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narain fan

Villeneuve Slams Schumacher Over 'Lies'

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Kenneth is taking a 7 day leave............

Thanks although this forum is growing in numbers with those kind of posters. All us older posters (well from 2005 backwards) seem to get along just fine...

Ofcourse also some of the newbies too but most of them are :wacko:

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A wasted talent for sure, a true world champion no doubt, and a sad end to what could have and should have been a glorious career save for one or two critically erroneous decisions.

Good post mate, however......

I agree that JV placed too much faith in Pollock, but he was effectively Pollock's whore :o Pollock shafted him and ensured he got paid handsomely for the priviledge.

The key chapters in JV's career that made an impression on me were as follows;

1. Jerez 1997 :thbup:

2. Joining BAR and getting caught up in all that BS that they would win their 1st race and then going on to record nil point all season :thbdn:

3. Bad mouthing JB before the guy had even joined the team and then getting comprehensively trounced by JB :thbdn:

4. Refusing to defer his lucrative final year in exchange for a 1 year sabatical and two years at a reduced rate at BAR. This may have been bs by DR but JV never gave his side of the story :thbdn:

5 Woeful performance at Renault :thbdn:

6. Sauber :thbdn:

7. BMW :thbdn:

As the saying goes, you make your bed and lie in it and never cry over spilt milk.

For all you JV fans this will be my last comment on matters JV, I really dont care much for the guy and wont waste my time arguing with fanatical supporters. All that matters to me is MS is 10 points behind FA, 5 races to go and a very real chance of an 8th WDC.

It is always best to focus on the positive rather than the negative

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4. Refusing to defer his lucrative final year in exchange for a 1 year sabatical and two years at a reduced rate at BAR. This may have been bs by DR but JV never gave his side of the story :thbdn:

do u think he should have driven for free,and risk being trounced by buttomn in '04 :laughing:

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and you all don't gonna miss a character that talks like that....

i agree fully with all he said and it's true ........

there's no more to say he said everything ......

There is the old Villeneuve we know always trying to make someone else look bad too him make look good.Listen at least Schu's name will be mentioned well old JV he will be remembered as the dude that only once won the championship and complained about things around him because he never got anywhere with life after Williams!

Kenneth dont be ignorant!

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Vinsane, I hope you will reconsider your decision to leave. You remind me of another poster that has left us (Funkejay) and I'd hate to see two quality posters leave (though I can understand why sometimes...).

Either way, you have given us two fine posts. :thbup:

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Afterall, Villeneuve had the courage to ease out his wounded heart after his knockout from Formula 1. Your wise decision is to go back to music.

Schumi - the shrewd, the racer, the mind-gamer, 7 times world champion, are you somewhere close to it - Mr Villenueve? hmm? If you cannot break a record, atleast you can break the strings of a guitar :D

I am happy you spat it out, Schumi's fame is hard to digest (we all know that :naughty: ) you need a pacifier (cry baby)

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Vinsane, I hope you will reconsider your decision to leave. You remind me of another poster that has left us (Funkejay) and I'd hate to see two quality posters leave (though I can understand why sometimes...).

Either way, you have given us two fine posts. :thbup:

who said funke has left.do u dream about tf1 :P

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JV is sounding bitter. Who wouldn't sound bitter after the Sh#t he did with BAR? Should have left them after 2001, when he had the chance.

JV also demanded way too much money for what BAR were back in the day, though he did help found them.

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who said funke has left.do u dream about tf1 :P

I am guessing he left, but with his profession, he's probably insanely busy. My brother-in-law is in the same line of work and is frequently working long hours. For whatever the reason, we haven't had the benefit of his opinions for a while and Vinsane would have filled the gap somewhat, don't you think?

We seem to have lost monza for a bit, too....the nerve of people to have a life! ;)

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Jacques Villeneuve has criticised BMW Sauber's decision to replace him.

The French-Canadian, who won the world championship with Williams in 1997, said his successor at the team - 21-year-old Robert Kubica - is a dubious choice if the German team want to win in 2007.

"As of now, he doesn't have much racing experience," Villeneive told F1 Racing magazine. "Experience is always important because racing involves getting yourself out of tricky situations -- and it's easier to get out of them if you've learnt from how you did and didn't get out of them."

Villeneuve also warned against judging the rookie Pole until he has notched up more experience than Friday practice miles and one race.

"People should realise that doing a good Friday job isn't the same as doing a good job on race weekends," he insisted, "and you won't find out what any driver is really like until he does quite a few race weekends. So Robert is a question mark."

:thbdn:

This is the latest of frustration from JV after being kicked out of F1. :lol:

Some people don't seem to learn and get along with the hardships in life. :P

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:nono1:

Yes, I am truly aware of the fact that Michael was 2nd in the standing but the world knows he has the potential of fighting his way back to the top even from a 25 point deficit. :D

Senna fans say that Senna could have won in 94 if it wasn't for his death. Even then Senna wasn't leading the championship and could've won.

Whatever!!! :yawn::yawn::yawn:

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Whatever!!! :yawn::yawn::yawn:

I'm sorry Wez but Fernando Alonso isn't everything. If Michael Schumacher wins the World Championship this year that would be fighting down a 19 point gap to take it which would be incredible and I can't see someone like Fernando doing this if you are yawning at the fact that you don't believe drivers only like Schumacher can do this. Fernando is a great driver but is yet to have done this but I will agree with you if you said he hasn't been in that situation before. I still don't believe he could do that.

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I'm sorry Wez but Fernando Alonso isn't everything. If Michael Schumacher wins the World Championship this year that would be fighting down a 19 point gap to take it which would be incredible and I can't see someone like Fernando doing this if you are yawning at the fact that you don't believe drivers only like Schumacher can do this. Fernando is a great driver but is yet to have done this but I will agree with you if you said he hasn't been in that situation before. I still don't believe he could do that.

Fernando is the youngest ever race-winner and F1 World Champion...I don't believe M$ could do that... :D

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I'm new here, a JV and F1 fan. It's hard to add anything to this debate but will add my two cents anyways (that's what forums are for aren't they!).

Fed up:

When JV raced for Renault at the end of 2004 after sitting out the entire season, I agree the first two races he was well off Alonso's pace but he was lapping within a tenth of Alonso in Brazil-I'm not sure if Fisi is doing that too often lately and Fisi is a pretty decent driver in most people's minds.

Greatest Schumi fan:

Do you not think BMW is taking a bit of a gamble putting Kubica in for next year, he is a rookie afterall and unproven in F1! These are just plain facts! At least with Villeneuve they know they are getting a guy at least as fast as Heidi but with tremendous experience. If I were running a team I might give the rookie another year to hone his craft and have the veteran pass off more of his experience. I guess we'll see next year.

Autoracer5: Did JV demand the money from BAR or was he offered it?

Vinsane: Your posts are longer than my thesis! Very nice to read.

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JV is sounding bitter. Who wouldn't sound bitter after the Sh#t he did with BAR? Should have left them after 2001, when he had the chance.

JV also demanded way too much money for what BAR were back in the day, though he did help found them.

when they put all that money into the car, things got better! atleast they finished 2nd in constructors!!!

I'm new here, a JV and F1 fan. It's hard to add anything to this debate but will add my two cents anyways (that's what forums are for aren't they!).

Fed up:

When JV raced for Renault at the end of 2004 after sitting out the entire season, I agree the first two races he was well off Alonso's pace but he was lapping within a tenth of Alonso in Brazil-I'm not sure if Fisi is doing that too often lately and Fisi is a pretty decent driver in most people's minds.

Greatest Schumi fan:

Do you not think BMW is taking a bit of a gamble putting Kubica in for next year, he is a rookie afterall and unproven in F1! These are just plain facts! At least with Villeneuve they know they are getting a guy at least as fast as Heidi but with tremendous experience. If I were running a team I might give the rookie another year to hone his craft and have the veteran pass off more of his experience. I guess we'll see next year.

Autoracer5: Did JV demand the money from BAR or was he offered it?

Vinsane: Your posts are longer than my thesis! Very nice to read.

has he already signed???

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The key chapters in JV's career that made an impression on me were as follows;

1. Jerez 1997 :thbup:

2. Joining BAR and getting caught up in all that BS that they would win their 1st race and then going on to record nil point all season :thbdn:

3. Bad mouthing JB before the guy had even joined the team and then getting comprehensively trounced by JB :thbdn:

4. Refusing to defer his lucrative final year in exchange for a 1 year sabatical and two years at a reduced rate at BAR. This may have been bs by DR but JV never gave his side of the story :thbdn:

5 Woeful performance at Renault :thbdn:

6. Sauber :thbdn:

7. BMW :thbdn:

You don't care much for JV?? You don't say... one positive note is all that comes to mind. No mention of Albert Park 96, Estoril 96, Indy 500 win, etc... JV had much more than one success story in his career.

In response to your other points:

2. I agree that the BAR debacle was the most negative thing to ever happen to JV and effectively ruined his career. But hey, hindsight is always 20-20. It really didn't seem to be such a ludicrous venture at the time.

3. I also agree that JV shouldn't have lashed out at Button so publicly -- he later reaped what he sowed. 03 was just a mess for Jacques. It was really the beginning of this sad ending being witnessed.

4. You actually believe this?? I'll give DR one thing, he's a heck of a spin-doctor. See my corporate push-out theory in the other thread... this was just a part of DR's ruse to be politically correct in kicking JV's arse out of BAR ASAP.

5. Flav and Pat would say otherwise. And if I may so boldly submit: jumping into a new team with 3 races left and after a year off will tend to tarnish your skills to some extent. Even still he was but a tenth off Alonso's pace by the last race of the season. No rabbits pulled out of hats, but he did as well as could be expected under the circumstances.

6. First half of 05, agree... second half disagree. Again, new team, new style/culture, minimal testing, radically different electronics (a la Ferrari)... an adjustment phase is only natural. Even Schumi was nothing special by his standards in his first season at Maranello.

7. Disagree... another relationship doomed from the start. And given this he still equalled or bettered the great German hope in the majority of races. Even if you take this as subjective, you cannot honestly assert that Nick soundly outperformed Jacques overall.

And with regards to some of the comments about JV taking too much $$ at BAR and thus stunting their ability to test and succeed... see #4 above. DR's stories were damn good indeed. Money was never an issue at BAR. Both BAT and Honda have some of the deepest pockets in the biz. Their annual budget is in the $200 mil range. JV's $20 mil price-tag was well below Schumi's purported $50 mil. Kimi will probably double the $20 mil with his next deal. And even sticking within the BAR context, look how they broke out the check-book to steal Butts from Frank... for these big teams 'money ain't a thing'.

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Vinsane: an addition to your point 6) Sauber was unwilling to let Jacques set the car up to his liking in the first part of the season. Sauber took to the Religion of the Windtunnel with gusto and it wasn't until mid-season that they let Jacques have a say in car set-up. Surprise, surprise, that is just when Jacques started to 'improve'.

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Vinsane: an addition to your point 6) Sauber was unwilling to let Jacques set the car up to his liking in the first part of the season. Sauber took to the Religion of the Windtunnel with gusto and it wasn't until mid-season that they let Jacques have a say in car set-up. Surprise, surprise, that is just when Jacques started to 'improve'.

Thanks Autumn :thbup: -- Sauber were indeed incredibly mechanical with their set-ups and so restrictive with JV. And the evidence of this for all the doubters lies in the massive scale of the 'improvement'. As soon as Peter gave JV the green light to try things 'his way' and gave him the freedom to work with Giampaolo to set the car to his liking, he went from miles off Massa to beating him regularly in the 2nd half in the span of a couple of races. Then Felipe started to bust out the "if I had x, y, and z had happened I could have beat Jacques" spiel. The turnaround was quite dramatic. Heck, even MT gave JV props for getting up to speed in the 2nd half, although I tend to think it was more of an empty justification for keeping him onboard (since he couldn't break the contract right away) rather than heartfelt praise.

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Massa says Schu better than Villeneuve - 21 August 2006

A well-placed Felipe Massa has chimed-in on departed F1 racer Jacques Villeneuve's recent tirade against Michael Schumacher.

At Sauber and subsequently Ferrari this year and last, Brazilian youngster Massa was teammate to both Villeneuve and Schumacher, who between 1994 and 2004 captured eight out of eleven titles.

After sharing a team with Villeneuve in 2005, he said seven time champion Schumacher - his Ferrari teammate in 2006 - is the better driver.

'Jacques is a very good driver with a lot of talent,' 25-year-old Massa is quoted as saying by Eurosport Automagazin, 'but Michael is simply better.

'He always does what is necessary. It is difficult to name another driver of his calibre.'

In the now well-known 'F1 Racing' interview, 1997 title winner Villeneuve claimed that 37-year-old Schumacher 'thinks he's better than the rest of us'.

'He thinks he's bigger than the sport, too, but he isn't,' the French Canadian insisted. 'And when he retires, and no one really remembers him, that will become clear.'

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That really speaks for itself. Massa has been a teamate with both and states the obvious. Jacques obviously (i'll use the past tense here now) was a amazing driver but lacked that factor of being a remembered champion. :lol:

1 times world champions are forgotton about eh? :king::thbdn:

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Defending Jacques's Attack On Schumi

Saturday August 19 2006

After much criticism from some P-F1 readers, the Jacques Villeneuve fans have finally come out to have their say...

Jacques Is Spot On

Doubtless the other letters on this page will be full of JV-you-are-out-of-F1-now-MS-has-won-7-championships-who-are-you-to-say-that-blah-blah-blah. Truth is he just says what so many others think but are too scared to say.

He says what he thinks and is entitled to voice his opinion, as are all the pro-Schumi 'howlers' that flood this letters page every time someone dares criticise the great Schumacher, usually after he has done something stupid. From his illegal traction control and fuel fillers in 1994 until Monaco 2006 he has been using underhand tactics and more than once turned the championship into a farce.

I don't care if he wins 16 titles he will never be Senna or Prost caliber. I'm pleased to think his stay in F1 will soon be over and the quicker he is forgotten the better.

I think JV isn't the only F1 insider who thinks so....

Edward Foster

...Well said Jaques!!! At last, someone who is prepared to stand and talk!

The sooner that cheating German git and his chum Bernie ride off into the sunset to have babies together, and brag about how much money they each made from the sport at any cost, the better for F1. Let us not forget what he did to Jacques, Damon, Mika, Rubens (let me finish first said Michael, and hey presto!....) etc etc.

He is quite correct, MS is not a sportsman, and a lot of his wins are by default or cheating.

A good driver? Yes excellent. A good person? ....do me a favour!

Steve Smith

...I'm backing JV on this one. The German has no personality, in fact my cat has more!

JV is trying to say that he disapproves of Schumi's tactics, his integrity. 3 Times now (Adelaide, Jerez, Monaco) he has brought the sport into disrepute and got away virtually scot-free (with the exception of his fisticuffs with David Coulthard ahem!).

Without JV and JPM the sport will now be boring, there won't be any personalities in the paddock, they'll either be 20-year-olds who are too naive to say anything or 38-year-old has-beens that are only winning because they got the best car!

Ben Mitchell

...Irrespective of what you think about JV, his comments about Schumacher are still accurate!

The Shoe has made a habit of cheating, oops, sorry, bending the rules to get what he wants and the sooner he is out of F1 the better for the sport.

Greg Barwick

...What are you guys going to do without Jacques for inflammatory quotes? He speaks his mind and is mostly honest which is something I wish our 7-time champ would be.

I'd love to hear him commentate a race.

Greg Middleton

...Thanks JV for always speaking your mind. JV was not a racer, but still will be remembered for his outspoken ways.

Gustav Nilsson

...I could not agree more with JV's take on Schumacher. I also agree with his opinion of Senna who I believe to be F1's greatest champion ever.

If Michael would admit his mistakes sometimes maybe some people would go easier on him.

Jay Wentz

...Why is everyone so angered that Jacques has had another swipe at Michael? Isn't it the truth?

Okay, JV is a little off the mark when he says that Schumi will be quickly forgotten, but he is right on with everything else. Schumi has won a ton of races, but can anyone remember an outstanding pass by Michael on anyone? He puts the hammer down when need be, but with out Brawn, the brilliant tactician winning races from the pit wall, would the records have been as numerous?

Michael has had the talent, the team and the support to do well. No one can take that away from him and JV isn't trying to. All Jacques is saying is, that Michael is a little bland and a bully. Lauda said almost the same thing after Hungary, but no one complained.

Lighten up. Jacques has spoken his mind all through his career and that seems to overshadow his dedication and contribution to his teams.

Good Luck JV.

Stephen Zinck

...JV is right. Oh, I'm sure that he sees this as an opportunity to speak his mind after being told what to say and what not to say when he was driving, and some of it may be envy, but what he said is right.

Michael is a jerk, a dirty driver, and a liar. All true. The rules in F1 were bent to favor Ferrari for a long time, and Michael had teammates that were told to let him win.

Better to see Schumi leave than JV or Montoya.

Steve Marino

Freedom Of Speech

Excuse me, but to all those who say JV will never attain fame again or what not, when did he ever say he wanted it? All he has ever said was that he wanted to express his own opinion, something none of you yahoos would probably have the balls to do if you were up on a stage where you knew your comments would be taken to.

Also, why would he mention his father in terms of great drivers, most people would slag him for pandering to that level anyways?

Jeffrey Li

Time For Schumi Fans To Wake Up

Hey all you sleazy Schumy fans!!!

Firstly, JV is a Indy Winner. Then F1 winner. A Rock Star! Married to a great babe! Millioner! Accept it, he is multi-talented star who has noting to prove to any of you idiots!

As per some of you whiners who say JV won a world championship because of a great package, look who's talking. That's ABOUT ALL that Schumy ever had. Plus loser team-mates who are a sad excuse to sports and follow team orders and live on Schumy's scraps. Gee, I cant remember any other driver letting his team-mate on to the podium after winning, cause he flicked the candy from a baby! Shame on you.

Every time Schumy has been put under pressure (a few times only BECAUSE FERRARI IS A GREAT PACKAGE!), his true personality has come to full display. Handle it man, he can't take pressure and a sore loser. As far as JV is concerned, he'll probably go on to win NASCAR & LE MANS (without all the fuss and furor), while the boring Schuy will be parading around in boring races, trying to set records.

Get out Schumy, time for the young blood with passion to take over. At least they have great personality.

Ananth Ram

...I find it funny that despite clear evidence to the contrary, the Tifosi will defend their man to all ends. I have never liked MS, but I will admit that he's a great driver who knows not only how to drive a car fast, but also to make sure it gets to the finish line.

That said, his antics at certain times over the years show that when all isn't going his way, he makes some amazingly poor decisions. The incident at Monaco during qualifying and the events during the race at Hungary are telltale signs of someone should be run out of F1 for the safety of the other drivers.

Imagine if someone from Super Aguri or Midland pulled stunts like that - they would lose their Super license, but since it's MS, it can all be explained away.

T.c. Collins

Well How Would You Feel...

I wonder how many of those defending Michael from the Jacques attack would feel the same if they'd been nerfed in the side with Schumi's Ferrari with the intent of ruining their championship.

You can't really blame JV for the bitter feelings he harbours for Michael, especially as Monaco '06 proves that his unsportsmanly manner doesn't appear to have improved over the years.

Remember, Jacques didn't say he wasn't the best driver, just not a good sportsman.

Matthew Miles

JV Has More Character Than Schumi

A person's character is measured not during triumphs but during trials, which is why although being a fan of Schumacher races, I agree to JV's comment in total.

Those of you whom want to raise noise with no thought, give JV a break... Schumacher would not have won any of the titles without having a good car- I don't remember a single instance where he has won a title on non-competent car...

If it happens that is going to be this year...

Jose Thomas

A Touch Sarcastic - You Decide

Way to go Jacques. You my friend have wheels, you speak your mind and you tell it like it is. I kind of feel sorry for the fans of MS who seem to think that you were trying to get attention because you're not working at the moment.

Well I know when you made those comments Jacques and I know you were gainfully employed at the time and not looking for publicity.

Don't give up. What you say has tremendous impact and obviously it is well respected otherwise there would be no comments relating to this story.

Steve Watson

http://www.planet-f1.com/News/Story_Page/0...0424296,00.html

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*original*

"Now, now children...

Following the negotiation of a ceasefire in the Middle East, the United Nations are now turning themselves to solving the far more tricky conflict between Jacques Villeneuve and Michael Schumacher.

After his nine (yes, nine) page rant, mostly about his German nemesis (in the new edition of F1 Racing), Villeneuve is to be occupied by a multi-nation peacekeeping force to form a buffer zone between him and Schumacher.

The tension between the two escalated at the weekend when, after hearing that JV had called him "not very good", Schuey retaliated by calling the Canadian a "rubbish singer".

The UN force is expected to move in on Monday, prior to a special meeting of the Security Council to discuss the spat."

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