mock 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 (GMM) Kimi Raikkonen is better than twice world champion Mika Hakkinen. 2007 McLaren driver Fernando Alonso is 'truly an exceptional driver'. Mercedes-Benz engine chief Mario Illien, however, did not use the same sort of superlatives for the other racer in silver overalls -- Juan Pablo Montoya. ''Losing the constructors' championship was down to Montoya,'' Illien told Italy's Autosprint magazine. ''He should have brought home more points. ''Montoya made mistakes that a driver of his experience should not make.'' http://formula-1.updatesport.com/news/arti...ntoya/view.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jem of the Shire 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 This has already been discussed, someone delete it! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mock 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 This has already been discussed, someone delete it! I seem to have missed that thread - where / under which topic was it discussed ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jem of the Shire 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 Its in the 'Ron claims we all have a lot of time for monty' topic Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jenson_Rules 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 what is said is all soo true! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jem of the Shire 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 Come on ben Ilien is the guy who builds the engines, and he's got the cheek to say jpm cost mclaren the title, its the unreliability of the engines that cost mclaren the title!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jenson_Rules 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 the mistakes montoya made were also 'helpful' were they not? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narain fan 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 Come on ben Ilien is the guy who builds the engines, and he's got the cheek to say jpm cost mclaren the title, its the unreliability of the engines that cost mclaren the title!! this is exactly what ilien is trying to tell how many times merc engines blew when mclaren were running strong and heading for a victory and a potential 1-2 and how many times monty made mistakes when mclaren were headed for a 1-2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jem of the Shire 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 If it werent for all the engine problems, kimi wouldnt have had 3 or 4 grid penalties. monty cost mclaren a 1-2 in turkey, and thats about it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narain fan 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 If it werent for all the engine problems, kimi wouldnt have had 3 or 4 grid penalties. monty cost mclaren a 1-2 in turkey, and thats about it. JPM's mistakes in 2005:Australia (spun but continued), Canada (DSQ), Germany (Qualifying error), Turkey (left the circuit and allowed Alonso through), Belgium (incident with Pizzonia which was largely but not exclusively the Brazilian’s fault), Japan (crashed after incident with Villeneuve), China (hit a drain cover which all the other drivers avoided, many knowingly so) etc. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jem of the Shire 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 That is a pathetic list of 'mistakes'. - mclaren took blame for canada pit-stop error - belgium was entirely pizzonia's fault, we all know that - villeneuve ran jpm off the road in japan. were u even watching or are you thick? -jpm clearly had no idea the drain cover was loose cos he was right behind kimi and used more kerb. I can accept the germany quali spin was his own error. He more than made up for it with his brilliant drive from last to 2nd in the race. Your stupidity is quite irritating Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narain fan 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 That is a pathetic list of 'mistakes'.- mclaren took blame for canada pit-stop error - belgium was entirely pizzonia's fault, we all know that - villeneuve ran jpm off the road in japan. were u even watching or are you thick? -jpm clearly had no idea the drain cover was loose cos he was right behind kimi and used more kerb. I can accept the germany quali spin was his own error. He more than made up for it with his brilliant drive from last to 2nd in the race. Your stupidity is quite irritating now that yoy have no points to defend montoya ,you start personally attacking me Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jem of the Shire 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 now that yoy have no points to defend montoya I just made a load of points to defend him, what are you on about!!! You used senna's ridiculous list of incidents most of which werent jpm's fault at all Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chris Strange 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 Mario Illien is (arguably) right, JPM must rise his game if he wants to stay at Mc Laren, it's simple as that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wez 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 The Mercedes engines made more "mistakes" in 2005 than JPM ever will in his entire career. Also Remember that Kimi himself stuffed up on several occations (farming in Hockinheim, skiing in China...) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jem of the Shire 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 Regardless of mistakes made by whoever, a major member of a team should not make these comments about another team member. Its unproffesional, needless, and I wonder what Ilien is trying to achieve by coming out with this. F1 is a team sport; - mclaren not winning the WCC cannot be blamed solely on 1 person. Looks to me like he's just trying to shift the blame cos his engines are faulty Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Senna 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 That is a pathetic list of 'mistakes'.(1) - mclaren took blame for canada pit-stop error (2) - belgium was entirely pizzonia's fault, we all know that (3) - villeneuve ran jpm off the road in japan. were u even watching or are you thick? (4) -jpm clearly had no idea the drain cover was loose cos he was right behind kimi and used more kerb. I can accept the germany quali spin was his own error. He more than made up for it with his brilliant drive from last to 2nd in the race. Your stupidity is quite irritating (1) It was obviously driver error; JPM simply ignored the red light, and was rightly disqualified. He almost had a collision when exiting the pits too. (2) It was largely (not but exclusively) Pizzonia Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 Regardless of mistakes made by whoever, a major member of a team should not make these comments about another team member. Its unproffesional, needless, and I wonder what Ilien is trying to achieve by coming out with this. F1 is a team sport; - mclaren not winning the WCC cannot be blamed solely on 1 person. Looks to me like he's just trying to shift the blame cos his engines are faulty Indeed, I agree with you no professional F1 outfit would come out the way Don Dennis and Ilien have. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narain fan 0 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 Indeed, I agree with you no professional F1 outfit would come out the way Don Dennis and Ilien have. so, any opportunity to hurt mclaren ,and u are ready ,then and there Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pumpdoc 2 Report post Posted January 13, 2006 (1) It was obviously driver error; JPM simply ignored the red light, and was rightly disqualified. He almost had a collision when exiting the pits too.(2) It was largely (not but exclusively) Pizzonia Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nojvnof1 0 Report post Posted January 14, 2006 ''Losing the constructors' championship was down to Montoya,'' Illien told Italy's Autosprint magazine. ''He should have brought home more points. JPM's errors were part of the reason they failed to win the WCC. He seems to forget the number of engine failures Kimi had and the team's slow start to 2005 allowing Renault a major head start. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UrKo 0 Report post Posted January 14, 2006 JPM made some mistakes last year, but still not so many as Mario Illien. I wonder why Mercedes has finally start building its own engines!?!! Answer: cuz of Mario Illien who don't know how to make an engine Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dribbler 6 Report post Posted January 14, 2006 McLaren would do well to remember that they are a team and win or lose as such. Why is it that an organisation as well oiled as Woking, and who obviously have had post season meetings with everyone involved, at all levels, allow this sort of Sh#t stirring idiocy to filter through to the press? They were ALL to blame. Kimi, Juan Pablo, Mercedes and Ron no doubt should regroup and get on with it. The past is like an old book; once you have read it you should throw it away. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Max Mosley 2 Report post Posted January 14, 2006 (1) It was obviously driver error; JPM simply ignored the red light, and was rightly disqualified. He almost had a collision when exiting the pits too.(2) It was largely (not but exclusively) Pizzonia Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Senna 0 Report post Posted January 14, 2006 Indeed. He also made few if any attempts to help Kimi and was insufficiently fit to race for a whole season and play a game of tennis. JPM did not help Kimi once. He helped Renault and Alonso quite a few times though... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites