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lipstick79

2017 Monaco GP

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22 minutes ago, BradSpeedMan said:

Alonso hands down

That is my opinion also. One will note that Alonso also lasted only one year at McLaren (the first time). ;)

 

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Mind you, I have NEVER seen Kimi so angry :lol:

What comes close is when St. Alfonso won his first championship and they were both on the podium. To me it's a good sign, he's not happy to be in 2nd position, hopefully it will spur him on more

f1-monaco-gp-2017-race-winner-sebastian-vettel-ferrari-kimi-raikkonen-ferrari.jpeg

skysports-kimi-raikkonen-sebastian-vettel-ferrari_3965459.jpeg

PA2165474.0036.jpeg

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Yes, he looks mad all right. (Maybe more than just disappointed). But mad with whom…? Funny thing, Seb seems to be totally oblivious to his mood.

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On ‎29‎/‎05‎/‎2017 at 1:23 PM, BradSpeedMan said:

pitted Vettel improved significantly his pace, which in my book means that he was considerably quicker. Vettel was maintaining the gap, he had nowhere to go, all he did was manage his tyres and wait for a few clean laps. And that's what he did. Kimi didn't have Vettel's pace even after they were both on Supersofts, he was significantly slower before the SC and considerably slower after the SC. In a nutshell when they both had a clean track ahead of them Vettel was considerably faster than Kimi

Statistically speaking U CAN prove anything with statistics. 

What COUNTS is what ACTUALLY happens on track.

Just like, track position IS king!!

F1 is a results sport, results COUNT.
Second is first of the losers.

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4 hours ago, Ruslan said:

I think so also, but this guy is difficult to deal with. Probably more difficult than Vettel/Hamilton/Alonso (I will let the reader pick who is the most difficult among those three).

He was with a top team for one year, and McLaren replaced him with Magnussen because they could not work with him. Magnussen is clearly not the same caliber driver. Anyhow, I noticed over the last couple of years that Perez was a lot less negative in his public comments so was hoping he may have matured. His engine comments at Monoco indicate that this may not be the case. I strongly suspect he is going to Ferrari next year to replace Kimi. I am not sure how well he is going to fit there. 

 

I think that Perez has matured a lot over the last few years and seems to be well liked at Force India. His radio outburst yesterday should probably be put into context, he was frustrated for not being able to pass Kvyat, they were in Monaco where you have to be extra vigilant and so he probably couln't concentrate on having a regular chat with his engineer. The bottom line in fact was not very dissimilar to some of the radio messages that made Kimi famous, only no one would say that Kimi is difficult to handle, I wonder if certain sentences appear more difficult to digest if spoken with a Spanish accent (Alonso seems to be getting a lot of stick from the English speaking media and fans, whereas when I hear him speak Italian I feel that he's a sensible and trustworthy chap, when I listen to Vettel speak Italian with his team it sounds a bit artificial).

Regarding Perez in his year at McLaren there are many things that we should consider: he was still very young, he was there because his sponsor imposed him on a team that didn't ant him in the first place, Ron is known for disliking southern European/ South americans, I saw an interview by the late Andrea De Cesaris recently and he was talking, among other things, about his stint at McLaren and he was saying that Ron didn't really want him there but Marlboro wanted De Cesaris in that car, he said that he knew full well before signing for McLaren that Ron didn't want Italian drivers in his team because he thought that he couldn't work with them, etc, all this to say that one has to wonder if the problems that year were all on Perez's door or if the situation was a bit more complex. McLaren's handling of Magnussen didn't seem to show much of an improvement. I guess that at Ferrari they understand and accept that for a young driver it's difficult to deal with the pressure of driving for a top team, maybe at McLaren they are more easily convinced if there is a solid sponsorship deal in place, but the bottom line is the same, only a few (top) teams can succesfully employ very young driver with some success, Among the current top terams I'd say that only Red Bull can deal with them succesfully, but their business model is geared towards modling them from an early age, they have the structures in place to mentor them, etc, at Ferrari, McLaren, Williams, etc they are left to their own devices, you just have to look at Stroll, he does all the right things, he constantly puts his car in the right place (not all F1 drivers do that...) yet he can't overcome the difficulty of setting up his car and it really shows when you watch him drive on a straight line, yet despite all the money that his car poured inti Williams they don't seem capable of guiding him in the right direction, and I'm sure that they would really love to help him but quite simply they don't know how to appraoch this

Having said that I believe that it's likely that Ricciardo will step into Kimi's car next season

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8 minutes ago, Sakae said:

92599fb28fea48e3996ff42ee801c14b.png

so the consensus among German F1 pundits seems to be that Alonso and Perez are doing a great job. I haven't mentioned Vettel because this year I think that no one could say that he hasn't be anything than exceptional. I personally fear that people are being over critical about Vandoorne, he's very inexperienced by F1 standards and he has to face possibly the best overall driver, it's not easy, he only manages a few clean laps during each session due to that thing bolted to the back of his car, Honda is killing his chances, that's not fair

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Re:Honda is killing his chances, that's not fair
>Don`t U think the lawnmower guys -Honda- R workin round the clock to resolve their issues.

It is the testing ban. When Sauber go live with Honda PU as a customer.

Mclaren & Stoffel WILL feel the benefits, 

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AMuS is a respect media outlet, but hardly in mainstream of German public point of view. Nonetheless better than most. I do not agree with Alonso's rating. Considering that he and his colleague are not racing under the same conditions (converging equipment performance) as others do, hence I think they both should not be rated at all, because they do not qualify IMO of course.

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11 hours ago, lipstick79 said:

Re:Honda is killing his chances, that's not fair
>Don`t U think the lawnmower guys -Honda- R workin round the clock to resolve their issues.

I'm sure they are working round the clock and their doing their best but still I wonder if Vandoorne's career will recover from this

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At Mclaren

Re:maybe at McLaren they are more easily convinced if there is a solid sponsorship deal in place

>I DISAGREE
I`m thinking of a boy called, Hamilton - who Ron nurtured at a very early age

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2 hours ago, Publius Cornelius Scipio said:

I'm sure they are working round the clock and their doing their best but still I wonder if Vandoorne's career will recover from this

I am not sure whether he would be interested, but I think the only escape for him is to replace Palmer, show what he can do. Renault might be considering such solution. I doubt that he would be seriously considered to replace Kimi (who could be also driving next year where he is), Having said that, I am not folding up possibility, that Honda will be strong, and fully competitive. It's not over until its over.

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1 hour ago, Sakae said:

I am not sure whether he would be interested, but I think the only escape for him is to replace Palmer

I think that I have a different take on Renault from you guys but I think that Renault's prospects are looking very good, they are steadily improving, next year they might be quite competitive

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9 minutes ago, Publius Cornelius Scipio said:

I think that I have a different take on Renault from you guys but I think that Renault's prospects are looking very good, they are steadily improving, next year they might be quite competitive

Don't be mistaken. I am actually of the same opinion. They might not be winning anything yet other than my sympathy, nor they will next year either, but they are IMO on their way to fight for victories in couple of years. Cyril Abiteboul is actually this week being quoted - what we (his team) needs are two good drivers. This is a reason why I think Hulk has a job, whereas Palmer in contrast might be loosing his. (Perez's name is coming up  in street talks).

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On ‎30‎/‎05‎/‎2017 at 0:22 PM, Sakae said:

 they are steadily improving

Whilst I agree with you, the same CAN B said for a LOT of teams/manufacturers. 
This is F1 things DON`T remain consistent for long.
I think the biggest worry is the,  development rate of Honda.
Ok so McLaren Honda, had a bad Monaco GP.
But the development by Honda,  IS showing on track.
McLaren SHOULD be complaining to Honda - MORE
To finish first,  first you MUST finish.
1 step forward,  2 steps back.
FCUK speed & performance - that WILL come.
I know nothing much can be done - in season
because of the testing rules.

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Honda is improving and ultimately at some point in the future their performance will converge with others. That's what I believe. For some reason I do not see however any needs to compare their engine to a lawn-mover. Honda history, and ages lasting commitments made along-way are worth reading, if one wants to understand their corporate behavior and policies governing every aspect of that organization.

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Re:...any needs to compare their engine to a lawn-mover

>Please keep up. I did not say please keep it up - I am not UR wife!! lol !!

Back to the point (Please keep up).

Honda ARE successful manufacturers of lawnmowers

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20 hours ago, Publius Cornelius Scipio said:

I think that Perez has matured a lot over the last few years and seems to be well liked at Force India.

We shall see. I saw a lot of old Perez at Monoco. Anyhow, if Ricciardo goes to Ferrari, then I guess Perez remains at Force India. I gather Mercedes is happy with its two drivers, Red Bull has its junior team, no one really wants to go to McLaren, and Renault is probably holding a seat open for Alonso.

<<Ron is known for disliking southern European/ South americans, I saw an interview by the late Andrea De Cesaris recently and he was talking, among other things, about his stint at McLaren and he was saying that Ron didn't really want him there but Marlboro wanted De Cesaris in that car, he said that he knew full well before signing for McLaren that Ron didn't want Italian drivers in his team because he thought that he couldn't work with them, etc, all this to say that one has to wonder if the problems that year were all on Perez's door or if the situation was a bit more complex.>>

Andrea De Cesaris was always one of my favorites. He was extremely unfortunate not to win a race early in his career, and I wonder if he had, if that would have changed his trajectory. Had not heard about Ron's supposed biases, but not particularly surprised.

<<<...at Ferrari, McLaren, Williams, etc they are left to their own devices, you just have to look at Stroll, he does all the right things, he constantly puts his car in the right place (not all F1 drivers do that...) yet he can't overcome the difficulty of setting up his car and it really shows when you watch him drive on a straight line, yet despite all the money that his car poured inti Williams they don't seem capable of guiding him in the right direction, and I'm sure that they would really love to help him but quite simply they don't know how to appraoch this.>>

Williams is not really good at creating a "warm, loving, nurturing" environment. Their driver mis-management cost them at least two world championships (Ruetemann and Mansell/Piquet). Still, not convinced Stroll should be there. He shows some ability, but I think he got there too soon (I contend that is actually part of the problem with Kimi....lots of speed but not a great work ethic, because he got to F1 to easily).

Anyhow, Canada will be interesting. Again, not a typical track, so hard to say how the cars are going to perform.

 

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On 5/29/2017 at 3:15 PM, Sakae said:

Vettel was faster than Kimi in FP as well (almost whole weekend). The reason why he didn't get P1 was due to committing personal error going deep and lost time coming out of that turn, as opposed to being slow. I think pit-wall was ready to leave Kimi in P1 if for nothing then raising his confidence, but than something unplanned happened. Vettel was driving faster on old tires than they assumed he would, something which came up only after Kimi pitted. Had their position were reversed, it would have been Vettel pitting first. Seb lost time in pits as well this year. His LF wheel had some issue. I cannot read tea leaves, and describe this race in absolutes, but I can understand and accept Kimi's disappointment. It is true that cars behind them played their role in Ferrari's calculus.

Seb put in fastest Sector 1, Perez topped the other two.

Seb lost in pits (3rd fastest stop) 24.306 sec

Kimi 24.833 sec - (9th fastest stop)

https://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2017/05/insight-key-indicators-that-show-whether-ferrari-favoured-vettel-in-monaco-f1-gp/

 

In line with your thinking

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I wish media would find some fascination with other teams, like Mercedes and perhaps RB, how they manipulating race results in a favor of one driver, yet no one says as much as boo. Someone close to the broadcast booth claimed, that when Rosberg in the past, or Bottas now receives unfavorable orders from a pit-wall, than loud clapping in the booth is heard and medley of justifications follows. I forgot whether this was Sky or BBC, but they were reported screaming "murder" even before last Monaco race ended. Just deplorable.

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