Lewis Hamilton

[Massa 0]

So Lewis Hamilton signed with a team based on regulations that were never confirmed and based on a totally speculative remark from Ross Brawn that a works team would have an advantage in 2014?

I think I'm misunderstanding (as usual).

EDIT: I guess you might mean Hamilton considered that in 2014, it's basically a wide open reset, where everyone has a chance to mix up the grid, so there's no advantage or disadvantage to be with any team that has some resources behind it? In that case, yeah, that would make sense.

[Quiet One 15]

EDIT: I guess you might mean Hamilton considered that in 2014, it's basically a wide open reset, where everyone has a chance to mix up the grid, so there's no advantage or disadvantage to be with any team that has some resources behind it? In that case, yeah, that would make sense.

This.

But yes, I think the main factor was money. In any case, I am unable to judge if ultimately it is good or bad for Lewis. And, in any case, Bernie's "should/could" are either a badly disguised order to his lackeys or some product of advanced senility. I am not sure how can they judge when he is making sense and when he is merely derailing.

Sometimes I get this unnerving suspicion they cannot tell either.

[AleHop 0]

Hamilton found McLaren's twitter clause hard to swallow, maybe?

It was the right moment for a move like this. 2007-12 (6 seasons) is a lot of time in F1. His contract was to be renewed but he decided to go to the modern Silver Arrows seeking their old times and glory. And a load of money. Of course.

[KoolMonkey 0]

So long Lewis. I never warmed to him when he first came into F1. Personally, and guys this is only my opinion, I felt him to be exhitibiting behaviour of one who was born with a silver spoon, or a child born in a rich family, who has always had his way. He's a good enough talent to have won a WDC, but from a personal standpoint I hated the fact he had won one. As the years went on I mellowed to him somewhat and started to appreciate his driving skill. But again over the past year, I started seeing him as essentially an undisciplined spoilt child. He never seem truly and honestly grateful about anything. So so long Lewis. Merc won't be pulling a Brawn anytime soon. Brawn was a complete an utter fluke if you will of having all the perfect ingredients come together at the same time. They would not have won anything had Honda stuck around and they used their engines. Luckily for them, the pitlane and Mercedes took pity on them and agreed to supply them with engines, thinkign as we all did they would be at best midfielders. The rest is history of course.

For that to happen a second time in that team, isn't going to happen. Where has Merc been this year anyway? They got get their first maiden win -- but Maldanado also won a race.

I'd have alot more respect for Lewis if he had come into F1 like Alonso or Webber doing the hard years in a small team. Unless Brawn has something amazing in the wings, I see Lewis getting frustrated very quickly, and Brawn is not going to put up with Lewis' BS either. Neither will Mercedes for that matter. Twittering telementry of your own team? Don't even think about it, he'd be sacked as he rightly should have.

Still he got what he wanted which was money. That's why he signed with XIX in the first place. Money. So enjoy the money Lewis, and I'll be laughing when in a year or two's time you are whinging, whining how the car isn't quite there, how you want to WIN, and being the same childish person we have seen for years. Hopefully you'll grow up with this experience and learn some class. You see, money can't buy class, it has to come from within.

[Quiet One 15]

BREAKING NEWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Button has stopped following Lewis on Twitter and now is following Perez. There's panic in the stock market!!!!!!!!

On another note: it wasn't Nikki Lauda who acted as an intermediary between Lewis and Merc. "My" inside connections told me that it was actually old Max Mosley, but they didn't want to go public about that. According to my sources, Max went straigth to Herr Haug and told him: "Lewis needs more of ze payment"

*drumfill*

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

So what makes you think McLaren are going to be any more competitive? They should have won more championships recently.

I think the Mercedes move is not a bad one for Lewis, will do him some good to try life in a different team and the opportunity to do what Schui did for Ferrari.

And for fans, will mix things up a bit and, will be interesting to see Perez and thank goodness for putting Schui out of his misery.

[KoolMonkey 0]

History I guess makes me think McLaren will be more competitive. Merc are still an unknown at this point. I'm getting a Toyota vibe from them currently. McLaren have a great track record of developing a car over the season. Plus they continue to win races, year in year out. I agree they should have won more Championships, however in order to win one, you have to be winning races. Thus at this stage, my vote says McLaren are still a better chance of winning anything at this point over Merc.

I hope Schumi gets picked up by Ferrari. Apart from 2008, Massa is a spent force. Schumi isn't going to rattle Alonso either. I would be a very fitting end to his career I think. Plus would suit nicely if Vettel does indeed end up going to Ferrari in 2014. Massa can head back to Sauber, and I think do alot better free of the Alonso is faster than you bubble.

[Insider 0]

History I guess makes me think McLaren will be more competitive. Merc are still an unknown at this point. I'm getting a Toyota vibe from them currently. McLaren have a great track record of developing a car over the season. Plus they continue to win races, year in year out. I agree they should have won more Championships, however in order to win one, you have to be winning races. Thus at this stage, my vote says McLaren are still a better chance of winning anything at this point over Merc.

I hope Schumi gets picked up by Ferrari. Apart from 2008, Massa is a spent force. Schumi isn't going to rattle Alonso either. I would be a very fitting end to his career I think. Plus would suit nicely if Vettel does indeed end up going to Ferrari in 2014. Massa can head back to Sauber, and I think do alot better free of the Alonso is faster than you bubble.

I'll go along with that. With Bernie mooting that the new engine will probably be scrapped, perhaps Lewis will deteriorate into the English Jarno Trulli.

[Rainmaster 7]

Bernie has never liked the new engine regs though. Yet he never managed to stop it being signed off, and I don't see him getting it scrapped, either.

As for Hamilton's move, I'm just wondering how many more obvious headlines and stories it'll generate. http://www.bbc.co.uk...rmula1/19765967. Who would have guessed it was Hamilton who instigated it?

One thing which Brawn does say is "There isn't a number one status," he said. "To be clear, Lewis never mentioned that in all the discussions we had with him. He wanted to make sure that he had parity, that there was equality in what was done, but he never ever asked for number one status. We wouldn't be keen to give that to a driver because it tends to say you're not looking after the other driver as well as you should." Obviously, I am not saying he won't be number one (see Paul's posts).

[LabradoRacer 2]

Though I don't dislike Lewis, I do think & hope that Mercedes will continue to flounder next year.

[Guest]

I am still in total shock with this (not the whole Lewis deal)but.........Eddie Jordan does not always speak total nonsense!!!

[JHS18 0]

I will actually DIE laughing if these new engines are scrapped.

Of course that was part of the reason Lewis went there. He'd have been stupid not to consider that. I think his decision was made basically on the fact that sure, '13 may not be up to much, but '14 with these new engines could see Mercedes suddenly be one of, if not THE, leading team on the grid.

And now they may be scrapped as soon as he's signed a contract with them?

Hahahahaha. Oh my.

Cheers Bernie. That's comedic timing right there.

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

Hamilton really does seem to polarise opinion....

I'm not a fan of him particularly, but a fan of F1 generally. For me, I'd like to see a spread of world class drivers driving in world class cars.

...which is why I find it strange that anyone should wish bad fortune onto him or for that matter, Mercedes.

Bizarre.

[BradSpeedMan 6]

I will actually DIE laughing if these new engines are scrapped.

Of course that was part of the reason Lewis went there. He'd have been stupid not to consider that. I think his decision was made basically on the fact that sure, '13 may not be up to much, but '14 with these new engines could see Mercedes suddenly be one of, if not THE, leading team on the grid.

And now they may be scrapped as soon as he's signed a contract with them?

Hahahahaha. Oh my.

Cheers Bernie. That's comedic timing right there.

Whether or not the new engine rules are implemented is irrelevant. The team has been steadily building up it's resources and team structure and is showing an upward curve, and is likely get it right in a year or 2, especially with an exceptional driver like Hamilton...

[Rainmaster 7]

Yep.

Again, people put too much weight on certain things here. First the money and now the engines. The whole engine argument is pure speculation anyway. It is not an absolute. You cannot say "the engine formula got dropped therefore Lewis' decision was wrong". Even if it does get dropped you have to assume a lot of things to make that a significant point, firstly, that in 2014 there will be major performance differences between the engines that the manufacturers bring to the season. Not everyone agrees that will be the case. Even if it is, you then have to assume that Mercedes were going to be the engine manufacturer that ended up making the best engine that year. Again, a massive leap since Ferrari and Renault are not exactly newcomers to designing engines. To put it in short, Lewis is making a gamble here regardless of whether you have new engine regulations or not, and he knows it.

The real reason he left Mclaren is obvious enough: he was no longer happy at Mclaren. If you don't believe that then asky yourself why did he approach Red Bull and Ferrari first (the two teams much more likely to be successful than Mercedes)? Let's cut the money nonsense and the engine speculation.

[Quiet One 15]

Yep.

Again, people put too much weight on certain things here. First the money and now the engines. The whole engine argument is pure speculation anyway. It is not an absolute. You cannot say "the engine formula got dropped therefore Lewis' decision was wrong". Even if it does get dropped you have to assume a lot of things to make that a significant point, firstly, that in 2014 there will be major performance differences between the engines that the manufacturers bring to the season. Not everyone agrees that will be the case. Even if it is, you then have to assume that Mercedes were going to be the engine manufacturer that ended up making the best engine that year. Again, a massive leap since Ferrari and Renault are not exactly newcomers to designing engines. To put it in short, Lewis is making a gamble here regardless of whether you have new engine regulations or not, and he knows it.

The real reason he left Mclaren is obvious enough: he was no longer happy at Mclaren. If you don't believe that then asky yourself why did he approach Red Bull and Ferrari first (the two teams much more likely to be successful than Mercedes)? Let's cut the money nonsense and the engine speculation.

...and now you went the other way to the other extreme

I agree with you, and that is why I always believed that McLaren should not be his first choice but his last. He definitely seemed unhappy, whereas it was because of money, lack of competitivness from the team or Whitmarsh's body smell I couldn't tell but it was pretty obvious even before the twittergate that he was thinking more of a way out thanon on how to earn 3 WDCs before end of 2012.

But that much is obvious. The question is why would a guy who was almost genetically engineered to be THE MCLAREN CREATURE came to be such an unhappy figure.

Why do we care? What can we actually discover by discussing this endlessly, deconstructing every single gesture? Probably nothing, perhaps some trivial truth.

But we are F1 fans, we don't get to race the fast cars, to travel to ther fascinating destinations, to amass the big fortunes, to get he pretty girls. We get our diesel powered cars, we travel to our everyday works, we earn our meager salaries and we only get Paul.

So all this chitchat is both our way of entertaining ourselves between races and vent our thinly vented jealousy

I say lets speculate!!!

[Massa 0]

Hamilton really does seem to polarise opinion....

I'm not a fan of him particularly, but a fan of F1 generally. For me, I'd like to see a spread of world class drivers driving in world class cars.

...which is why I find it strange that anyone should wish bad fortune onto him or for that matter, Mercedes.

Bizarre.

I agree fully. I can't imagine liking Formula One but not wanting more teams and drivers to be competitive. I'm not going to judge people who are literally only watching F1 because they like a certain driver, of course. I just don't understanding not wanting competition.

I also don't understand how anyone could watch F1 for a few years and not realize that, even without major regulation changes, a team that's not so competitive right now isn't going to be that way forever. Mercedes can elevate Hamilton's game. Hamilton can elevate Mercedes'. Even if he's pursuing money, even if there aren't new engines, whatever, you really can't write them off on anything other than bitterness over Schumacher not getting the results to keep his seat (no one took anyone's job here) or bitterness over something else.

It's good for the sport to spread the best drivers over different teams. It's good for the sport that the best drivers are willing to look beyond McLaren and Ferrari. I enjoy the sport. I like things that are good for it, personally.

[Rainmaster 7]

But I am not disputing people's right to speculate, oh bald one. Speculate away! Personally, I can find it quite easy to buy into the whole "Hamilton becomes his own person" reason for leaving Mclaren. But I don't care about that, it's enough to know that he was obviously unhappy at Mclaren. I was merely pointing out that the engine part may well have been a positive point for Hamilton, but is probably not as significant as some people think. If the regs do change, all Hamilton has "lost" is the relatively small chance that Merc might have come up with an earth shatteringly fast engine and blown everyone away (which would probably also require that the chassis is pretty decent too, another leap we have to make for this argument to work). In fact, arguably if the regs do change (i.e. stay the same) he's in a better position as he knows the current Merc box is pretty decent, and so that removes the possibility that in 2014 Ferrari or Renault turn up with an earth shatteringly fast engine...

So the engine regulations are NOT the make or break of this deal. The fact he approached two other teams would seem to demonstrate that.

[Quiet One 15]

But I am not disputing people's right to speculate, oh bald one. Speculate away! Personally, I can find it quite easy to buy into the whole "Hamilton becomes his own person" reason for leaving Mclaren. But I don't care about that, it's enough to know that he was obviously unhappy at Mclaren. I was merely pointing out that the engine part may well have been a positive point for Hamilton, but is probably not as significant as some people think. If the regs do change, all Hamilton has "lost" is the relatively small chance that Merc might have come up with an earth shatteringly fast engine and blown everyone away (which would probably also require that the chassis is pretty decent too, another leap we have to make for this argument to work). In fact, arguably if the regs do change (i.e. stay the same) he's in a better position as he knows the current Merc box is pretty decent, and so that removes the possibility that in 2014 Ferrari or Renault turn up with an earth shatteringly fast engine...

So the engine regulations are NOT the make or break of this deal. The fact he approached two other teams would seem to demonstrate that.

Ah, yes, I do agree.I don't think he moved to Mec because they would be in an onbvious b etter position either, because they are not. It is just a gamble. But the odds of a better car seemed better with a whole rules shuffle than within the current cars, as Merc seems not going forward as expected. It iis just a side of the story.

Speaking of which, and about speculation as well, it is amusing to read the weird theories we all make and how we get so involved in each one of these as to lose sight of t he overall picture (which is what usually happens when one speculates, of course). Among the reasons to defend Lewis move, for example, there's a group which takes a historical view on Merc to back the move, as if the triumphs of the silver arrows in the pre First War era would help them anyhow at present!

Easier to say, they have Brawn, Costa and Bob Bell, so it's not as if he is jumping into some unknown, out-of-nowhere risen team.

The short, non-speculative version being: if you feel happier meaning that you will also deliver finer drives then be my guest and go with my best wishes, Lewis, my son.

As I said before, even if Nando does not win this championship I'd rather see him losing it but looking as happy and racier as he looks today than if he had become the 2007 WDC in such a gloomy atmosphere (before somebody points out: I know he was part of it, I am not talking about who is to blame, I am talking about how grim it all seemed. Victory or defeat would have looked equally as bitter that year). I think Hamilton fans will appreciate the same about his boy now.

[AleHop 0]

I assume Brawn talked to Hamilton about 2014 engines and surely Mercedes is working hard to have everything ready in time. It doesn't mean Hamilton's decision is wrong or would have changed if he had known the new engines would be scrapped. Merc is the best F1 engine already.

[AleHop 0]

As I said before, even if Nando does not win this championship I'd rather see him losing it but looking as happy and racier as he looks today than if he had become the 2007 WDC in such a gloomy atmosphere (before somebody points out: I know he was part of it, I am not talking about who is to blame, I am talking about how grim it all seemed. Victory or defeat would have looked equally as bitter that year). I think Hamilton fans will appreciate the same about his boy now.

Curiously I think Alonso was happy in McLaren with the team, the NASA atmosphere, etc. I think he loved that. They've got Pat Fry in Ferrari to develop that type of working enviroment with a bit of Italian sauce.

[Insider 0]

Thus far, I have only speculated on the possibility of a move. Now Lewis has taken the shot, I fear he may be in the wilderness for some considerable time. As Whitmarsh said, if he wanted to win races consistently, he needed to be in a McLaren. I'm afraid he's probably right.

[BradSpeedMan 6]

Thus far, I have only speculated on the possibility of a move. Now Lewis has taken the shot, I fear he may be in the wilderness for some considerable time. As Whitmarsh said, if he wanted to win races consistently, he needed to be in a McLaren. I'm afraid he's probably right.

That's NOT what I wanted to hear from your personal feelings....lol! I hope you're wrong

[brambilla 0]

I think I read somewhere that the really important question is - who keeps the yellow helmet ? However, I think they can both co-exist. Hamilton has more going on with his helmet than Nico - enough to tell them apart.

[Quiet One 15]

I think I read somewhere that the really important question is - who keeps the yellow helmet ? However, I think they can both co-exist. Hamilton has more going on with his helmet than Nico - enough to tell them apart.

It'll be easy to tell them aprt. The guy in ahead is Lewis.