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radical-one

To Save F1, What Needs To Be Done ?

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We all know that there's no short cut to save Formula 1 from it's current turmoil but in your opinion, what are the steps to be be done in order

to save it from total failure ?

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1. Burn it down.

2. Let it rise from ashes with a clean sheet of paper with a vision what kind of series this should be.

3. Teams - commercial rights holders. No more CVC and alike.

4. New faces at FiA with fresh ideas and without baggage on their back from the past.

5. Establish F1 commissioner responsible to FiA and commercial steering committee. Out every 3 years.

6. Race control - out every 3 years

7. Making membership easier to attain.

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To revert to a realistic chassis,engine and car, when I mean realistic, think of the most fastest,grippiest race car and build that with the mindset of improving racing and driving as a whole. I know it's thoughtless but safety must come second again to uplift the thrill of formula one again. Now cars are built with safety as first priority and try to make it fast. These are the issues you encounter when trying to break "evolution" or nature down in formula one, you have stagnant cars and championships you see today, who hold no aura or authenticity or heritage about them. But that's my opinion.

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I think all that could really save F1 is rewinding the world a few decades. F1 has clear problems. Big ones, too. But I think even the perfectly run, perfectly organized, perfect product racing series wouldn't be very successful. Racing is on the way out, worldwide, and that's not strongly tied to the product. That's not strongly tied to how series are run. It's a bigger issue. Racing failed to engage younger audiences. Some of that is bad luck: the car and performance aren't priorities anymore. They mean different things to most people now. But some of was just bad decisions. Ticket prices being as high as they are makes it impossible to take people to the races with you, and I think being at the track is the easiest way to become a new fan. People who go and see how cool it is in-person are more likely to want to see it on TV. But for hundreds of dollars, no one who is on the fence about whether or not they might like it is going to say, "Sure, what the hell, let's try it." And bringing your children is very expensive, which keeps young people out.

Ultimately, the racing industry has failed to make people care enough about the outcomes of auto races to watch the process of getting to them. I would not want to be in charge of fixing auto racing. I think you're up against external conditions that no one could maneuver through. The evidence of that is "new" motor racing formats, like rallycross. Global Rallycross in America (yeah, I know, the name...) was invented specifically to put racing in front of young people. Quick, low-attention span, high-action racing in "cool" cars with names like Travis Pastrana or Tanner Foust and edgy guys like Scott Speed. Plus, competition at the X Games. But it turns out GRC, which has a tiny audience, has the same demographic problems as the rest of auto racing. The aging crowd that was disgruntled with NASCAR or whatever ended up being the people getting into GRC. So, I'm not sure you can really make racing appeal to a new generation of fans, whatever you do.

With that in mind, I'd almost argue F1 being in disarray, being financially unsustainable, and being less-than-captivating is immaterial. It, and all other racing series, are faced with:

  • A huge group that just doesn't care and won't care. And some in that group aren't even just "don't care"—they're vehemently against the "violence" of a sport where competitor deaths occur or the "wastefulness" of it all in terms of money and fuel.
  • Evolutions of the automobile that will take from the spectacle (alternative energy sources will change the sound; autonomous cars will be hilarious in Roborace as a new technology, but once refined, racing will lose a ton of drama—as well as personalities who can engage fans).

And then there's the reality in America, at least: death sells. If you want to increase TV viewership of auto racing in America, the data prove that a driver fatality is the easiest way to do that. Dale Earnhardt, Dan Wheldon, Justin Wilson...huge for TV ratings in America. Plenty of vultures.

But vultures aside, you're damned in auto racing even among those who lament the deaths. You are ethically obliged to advance safety, yet the more you advance safety, the less...impressive this whole thing is. It's sad. It's disgusting. But I think people are drawn to the danger, and once there is no "cheating of death," there is nothing that the common audience can see to separate it from just driving a road car. But to cheat death, legitimately, some people must fail to cheat death. And you can't, can't, can't have that. So, what do you do to make racing spectacular, yet ethical and safe?

I've written a bit more about the death aspect of racing here, if interested (you shouldn't be): http://libertino.kinja.com/a-month-without-wilson-1732895444

3. Teams - commercial rights holders.

Having watched CART kill itself (I think the word "groupthink" exists purely for convenience of discussing CART) and probably kill auto racing in America1, I'd really, really prefer the teams not be the commercial rights holders, personally.

1People can debate this, I realize, but the fact people on the Internet preferred the CART product to the IRL product 1996–2002 does not mean CART was less blameworthy in "the split." It was CART's fault the split happened—all they had to do was involve their most important constituent, the Indianapolis Motor Speedway, in decision-making. But the team owners were too arrogant to give an inch to anyone else. It was CART's fault the split did so much damage—the IRL was never, ever going to exclude CART teams, and it was kind of implied that CART teams would be part of it and the Indy 500. CART was the one that decided to schedule all of its events so that CART teams couldn't enter IRL races, particularly the 500. The team owners were again too arrogant. They figured wherever their cars and their drivers were racing, the fans would be watching. How wrong they were. And it was CART's fault that reunification for IndyCar has been a bit of a disaster, and still is 8 years on. The entitlement of the team owners from CART's legacy has made it impossible for IndyCar's executives to do anything. Everyone is completely tied down to listening to one group of stakeholders and one only: the team owners. Guess whose interests they have in mind? And if you think, "Well, sure, but the teams need IndyCar to succeed for their own sake," you'd be mistaken, since there's barely a single sponsorship in auto racing that is marketing to consumers. In America, at least, and probably in the world motorsport scene, it is all about B2B partnerships. IndyCar could have 0 people watch on TV, but as long as Roger Penske still owns a car dealership network, his cars will be fully-funded by those wanting access to his other business interests/partners. Like Pennzoil—not a dime is paid to Penske, but they cover his cars in Indy and NASCAR because Pennzoil gets exclusivity at Penske dealerships. So, their interests are not well-aligned to the financial success of the sport, which is more fan-dependent.

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Like I've said many many times before, what we have now is the massive "snowball" effect from the massive regulation shakeup of 1998. I honestly believe that. Look at how the cars used to be anytime prior to 1998. Just how they were driven, raced and how races turned out and especially how the sport was run in general. It was proper racing, yes we had epic races through the 2000s but I feel it's all down to who has made the best car within the rules, not the best car overall and prior to 1998 you could. We need to revert back to a modern version of the 1997 chassis, regulations and guidelines. As I believe that was the last "authentic" season the sport had.

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To revert to a realistic chassis,engine and car, when I mean realistic, think of the most fastest,grippiest race car and build that with the mindset of improving racing and driving as a whole. I know it's thoughtless but safety must come second again to uplift the thrill of formula one again. Now cars are built with safety as first priority and try to make it fast. These are the issues you encounter when trying to break "evolution" or nature down in formula one, you have stagnant cars and championships you see today, who hold no aura or authenticity or heritage about them. But that's my opinion.

I don't belive that you can turn clock back with this crowd (governance). Right now if you ask, I bet that not two people on the inside are in agreement what's in a business plan, and what kind of racing series they want. Newey is p****d that engine guys have upper hand, something he wants for himself. Haas has one idea, and Williams is already bitching about it. Maybe I am making mistake comparing my life to this body, but they are in deep mess. That's my professional opinion. Sometimes a product and a good idea has to be shelved first, to be re-born the "right way".

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Only one thing for me to solve this fiasco :

ASSASSINATE BERNIE ! goldeneye.gif

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1. Burn it down.

2. Let it rise from ashes with a clean sheet of paper with a vision what kind of series this should be.

3. Teams - commercial rights holders. No more CVC and alike.

4. New faces at FiA with fresh ideas and without baggage on their back from the past.

5. Establish F1 commissioner responsible to FiA and commercial steering committee. Out every 3 years.

6. Race control - out every 3 years

7. Making membership easier to attain.

Al is good but my favorites are nos., 5 and 4

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Like I've said many many times before, what we have now is the massive "snowball" effect from the massive regulation shakeup of 1998. I honestly believe that. Look at how the cars used to be anytime prior to 1998. Just how they were driven, raced and how races turned out and especially how the sport was run in general. It was proper racing, yes we had epic races through the 2000s but I feel it's all down to who has made the best car within the rules, not the best car overall and prior to 1998 you could. We need to revert back to a modern version of the 1997 chassis, regulations and guidelines. As I believe that was the last "authentic" season the sport had.

A Real revamp of F1 management and all it's governance would have a good start.

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@Massa

I am not certain that you can turn clock back. It wasn't done yet anywhere. I am aware what happened in America, but I am however an optimist that people can learn of failures, and do better next time.

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Less aero and more mechanical grip for closer, more authentic racing - I've been saying it for 10+ years.

Fuel limit/flow rate raised slightly so eradicate fuel saving - keep hybrid power, nothing wrong with them and they'll naturally get faster and more efficient.

Revert back to hour qualifying where teams have 3 sets of quali tyres that'll last multiple flying laps and get handed back so no need to be saving tyres.

Tyre war of 2+ constructors - The more the merrier, adds element of unpredictability and another dimension to the racing.

Replace the archaic governing body - incredibly out of touch with the fans and lost in a sea of moneymaking bull.

New circuits not always designed by Tilke - most of them are so sterile though the infrastructure around the circuit is part and parcel of which he normally does a good job, however a different architect would bring a different project.

Vastly reduce the complexities of the cars so they're more challenging to drive and less like computers on wheels. Seriously, it's ridiculous how complicated the steering wheels are now.

New camera action on track - driver eye view (not just t-cam) so we can see how bumpy it really is and how difficult it's supposed to be. Watching the grand prix the other day and for the last 15 odd years the cars look (look) easy to drive. New cameras that actually show they're not so easy.

Less robotic drivers and staff members in press conferences - all the answers are so rehearsed ans regurgitated it gives off such an artificial feel. I haven't watched the pre race or post race shows in 10+ years because after watching f1 in total for 25 years all the interviews are the same! You could take an interview from 2002 and copy and paste it into any subsequent interview. Show some personality.

Equalising pay structure for teams and remove special veto powers - you compete, you get an equal split. The more points, the more additional pay you get. Teams get a vote. One vote per team OWNER. RB and TR prime example why not vote per team.

Greater design freedom for teams - here is a rough guidline, come up with what you can within that. The sport is so starved of innovation everything looks the same. There's no room for something truely revolutionary which F1 was always about.

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For Bernie Ecclestone to sell up and not be involved at all.

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@radical-one that's a bit harsh assassinate Bernie lol

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@radical-one that's a bit harsh assassinate Bernie lol

Some members here will pitch-in for the hitman feegoldeneye.gif

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For Bernie Ecclestone to sell up and not be involved at all.

good one.

Welcome to the forumcool22.gif

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good one.

Welcome to the forumcool22.gif

Thanks for the welcome.

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Some members here will pitch-in for the hitman feegoldeneye.gif

Lol. I bet they would.

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REALISTICALLY just Listen to the drivers.

Here in Tasmania last weekend we had the V8 supercars race.

No stupid made up pit stop rules of when and if a car can pit, SOFT tyres for the whole weekend and a few other changes to the weekend racing format.

RESULT....... some of the best and closest racing I have seen in years. And at the end pretty much ALL of the drivers had a smile on their face because they could actually RACE. And you could tell by the crowds on the hill they sure enjoyed it as well.

Well done to V8 supercars for listening to the drivers, but why did it take so bloody long ???????????

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The souloutions are simplez they have been for years it's just certain groups and factions within the sport are just to greedy and selfish

For the good of f1 in general

1. For the love of Pete just stop stop stop it with these stupid gimmicky rule changes just to skirt around the core issues

2. Look at we'll hass are doing on a small budget it's because they've gone about their business similar to the btcc ngtc regs they bought all the common components off Ferrari and the paid dollars to design the chassis hurrah points on a budget.

- suspension

- gearboxes

- differentials

- engines

- rear diffusers / under car aero

Should all be parts that can be bought by any team who have £100 million or less.

The field spread would be cut in half because the only differentiating factor should be the outer chassis . No more good chassis but not chance because of crap engine or visa versa for the little teams. Let's face it deep down we all know that mercades, ferrari, redbull , mclaren and maybe renault once they spend more will be the only teams who will ever win races or championships and for the sport the drivers and the fans that's just stinky. These changes would go some way to changing this

3. Re introduce ground effect and heavily reduce complicated external aero parts ( faster cars better racing less aerodynamic wake)

4. Heavily modify the use of DRS . I'm not totally against this use of DRS it has made races more interesting because they know they can't poodle too the flag doing a trulli train but it is to powerful in some instances aka spa. My solution is not to get rid of it but to completely change the positions and time of use e.g the drs zone at spa is way to slam dunk but it's fine at Hungary. Reason being at Hungary it's a closing device rather then a passing device. So hear goes

- have 3 or 4 smaller drs zones

- DRS useable within 1.5 seconds of the driver in front and not useable within 2.5 tenths of a second of the car in font

- No Drs zones placed In slam dunk overtaking zones e.g radion and the back straight in Canada instead place them after every quick corner were turbulence nd hot air come into effect and use them and smaller straights as a closing devic

5 ( for Bernie ) stop ditching and trying to ditch classic races like spa Monza Silverstone and full them dull boring Eastern tracks for the sake of money.

6. Make the engine and mechanical parts the main focus points of development for the teams. This would be achieved by forcing all the teams to use the same spec under car downforce and only allowing them to develop aero parts that are visible to the naked eye this reducing there spending on aerodynamics because they know other people will copy and ways and thus force them to invest engine and mechanical parts to seek advantages This would be good because

- engines , fuel economy , gearboxes ers suspension etc are all things that can have a massive bearing developing cars for the automotive industry. Aerodynamics is by and large bar the basics just a means of making a thoroughbred racing car quick

- budget caps will always fail because manor will never be able to employ the same number of people as a manufacturer. And there is no way the police a budget cap but by forcing teams to put all their dollars into less avenues of development your effectively limiting their areas of advantage over the poorer less staffed competiton

- long term super high downforce always causes problems anyway ( turbulence rubbish racing easy to drive cars like in the v8 era and the possibility that drivers would have to wear g suits)

- we have all seen it case proven point time and time again racing is always better when drivers have more power then grip e.g 2014 more fun to watch then 2013 and 2003 being more fun to watch then 2006 onwards, and probably the late 80s early 90s being more fun to watch then all of them.

- all engine manufactures should be free to develop their engines until once they hit 2000hp (within the 100kg limit of fuel ) . Once that has been achieved they should be able to have no more because of safety reasons and they should be forced purely to focus on fuel economy. In theory it would mean 10 years from now we'd have cars that are twice as powerful and potentially running on less then half the fuel

- Top speed should be restricted to 250 mph for safety reasons view the use of and standard onboard speed limiter something in the ecu

- good for the environment and good for our entertainment everyone wins

For the good of the fans the teams and the sponsors

1. Start handing out fair prize money as people from p6 down have no real business incentive to compete in f1 and giving loads of money and people who already have it and none to those with little dose not work ( as in real life ) every team on the grid should have at least £ 60million the cover the bear bones running cost of running and team

1b completely change the whole royalties based system because it will always be Ferrari who make most money regardless of weather they finish 1st or 4th and that's just not correct because in real life a person in job doesn't get paid more just coz they been around for 50 years they have to achieve and push. My solutions is

- royalties should not be based on years been around because that means Ferrari will forever get more then anyone else regardless of what they achieve

- royalties should be based on percentage of constructors championships won within the entire existence of f1 , so Ferrari would still have the bulk of the royalties but Williams would have a lot more money because they won nearly as many as ferrari and .every year and new manufacture wins a championship all the teams that didn't win loose a fractional percentage of their royalties until they win another title . This is good because it means that the royalty bill for FOM doesn't increase and all the top teams have major incentives as the only way to become stinking rich is to win more titles not just sit there for 50 years cough Ferrari and nobody will able to spend their way to titles and royalties after 10 years cough red bull

2. Readdress the balance between tv income sponsors and ticket prices

Obviously it would be great if f1 was on free to air tv and long term it's probably better for fans sponsors alike. But if Fom really want to continue with pay tv they re asses other ways i which the fans and the teams are being stiffed because you can't bake your cake and eat it

- I'm no rocket scientist but it is easy to see that less sponsors have any desire to be around since free to air tv was canned I mean why you pay a team the same amount of money when you know your going have less then 50% of the exposure your before . ( incase of uk 200-300 thousand viewers down form 3-4 million a race ) business would play holy hell if the had to pay the same for a 5 second tv advert and the used to for a 30 second advert . Even the title winning cars have hardly any sponsors these days compared to 5 years ago look at a 90s car compared to now a 1995 back marker had more sponsors then a 2015 Mercades ( and no it's not just cigarette money)

- if FOM insist on continuing with the pay tv model they must compensate the teams and fans so a bigger share of the prize money should be handed out and they should cut In half the tv money so that tracks can reduce their ticket prices. ( basic long term economics )

Edited by Smu3l3y

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REALISTICALLY just Listen to the drivers.

Here in Tasmania last weekend we had the V8 supercars race.

No stupid made up pit stop rules of when and if a car can pit, SOFT tyres for the whole weekend and a few other changes to the weekend racing format.

RESULT....... some of the best and closest racing I have seen in years. And at the end pretty much ALL of the drivers had a smile on their face because they could actually RACE. And you could tell by the crowds on the hill they sure enjoyed it as well.

Well done to V8 supercars for listening to the drivers, but why did it take so bloody long ???????????

No stupid rules? They still get penalised for wheel spinning in the pit lane?

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One type Dry tire, One type wet tire, over one weekend that would do the trick

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Iam just getting tired of Motorsport in general putting limits on crucial items such as tyres. At which time do different cars in any category of Motorsport, ever get a chance to race there rivals flat out in optimal conditions. No where and when I say optimal conditions, I mean, unlimited tyres and a choice of what tyre to use, unlimited amount of fuel so they can burn it how they like and have a chance to race each other flat out to see what machine is better. The one thing that does come as close as possible to that is Moto GP and we all know just how exciting those races are all the time.

Edited by Emmcee

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MotoGP never ceased to amazed the fans. One tire one race , pushing all the way each lap and does to have too many protection for the rider.

F1 is nowhere near it's excitementcongrats.gif

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