tifosi too!

Alonso Penalised For Qualifying!!!

128 posts in this topic

He claims that the Dutchman had deliberately blocked him and swerved in front of him at the next corner.

His claims are wrong then, otherwise the Friday tester would have been handed a punishment too.

Watching this video you can easily say FA deserve the penalty. What was he thinking of blocking like that???!!!!

If he wont win the title it's only coz of the stupidity that he did. MS for sure looks very happy right now....

O i just hope MS will spin out smash his car and start from P22 :P:P:P . This way we could watch both of them fighting from the back and some1 else would win the race....Like Webber maybe :lol::lol::lol:

He's retired from 66% of races... Webber can't win. -_-

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Even the kids when playing a game decide what r the rules and penalties...

Right, the next person to post has to give me

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Why does anyone think it is harsh?

The point here is safety. Drivers are always trying to do anything to make their job safer and what Fernando did was dangerous beyond belief.

He weaved into the path of Doornbos at incredibly high speeds on the main straight. Think back to the last time you saw two drivers fighting close on the track and how in corners they'd look close and then on the main straights they'd seem a mile apart. With that in perspective Alonso did get dangerously close and compared to him Doornbos does not have that much experience.

Not only did he weave dangerously but brake tested and the only way to get this childish and dangerous behaviour out of F1 is to penalise it so no one will act up.

The stewards did very good, and punishments and rule breaking are better described than you may think.

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Why does anyone think it is harsh?

The point here is safety. Drivers are always trying to do anything to make their job safer and what Fernando did was dangerous beyond belief.

He weaved into the path of Doornbos at incredibly high speeds on the main straight. Think back to the last time you saw two drivers fighting close on the track and how in corners they'd look close and then on the main straights they'd seem a mile apart. With that in perspective Alonso did get dangerously close and compared to him Doornbos does not have that much experience.

Not only did he weave dangerously but brake tested and the only way to get this childish and dangerous behaviour out of F1 is to penalise it so no one will act up.

The stewards did very good, and punishments and rule breaking are better described than you may think.

I think, if i may say, you are missing the point. I don't think that anyone is saying that he shouldn't be punished, just that there need to be some understandable consitency in the punishment.

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I think, if i may say, you are missing the point. I don't think that anyone is saying that he shouldn't be punished, just that there need to be some understandable consitency in the punishment.

How can I miss the point when I say:

"The stewards did very good, and punishments and rule breaking are better described than you may think."

That covers that particular point nicely.

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I think, if i may say, you are missing the point. I don't think that anyone is saying that he shouldn't be punished, just that there need to be some understandable consitency in the punishment.

There is more consistency than ever the season with the FIA's introduction of a permanent race steward - a move I had been requesting for years - in Tony Scott Andrews...

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There is more consistency than ever the season with the FIA's introduction of a permanent race steward - a move I had been requesting for years - in Tony Scott Andrews...

Very true and the stewards follow the rulebooks which do state the maximum and minimum penalties that can be given for particular behaviours. You can't be any more specific with this behaviour as there are many different circumstances it happens under and different times. For example should he brake test Michael and weave in front of him during qualifying when the championship is on more equal terms it would be viewed differently to now.

The stewards do a good job when in the past behaviour like this has been allowed to happen unpunished.

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How can I miss the point when I say:

"The stewards did very good, and punishments and rule breaking are better described than you may think."

That covers that particular point nicely.

I think you miss the point because you asked "why do people think it's harsh?" and i maintain that it is harsh because it an arbitrary punishment which has been handed out at a pivotal point in the championship.

Being punished is not harsh. Once again, i agree that he should be punished i just think it should be in black and white and not discretionary i.e

'A driver who is being deemed to be intentionally driving dangerously in practice sessions will be penalised two seconds in proceeding qualifying sessions'.

Is anything similar written down anywhere in any kind of rule book? You say they are better described than i may think, can you demonstrate this?

You can't be any more specific with this behaviour as there are many different circumstances it happens under and different times. .

I disagree. Any kind of activity which falls outside the normal practice of driving a lap quickly and professionally could be deemed as dangerous and shoud be punished with a specific penalty.

These aren't kids going karting, they are supposed to be the best in the world and drive responsibly.

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I think you miss the point because you asked "why do people think it's harsh?" and i maintain that it is harsh because it an arbitrary punishment which has been handed out at a pivotal point in the championship.

Being punished is not harsh. Once again, i agree that he should be punished i just think it should be in black and white and not discretionary i.e

'A driver who is being deemed to be intentionally driving dangerously in practice sessions will be penalised two seconds in proceeding qualifying sessions'.

Is anything similar written down anywhere in any kind of rule book? You say they are better described than i may think, can you demonstrate this?

The stewards noted that the rules state that "manoeuvres liable to hinder other drivers such as premature changes of direction, more than one change of direction, deliberate crowding of cars towards the inside or the outside of the curve or any other abnormal change of direction, are strictly prohibited and shall be penalised, according to the importance and repetition of the offences, by penalties ranging from a fine to the exclusion from the race. The repetition of dangerous driving, even involuntary, may result in the exclusion from the race".

To be any more specific is crazy you can't count for everything that could be done, nor the varying nature of it. I wasn't talking to you specifically with my comments, but reminding those that think he shouldn't be punished in this manner that he should be. Next time someone follows the same behaviour I expect them to be punished in a similar manner. However this is the first time someone has done this in front of the new stewards - one of which as Dan pointed out is at every race - so give them a break.

On you other comments: so I expect you think Alonso should go to the back of the grid like MS did for his driving in Monaco?

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I think you miss the point because you asked "why do people think it's harsh?" and i maintain that it is harsh because it an arbitrary punishment which has been handed out at a pivotal point in the championship.

Being punished is not harsh. Once again, i agree that he should be punished i just think it should be in black and white and not discretionary i.e

'A driver who is being deemed to be intentionally driving dangerously in practice sessions will be penalised two seconds in proceeding qualifying sessions'.

Is anything similar written down anywhere in any kind of rule book? You say they are better described than i may think, can you demonstrate this?

You have a point, but the FIA cannot legislate for every type of offence, not least road rage. When MS was demoted to the back of the grid at Monaco no one said the punishment was arbitrary, it was just accepted that MS was out of order and punished accordingly.

Get over it :yawn:

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I think you miss the point because you asked "why do people think it's harsh?" and i maintain that it is harsh because it an arbitrary punishment which has been handed out at a pivotal point in the championship.

Going by the precendent of Montoya having all his times cancelled at Monaco last year, it's a lenient penalty.

Being punished is not harsh. Once again, i agree that he should be punished i just think it should be in black and white and not discretionary i.e

'A driver who is being deemed to be intentionally driving dangerously in practice sessions will be penalised two seconds in proceeding qualifying sessions'.

Is anything similar written down anywhere in any kind of rule book? You say they are better described than i may think, can you demonstrate this?

I disagree. Any kind of activity which falls outside the normal practice of driving a lap quickly and professionally could be deemed as dangerous and shoud be punished with a specific penalty.

These aren't kids going karting, they are supposed to be the best in the world and drive responsibly.

There cannot be a rule book. How will you have penalties? Take brake testing, you will have a 100 page booklet detailing different kinds of brake testing? On a straight, in a tunnel, in a straight tunnel, at a hairpin, at 130R, at the pit lane entrance. How far will you go with this 'rulebook'? It will always be subjective, what is necessary is having consistency, which we have had this year. Why are people complaining about arbitrary penalties now? Where were you to complain when Fisichella and Villeneuve had arbitrary qualifying times docked. What will be your formal procedure for that?

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To be any more specific is crazy you can't count for everything that could be done, nor the varying nature of it. I wasn't talking to you specifically with my comments, but reminding those that think he shouldn't be punished in this manner that he should be. Next time someone follows the same behaviour I expect them to be punished in a similar manner. However this is the first time someone has done this in front of the new stewards - one of which as Dan pointed out is at every race - so give them a break.

On you other comments: so I expect you think Alonso should go to the back of the grid like MS did for his driving in Monaco?

Without labouring the point, i just think that there could be more consistency, that' all. I don't think it would be that difficult to categorise driving activities under specific headings and therefore have standard issue penalties.

If FA had comitted the offence during qualifying then yes i believe he should have been penalised by going to the back of the grid. That would have demonstrated consistency.

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Without labouring the point, i just think that there could be more consistency, that' all. I don't think it would be that difficult to categorise driving activities under specific headings and therefore have standard issue penalties.

If FA had comitted the offence during qualifying then yes i believe he should have been penalised by going to the back of the grid. That would have demonstrated consistency.

I suggest you go to the Fernando Fan thread and see why giving out the same penalties for the same crimes doesn't always work.

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Going by the precendent of Montoya having all his times cancelled at Monaco last year, it's a lenient penalty.

I guess one could argue that the Montoya incident had set a precedent of sorts.

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Going by the precendent of Montoya having all his times cancelled at Monaco last year, it's a lenient penalty.

There cannot be a rule book. How will you have penalties? Take brake testing, you will have a 100 page booklet detailing different kinds of brake testing? On a straight, in a tunnel, in a straight tunnel, at a hairpin, at 130R, at the pit lane entrance. How far will you go with this 'rulebook'? It will always be subjective, what is necessary is having consistency, which we have had this year. Why are people complaining about arbitrary penalties now? Where were you to complain when Fisichella and Villeneuve had arbitrary qualifying times docked. What will be your formal procedure for that?

I'm obviously missing something Cav'. Brake testing is brake testing. Why does there have to be a 100 page booklet. If the telemetry says brake testing then hand out a brake testing penalty. Is that difficult?

(BTW, i preferred your old avatar :P )

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Brake testing when a driver get's injured, when his car is destroyed and has to get into a T car, when he just has to swerve, brake testing from 200 kph, from 300 kph, in a race, in qualifying, it's all very different.

I like my new avatar though B) Which reminds me, 20ish days until the album is released, I better pre order :D

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Brake testing when a driver get's injured, when his car is destroyed and has to get into a T car, when he just has to swerve, brake testing from 200 kph, from 300 kph, in a race, in qualifying, it's all very different.

I like my new avatar though B) Which reminds me, 20ish days until the album is released, I better pre order :D

That's like saying someone could get murdered with an axe, a knife, a gun etc and could get a different punishment. The crime has still been comitted and should carry a fixed penalty, in my opinion.

I didn't realise Bob was still alive... :naughty:

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Alive and kicking, his last 2 albums were among his best :D

Even for murder, there is a minimum punishment and a maximum punishment, and first, second degree murder, mansluaghter, accidents etc etc. Still subjective. Where's a lawyer when you need one?

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Minimum punishment for murder appears to be only one year though. :blink:

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MS gets the same... so yes stewards are consistant. :thbup:

Very surprised by the stewards...Good job :thbup::thbup:

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MS gets the same... so yes stewards are consistant. :thbup:

How are they consistant, FA comitted 2 infractions=2 sec. MS commits 1 infraction= 2 sec. Yeah thats consistant. I think we should say FIARenault now!!!!!!!!

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How are they consistant, FA comitted 2 infractions=2 sec. MS commits 1 infraction= 2 sec. Yeah thats consistant. I think we should say FIARenault now!!!!!!!!

Overtaking under red flag should give him 5sec penalty and a fee!!!

The name FIArrari stays and I dont see any changes in the nearest future.

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Overtaking under red flag should give him 5sec penalty and a fee!!!

The name FIArrari stays and I dont see any changes in the nearest future.

I think you even know it is scam. Unless their is a penalty for passing under the red or if its a stewards discretion. If its the stewards decision like I said its a scam. Should be 1 sec to remain consistant :angry:

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