso, including the only podium (3rd place at SIngapore) and including a one race ban for the loose wheel at Hungary (not his fault was it?) . Yes it was an awful car and ended up 8th in the WCC.

Alonso was awful in 2007. No point in denying it (and yet he still did no worse than Lewis). He was quickly coming back in 2008 and being great again in 2009. All that in awful cars and facing extreme frustration. He had bad results, but he had very few bad races.

Now, you may say that it was because of Alonso, not t he car. Then why the other two guys were not even close? Ah yes, because everybody that is beaten by Alonso is merely because they suck (well, In Nelsinho's case you might have a case). So, there's no way to win that discussion.

Nelsinho was awful and a cheater. Romain was awful and crashes. Massa had the accident and that is why now he only can count to potato. Trulli was backstabbed by Alonso and Flavio because he was too good. Fisico...I don't know, I ran out of excuses but I am sure somebody will find one.

Nah...Alonso is THAT good. Sorry. I am a blind fan, yes. But so is whoever thinks that Alonso is not THAT good. Again and again his colleagues, the team principals and the F1 journalists vote him as the best driver on the grid. Again and again he had shown epic drives in less than epic cars. Chosen best F1 driver in 2 of the 3 years of RBR and Vettel's dominance should give you a hint.

You want to find an underperforming year from Alonso? This one is! The car is not quite there, but Alonso doesn't seem to be able to do his magic either and had two costly DNFs. And, again, for all the bad driving for his standards he is still regarded as Vettel's only threat to his Championship. All other drivers would kill to have a bad year like the ones Alonso has!

[BradSpeedMan 6]

Regretfuly, that only makes Lewis' underperforming even more evident. Lewis could/should be at Vettel's level, probably pushing for Alonso's.

What?????? yeah, Paul is right...What bollocks!!!

and those years back at Renault just filling the car seat before moving to Ferrari, very disappointing!