Senna

The Greatest Opening Lap In Formula One History

70 posts in this topic

Senna, answer my question about Verstappen's lap.
I think he is tired talking to you mate.
he's been doing it for over a year now, stop being a pessimist.
I was joking young man. This topic is about the great Brazilian and it shall remain on topic as long as there is air in my lungs and blood in my veins.

AR5, Senna won't answer because he's a coward, and knows whence not to step onto ground which does not favor him.

Nevertheless, you're clearly correct, Verstappen at Sepang 2001 was a blindingly brilliant lap, and required far more courage, commitment, and sustained skill to overtake that many cars in far more extreme conditions than Senna faced at Donington Park, but the myth makers and nostaglists among us insist on holding up a single event to immortalize the legend of Senna's great wet-weather triumphs.

Don't misunderstand me, I'm not suggesting that Senna wasn't very likely the greatest wet-weather and/or dry weather driver in the history of the sport (in all likelihood he was), but Verstappen was also extremely well rated as a first lap phenom, and never-more-so than in terrible conditions such as they had in Maylaysia 2001. His opening lap that day outshines Senna's Donnington first lap for pure excitement and overtaking genius, but over the totality of their career, I think it is largely without debate that Senna was the greatest wet weather specialist that F1 has ever seen.

But just don't expect "our" Senna to engage in any debate he might risk losing - his ego simply couldn't take it.........

Edited by funkejay

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AR5, Senna won't answer because he's a coward, and knows whence not to step onto ground which does not favor him.

Nevertheless, you're clearly correct, Verstappen at Sepang 2001 was a blindingly brilliant lap, and required far more courage, commitment, and sustained skill to overtake that many cars in far more extreme conditions than Senna faced at Donington Park, but the myth makers and nostaglists among us insist on holding up a single event to immortalize the legend of Senna's great wet-weather triumphs.

Don't misunderstand me, I'm not suggesting that Senna wasn't very likely the greatest wet-weather and/or dry weather driver in the history of the sport (in all likelihood he was), but Verstappen was also extremely well rated as a first lap phenom, and never-more-so than in terrible conditions such as they had in Maylaysia 2001. His opening lap that day outshines Senna's Donnington first lap for pure excitement and overtaking genius, but over the totality of their career, I think it is largely without debate that Senna was the greatest wet weather specialist that F1 has ever seen.

But just don't expect "our" Senna to engage in any debate he might risk losing - his ego simply couldn't take it.........

:lol:

I have reservations over this topic. Firstly, if we are to discuss it seriously we should start an entirely new topic. Secondly, it is a dubious matter. How are we to decide which is the best start? Is the best start the one in which the most cars were overtaken? If so, we must look at a situation where a top driver in a top car found himself at the back of the grid and quickly made up places. That would seem reasonable. However, is that really a great start? For we must surely consider why the driver was at the back in the first place and also assess the quality of opposition in terms of man and machine he faced in such a lowly, unnatural position. Then if we go to the other extreme we might say that a clean start from pole is the greatest. However, this hardly seems satisfactory either. We could consider endless permutations or dismiss the subject entirely. The later option seems more sensible.
Edited by Senna

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Avoiding the issue...figures...

Read my post again. I am not avoiding the issue at all. I simply don

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All I want is an opinion on how you think Verstappen did on that lap, im not asking you to determine if it is the best lap ever.

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Yes, a very impressive start but Fizzy is forced to start from the back of the grid as he didn

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The wet weather is the great equaliser in F1 and Senna showed how great he was on that occasion. It is an awsome display of driving ability.

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Donington 1993 has been one of the first F.1 races I've seen...I remember I was shocked when I saw it..a masterpiece in F.1 history no doubts about it!!Although less significant,Michael Schumacher victory in Spa 1995 starting 16th is another pearl in F.1 and even Spa 1997 has been an unforgettable performance by Michael in the wet.

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The wet weather is the great equaliser in F1 and Senna showed how great he was on that occasion. It is an awsome display of driving ability.

Wet weather brings out the best in great drivers and clearly separates them from the rest.

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Wet weather brings out the best in great drivers and clearly separates them from the rest.

Indeed. What makes Donington

Edited by Senna

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Wet weather brings out the best in great drivers and clearly separates them from the rest.

Yes of course..in the wet all that counts is sensibility.But there havebeen also drivers which were very good at wet races (like Vittorio Brambilla or Jean Alesi) and were not as good in normal circumstances.They were very sensible drivers,they felt very much every single car feeling,but maybe they didn't have the same racecraft as other top drivers had.

Rubinho and Fisi are great drivers in wet conditions (see Rubens poles at Spa 1994 in a Jordan or at Magny Cours 1999 in a Stewart and Fisi's pole at Zeltweg 1998 in a Benetton),but they have not the same racecraft of a Schumacher or an Alonso..

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If you watch the video of that race at Donington you can hear Senna's traction control working like crazy, while Prost and the others were tiptoing around he knew that he could floor it and the traction control would do the rest.

Another example of his great driving in the wet was his overtaking manouver on Mansell at Spa in 1985 on cold tyres when they'd just pitted for slick tyres.

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senna is the greatest quilifer if the world, he is better at quali than the race, if he doesnt get pole he pretty much cant win and clealy does not have the fastest car.

If he qualfies 2 seconds slower than pole, his car is about 3 (or drives around 3) seconds slower (at least) than pole man. He finshed ahead at about 1 sec per lap ahead of hill so really he was averaging 3+1 second at lap faster the champoins (hill and prost ) in the wet alone.

becase it is wet he goes 4 seconds faster per lap than the best drivers in the world!

Edited by jackgarrett

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