lipstick79

Mclaren-Renault

245 posts in this topic

I just wonder what influence St. Alfonso has in all this. Seems he runs the team. Mark my words... he will sign new contract

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3 hours ago, Sakae said:

I’m not interested anymore in that conversation. As someone noted, and I concur, every one of us are entitled to our own unique interpretations, but not to the facts of the case, as those are what they are, and there are no alternative truths.

In conclusion:

  • McLaren was on decline long time before Boullier was appointed.
  • Boullier was not a team principal who could act as one.
  • Boullier was not responsible for car design and construction.
  • Boullier was not responsible for appointing Honda, nor initiating termination of their relationship.
  • Boullier has left, thus there is no point to look anywhere else but straight ahead.

My opinion: wrong person has left.

Nicely summed up

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Indeed it WAS the GREAT Mclaren saviour who WERE responsible for appointing Honda;
Ron
 Dennis - who made OVER $200 MILLION,  selling HIS Mclaren shares !!! 
To become Works team Mclaren Honda 
PLUS the money BEFORE  from  Daimler a number of years ago 
To become Works team Mclaren Mercedes

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What IS the point of Mclaren powered by Renault?
Renault are STILL, a LONG way off the pace.
Mclaren continue to make a mess of chassis design
Gone are the, second is first of the losers days - under Ron
Second IS still unachievable for Mclaren powered by Renault

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This IS how it IS
What IS a surprise is the, power of Honda
Or LACK of power.  Torro Rosso can ONLY now score points in races if,  others fall off the track (something goes wrong for others)
Torro Rosso HAVE said, the car is NOT quick enough.
Is THAT the Honda PU, OR the chasis?

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It has been claimed that Honda is about on convergency course with Renault's PU.

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It has been claimed that Red Bull gives you wings.
Is THIS going to be Red Bull Racings new fuel

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One more wheel felt off the cart at McLaren?  I have no doubt that in eyes of many this name "McLaren" meant something in the past, very distant past, however under current circumstance question then is, whether the end is near? The financial backer said bye-bye, what does that actually mean for tomorrow? I thought I will never say that, but maybe the man who should be saying bye-bye is Mr. Brown, and entice RD into return. We have one more confirmation which exonerates Boullier being accused from dragging team down.

Edited by Sakae

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Things are NOT good at the moment for McLaren.

Though. this IS F1 - things CAN (and do) change quickly

Minardi, back of grid

With Red Bull money, and Newey design - at the FRONT

Zak Brown may find something, that WILL power McLaren to the FRONT again.

Ron Dennis thought he HAD when he convinced Honda to return

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Zak Brown SHOULD get talking to Martini regarding potential sponsorship for McLaren.

With the Martini Williams deal ENDING at the end of the season

Martini COULD be persuaded to become partners with McLaren powered by Renault

Williams are NOT utilising the power of Mercedes well currently

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Wasn`t K-Mag at McLaren Mercedes, which were forced to become Mclaren Honda. With Ron Dennis as CEO.
which in turn later became McLaren powered by Renault, after Ron departed.
A period OF great change AND restructuring.
So which Mclaren do K-Mag`s comments refer to?
NOT the current, McLaren powered by Renault           

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Well I dont hold any value to Magnussen's words. So i dont care about what he says. And definitely not Mclaren and Co.Also good things are not expected from after he was fired.

I think  if Dennis is still with Mclaren, the honda divorce wouldnt have happened. But he is not. Doesnt mean they have to go back to him . No one is irreplacable. Zak is doing alright bringing the right personnels. (planned ricci to replace alonso, Key and De ferran) . The intentions to become good is there.  Currently they are in a mess they will come out of it is my thought process.

Edited by Master of his game

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Brown is with McLaren in high position for about 1.5 year. For past four months he is CEO of racing. (It is not exactly promotion from his previous role in Technology Group, is it?)

I am not as optimistic as others are here. In my world men who do move earth forward are of Frédéric Vasseur ilk, who just in short span of a few months without using big words quietly lifted Sauber from no man's land into zone of respectability. Still struggling, but demanding respect.

Perhaps I should end here, because I do not like McLaren, I do not like people there, and perhaps that's in my way to see any positives in that camp. But then, on my defense, problems we see or hear about today were observed and written about in 2015 already, so, on what element of stagnation any new optimism is based on?

Edited by Sakae

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Lots of it. Like i have already mentioned about bringing in key people and also the intention to be competitive.  As you have already known nothing works faster in F1. Mclaren have been in decline for a period of time with also honda being a part of their issues as well(learning the hybrid technology). Takes time but eventually they should come back stronger i guess. You dont like them , thats ok. but i cannot convince you to like them. good that seb is not driving for them right

Sauber yeah they are coming up because they were dead last for a couple of seasons now i guess. Frederic was fired from renault i guess (poor memory) and now he is doing a good job.  They can only come up now right with the expansion going on( financially and management wise as well)

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5 hours ago, Master of his game said:

Frederic was fired from renault i guess (poor memory) and now he is doing a good job.

I don't think he was fired from Renault.

Comments...

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8 minutes ago, Master of his game said:

Yeah you are right . Poor memory.

I am facing the same challenge, so, I understand.

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9 hours ago, lipstick79 said:

Wasn`t K-Mag at McLaren Mercedes, which were forced to become Mclaren Honda. With Ron Dennis as CEO.
which in turn later became McLaren powered by Renault, after Ron departed.
A period OF great change AND restructuring.
So which Mclaren do K-Mag`s comments refer to?
NOT the current, McLaren powered by Renault           

I think Magnussen just isn't very comfortable with a large management structure. He had similar comments about Renault where he didn't have a clear feeling of who was in charge. He is just not into all the BS and hidden politics in a large organisation and so thrives in a smaller team. I think that is just what he is trying to say and then it gets blown out of proportions by the press and feeds speculations every time.His comments are more about himself - about what he likes - than a criticism of the teams he left. He's not a political animal, just a kid who likes to race hard.

Edited by Robert Rick

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9 hours ago, Sakae said:

I am not as optimistic as others are here. In my world men who do move earth forward are of Frédéric Vasseur ilk, who just in short span of a few months without using big words quietly lifted Sauber from no man's land into zone of respectability. Still struggling, but demanding respect.

Perhaps I should end here, because I do not like McLaren, I do not like people there, and perhaps that's in my way to see any positives in that camp. But then, on my defense, problems we see or hear about today were observed and written about in 2015 already, so, on what element of stagnation any new optimism is based on?

I have the feeling that Vasseur is in a league of his own. When it comes to McLaren I think there is a tendency to regard Ron Dennis as a half god. He very clearly made a big difference for the his team but also some mistakes. Whitmarsh and Boullier take the blame but Ron placed them there and was their superior wasn't he?

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10 hours ago, Robert Rick said:

I have the feeling that Vasseur is in a league of his own. When it comes to McLaren I think there is a tendency to regard Ron Dennis as a half god. He very clearly made a big difference for the his team but also some mistakes. Whitmarsh and Boullier take the blame but Ron placed them there and was their superior wasn't he?

Boullier was not in a position to act a Team Principal, yet he was blamed by some media and fans as one. On matrix management structure in reality they all bear responsibility for that car (under)performance. There is an article about Alonso claiming that McLaren had only one upgrade this season which worked as intended. Sounds like problem is then primarily in the design office, which could explain why they are trying to get the TR guy. What puzzles me why they move to hire brains only now, despite by some accounts they had this problem for some time (years?).

Edited by Sakae

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Mclaren powered by Renault,
is a make do situation. After what really were a disaster.
The Mclaren Honda project.

Renault is unlikely to produce even a race winning PU.
This is clear from the works team.

It seems to me that, Alonso WERE carrying the works team.
To his 2 WDC`S.

The years of Renault success had 1 common factor;
External input.

RedBull Renault enjoyed the success of
Adrian Newey.  
The dominant Williams Renault (dominant
and Williams in the same sentense),  also enjoyed the same
success of Adrian Newey.

Alonso does not seem able to, and is no longer interested in carrying
Mclaren powered by Renault.

Whilst unable to produce a dominant PU.
Mclaren may be better off,   using a Clio

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Alonso impressed me today with his flying approach. It was very innovative. He messed up LeClerc's hairdo, but otherwise it was a beauty.

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