narain fan

Villeneuve Slams Schumacher Over 'Lies'

148 posts in this topic

Fedup great post. No one could do what Schumacher did. He completely turned Ferrari around which Jacques tried to do with the all new BAR team from 1999 to 2003. Obviously he was dropped because he never performed and since then it has taken BAR now known as Honda 7 years to produce a victory. One would think that would be a lot longer had Jacques been in car no. 12 not Jenson.

As for Jacques article Senna and Schumacher are true racers. What they have done, for example Japan 1989, 1990 for Senna and Australia 1994, Jerez 1997 and Monaco 2006 shows this. What I don't understand is how Jacques thinks it's okay for Senna to do those things by telling everyone before? Is that not just like saying to someone, ok i'm going to shoot you now and you get away with it when the person you've just shot knew you had a gun anyway?

Senna didn't have more integrity or whatever Jacques said. He did things that were not right to do but he never got punished because it was seen to the stewards as nothing other than a racing incident. Just like Adelaide with Schumacher. Since then, Jerez 1997 and Monaco 2006, with the verdicts and rulings, I 100% back what the stewards have done to ensure that all drivers - even a 7 times world champion - knows that they and he cannot do such things on the circuit to gain an advantage.

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:blink:

May I ask you Mr. Racedriver, how would you have bowed out to someone that tried to riun your career?

Oh, thats right, you probably dont even have a car. I'm so sorry......moron

I quess its obvious why you like JV even more now!!You are made of the same bitchy stuff.What does your comment have to do with anything i wrote a$$hole??Oh and i do have a car, i do as much racing as i can and i'm pretty quick!!Why don't you follow your friend JV down that hole he dug?Maybe you two could get closer that way... :D

Edited by tifosi too!

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Once you scratch below the surface of this apparent off the cut rant by JV, one uncovers a very sad and insecure man. Why JV has to make an unprovoked attack on a guy that he doesn't talk to and last locked horns, competitively, almost 10 years ago is beyond my comprehension.

The only explanation that I can give is that this is JV's way of reminding the world that he is/was an equal of MS on the track. His actual performance on track belies this impression, but JV has never doubted that he is MS's equal and goes to great pains to inform a largely non plussed world.

He tried to emulate MS's move to Ferrari by forming BAR and negotiating a salary second only to MS. 10 years on and MS has 7 wdc, 80+ wins whilst JV was unceremoniously dumped by BAR and now BMW, both teams unconvinced of JV's notions of grandeur.

This is narcissistic behaviour of the highest order and needs to be recognised as the personality disorder that it is. JV thinks he is better than he actually is and finds comfort in referring to himself in the same company of greats such as Senna, Prost & Mansell - he is wrong of course.

JV needs to find peace within himself. In the real world, an individual that makes an unprovoked attack on another, be it verbal or physical, could find himself sectioned under mental health legislation. Michael, I am sure, will not dignify JV's comments with a response.

Let it go Jaques, let it go.

Indeed, indeed.......................

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Fedup great post. No one could do what Schumacher did. He completely turned Ferrari around which Jacques tried to do with the all new BAR team from 1999 to 2003. Obviously he was dropped because he never performed and since then it has taken BAR now known as Honda 7 years to produce a victory. One would think that would be a lot longer had Jacques been in car no. 12 not Jenson.

As for Jacques article Senna and Schumacher are true racers. What they have done, for example Japan 1989, 1990 for Senna and Australia 1994, Jerez 1997 and Monaco 2006 shows this. What I don't understand is how Jacques thinks it's okay for Senna to do those things by telling everyone before? Is that not just like saying to someone, ok i'm going to shoot you now and you get away with it when the person you've just shot knew you had a gun anyway?

Senna didn't have more integrity or whatever Jacques said. He did things that were not right to do but he never got punished because it was seen to the stewards as nothing other than a racing incident. Just like Adelaide with Schumacher. Since then, Jerez 1997 and Monaco 2006, with the verdicts and rulings, I 100% back what the stewards have done to ensure that all drivers - even a 7 times world champion - knows that they and he cannot do such things on the circuit to gain an advantage.

Ha Ha Ha :lol::lol::lol:

I think Ferrari turned him around instead of he turned Ferari around.

Since he was so capable, why didn't he turn Minardi or .... around???

:lol::lol::lol:

Still dreaming.

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I was thinking about this on my long drive home...perhaps, if JV's ego would allow him, he would make a fantastic test-driver for a struggling team.

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I was thinking about this on my long drive home...perhaps, if JV's ego would allow him, he would make a fantastic test-driver for a struggling team.

i think us fans need to stop obsessing about F1 and JV and stop to smell the roses...

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i think us fans need to stop obsessing about F1 and JV and stop to smell the roses...

:lol: Hell, my drive is 1 1/2 hrs long! I think of many things on that drive and only 5 minutes or so was devoted to JV! Anyway, there are no roses on the 91 Freeway, unless you count the fake ones stuffed into the cheesy flower-holder of the new VW beetles.

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Newbie here... been reading the posts for quite some time, but felt impelled to finally throw in a couple of cents after reading so much anti-JV drivel:

Let's get one thing straight - I'm not here to bash Schuey. He is a great driver who has proven his abilities beyond any doubt. Dirty or clean, he got the job done more often than not. He's climbing the hill now and naturally his skills are bound to diminish some from his prime. Even with the drop-off he's still showing the mettle to challenge for the title to the very end. He's made some silly moves this year, so has JV and that's racing -- you take some chances and if they work you look brilliant if not you look like a tool. Props to him for taking a good car and extract the maximum out of it quite consistently.

My issue is more so with the JV sucks, JV did nothing since 97, JV is a whiner sentiments.

Look - in life you run across all kinds of people. You can expect everyone to fit your description of likeable and everyone values certain characteristics more than others. What made JV so endearing to his fans (his speak-my-mind no matter what mentality) made him equally repulsive to others. Same with Schumi's win at all costs reputation. Certainly that will contribute to the polarization in this seemingly eternal struggle. But the personality should NOT cloud the assessment of whether a driver or anyone else for that matter is good at what they do. Also, evaluations must be made on a relative basis.

When JV had equipment that was capable of winning races (1994 - 1997) he proved he was a world-class driver. The fact that he was naturally faster than Hill straight away in 96 showed that he was indeed in the elite of F1 talent wise -- his recklessness and inexperience cost him the title in his rookie year. But he strung together enough wins and points consistently during this period to become the world champ fair and square.

1998-2006 the man simply did not have a car capable of winning races and to argue otherwise is just ignorant. He outclassed or matched his teammates every year except for Button. Button is a very good driver and JV was getting complacent and c#cky that year, not to mention CP was ousted and his team boss was bashing him left right and centre. His performance that year was more of an outlier than a true indicator of his talent. His engineers and teammates have generally all praised his skills, Frank and Bernie have publicly raved about his speed.

His hubris was his ridiculous loyalty to Pollock who dragged him to BAR and failed to deliver. When Jacques re-signed in 01 and Pollock still failed to deliver, that was the end. It had been 5 years since his Championship and sport is a 'what have you done for me lately' business. With those excuses for F1 cars during the BAR years, JV's talent was wasted just as any other elite driver's would have been in the same situation. No one could drive those machines into the winner's circle - not Schumi, not Mika, not Senna, no one. There was simply too large a gap up to McLaren and Ferrari respectively.

In F1, a worthy champion in my estimation is one who can take a car that is capable of WINNING races (not an odd podium here or there) and shows enough consistency under pressure to win the title. Jacques did this during his window of opportunity. Michael has done it during his. Mika did it. Alonso did it. ALL worthy champions, ALL top-rate drivers.

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Newbie here... been reading the posts for quite some time, but felt impelled to finally throw in a couple of cents after reading so much anti-JV drivel:

Let's get one thing straight - I'm not here to bash Schuey. He is a great driver who has proven his abilities beyond any doubt. Dirty or clean, he got the job done more often than not. He's climbing the hill now and naturally his skills are bound to diminish some from his prime. Even with the drop-off he's still showing the mettle to challenge for the title to the very end. He's made some silly moves this year, so has JV and that's racing -- you take some chances and if they work you look brilliant if not you look like a tool. Props to him for taking a good car and extract the maximum out of it quite consistently.

My issue is more so with the JV sucks, JV did nothing since 97, JV is a whiner sentiments.

Look - in life you run across all kinds of people. You can expect everyone to fit your description of likeable and everyone values certain characteristics more than others. What made JV so endearing to his fans (his speak-my-mind no matter what mentality) made him equally repulsive to others. Same with Schumi's win at all costs reputation. Certainly that will contribute to the polarization in this seemingly eternal struggle. But the personality should NOT cloud the assessment of whether a driver or anyone else for that matter is good at what they do. Also, evaluations must be made on a relative basis.

When JV had equipment that was capable of winning races (1994 - 1997) he proved he was a world-class driver. The fact that he was naturally faster than Hill straight away in 96 showed that he was indeed in the elite of F1 talent wise -- his recklessness and inexperience cost him the title in his rookie year. But he strung together enough wins and points consistently during this period to become the world champ fair and square.

1998-2006 the man simply did not have a car capable of winning races and to argue otherwise is just ignorant. He outclassed or matched his teammates every year except for Button. Button is a very good driver and JV was getting complacent and c#cky that year, not to mention CP was ousted and his team boss was bashing him left right and centre. His performance that year was more of an outlier than a true indicator of his talent. His engineers and teammates have generally all praised his skills, Frank and Bernie have publicly raved about his speed.

His hubris was his ridiculous loyalty to Pollock who dragged him to BAR and failed to deliver. When Jacques re-signed in 01 and Pollock still failed to deliver, that was the end. It had been 5 years since his Championship and sport is a 'what have you done for me lately' business. With those excuses for F1 cars during the BAR years, JV's talent was wasted just as any other elite driver's would have been in the same situation. No one could drive those machines into the winner's circle - not Schumi, not Mika, not Senna, no one. There was simply too large a gap up to McLaren and Ferrari respectively.

In F1, a worthy champion in my estimation is one who can take a car that is capable of WINNING races (not an odd podium here or there) and shows enough consistency under pressure to win the title. Jacques did this during his window of opportunity. Michael has done it during his. Mika did it. Alonso did it. ALL worthy champions, ALL top-rate drivers.

I give you a standing ovation!

:clap3::clap3::clap3::clap3::clap3::clap3::clap3::clap3::clap3::clap3:

I look forward to more posts from you!

I consider it an honor to give you (hopefully) your first welcome!

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:lol: Hell, my drive is 1 1/2 hrs long! I think of many things on that drive and only 5 minutes or so was devoted to JV! Anyway, there are no roses on the 91 Freeway, unless you count the fake ones stuffed into the cheesy flower-holder of the new VW beetles.

damn your drive home is as long an F1 race, you must be in prime physical shape to last each race in the morning and evening. My drive to work is 17 miles, 22 mins flat, to make my drive exciting I set time, avg speed or fuel efficiency challenges for myself....today i set a new record for the morning commute by covering the distance at avg of 32.7 MPG! it was thanks to some great strategy and team work. I had some trouble in the morning trying to get some heat into the tyres, but the car handled really good and i was lucky enough to get a clear track to set some good times....

ARGH F1 is driving me nuts!!!! :mellow:

Edited by stopkidding

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damn your drive home is as long an F1 race, you must be in prime physical shape to last each race in the morning and evening. My drive to work is 17 miles, 22 mins flat, to make my drive exciting I set time, avg speed or fuel efficiency challenges for myself....today i set a new record for the morning commute by covering the distance at avg of 32.7 MPG! it was thanks to some great strategy and team work. I had some trouble in the morning trying to get some heat into the tyres, but the car handled really good and i was lucky enough to get a clear track to set some good times....

ARGH F1 is driving me nuts!!!! :mellow:

:lol:

In an effort to slow us all down, Max Mosley implemented heavy traffic. The cars now cruise along at a very safe 40kph...

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:lol:

In an effort to slow us all down, Max Mosley implemented heavy traffic. The cars now cruise along at a very safe 40kph...

I am thinking Max is from oregon and everyone here is a relative of Max. The speed limit is 50MPH and most people drive at 45. Its like everyone has pit lane speed limiter buttons

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This is what amazes me about JV - MS fcuks up at Monaco & Jerez and gets penalised heavily, Monaco cost him the race and Jerez robbed him of his points for the entire season - What else do people want? a firing squad :blink:

If you look at how many races MS has completed and tot up his number of indiscretions, the ratio is miniscule. His detractors prefer to focus on a hand full of indiscretions and try to devalue all his achievements. Jealousy has no bounds.

His peers, who you and JV claim he lied to, elected to retain MS as their President

the only thing is that he never says i did it on purpose he lies that the point here .....and why he has to be jealous of MS when they foght each other and it was only for the 97 season JV wins ..so cos after that JV never had competitve cars ..ok those were JV choses but they are facts to you can say MS or Alonso have beaten Sato for example you can say FA have beaten KR last year and MS this year the others ....buq you know what i mean so there's no reason to be jealous ,

what he said is true and is better that some of you accept that instead of coming out here saying that is jealous .

what F1 has become something realyy important to the sport and true all of you want to put it behind no if MS ****ed in f1 all of us have to say so whoever the driver is ......

I'll return the compliment to you but with a capital I :lol:

go **** your mother....

Once you scratch below the surface of this apparent off the cut rant by JV, one uncovers a very sad and insecure man. Why JV has to make an unprovoked attack on a guy that he doesn't talk to and last locked horns, competitively, almost 10 years ago is beyond my comprehension.

The only explanation that I can give is that this is JV's way of reminding the world that he is/was an equal of MS on the track. His actual performance on track belies this impression, but JV has never doubted that he is MS's equal and goes to great pains to inform a largely non plussed world.

He tried to emulate MS's move to Ferrari by forming BAR and negotiating a salary second only to MS. 10 years on and MS has 7 wdc, 80+ wins whilst JV was unceremoniously dumped by BAR and now BMW, both teams unconvinced of JV's notions of grandeur.

This is narcissistic behaviour of the highest order and needs to be recognised as the personality disorder that it is. JV thinks he is better than he actually is and finds comfort in referring to himself in the same company of greats such as Senna, Prost & Mansell - he is wrong of course.

JV needs to find peace within himself. In the real world, an individual that makes an unprovoked attack on another, be it verbal or physical, could find himself sectioned under mental health legislation. Michael, I am sure, will not dignify JV's comments with a response.

Let it go Jaques, let it go.

before you say why he has.....etc..is better to check why this came out and how ...****in idiots here......

Well, i didnt read any of the comments after the article because its pretty much pointless jabbering between idiots, but here is my take

JV hasnt done anything representing any form of competition for nearly 10 years now. Hes p**sed because everybody wanted him to life up to his father but deep down he knows hes a midiocer driver at best. He cant take loosing to anybody. He lost to Mika just the same as too MS, but you cant bash someone once they left the sport 5 years before you have. MS is his target because nobody else is avalible. He couldnt make anything out of himself so he has to try and drag someone down. Hes a desperate pathetic man. If anybody will not be remembered it is him.

Sure MS has made Mistakes but if anybody wants to tell me that no other driver EVER made any bad judgment, dirty play or abseen gesture, they must be totaly bongo in their head. And dont even get me started on the Senna crap, Senna is 40% ture and 60% James Dean at best. if he had retired with three Championships 4 or 5 years after his death everybody would be saying that he was a good driver, but nobody would call him the God of F1. And he was just as ruthless as MS if not more so.

JV says that drivers are too afraid of the teams, what the hell is he. hes just a morron that doesnt know when things are bigger then him. Hes disgruntled to be outclasses by atleast 4 other drivers that he stood on the grid with at some point in his career and he just couldnt take it. I say good bye JV and dont let the door hit you on the a$$ on your way out.

thankyou and good night

and you are the intellignet guy you prick...

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When I read this article, I just knew it was gonna cause chaos on here, especially between us JVians and Tifosi (M$ fans specifically).

For what it's worth here's my take. Jacques and Michael do not get along. They never have, and they never will. The animosity between the two is almost Prost/Senna like (I'm not talking about abilities or anything of the sort, just the mutual disdain each hold for each other). It's a plain given that given the opportunity, Jacques will slam Michael in the press, and Michael will do the same to Jacques, they're both guilty of it. The animosity has been there prior to Jerez and flared up not with the incident on track, but in events later that night.

Now, as for JV's comments, I'm not gonna play all nice and the like, I agree wholeheartedly with what he says, none of you should be surprised considering where my allegiances lie and my thoughts on Michael. When he says that Michael won't be remembered in the same fashion as Prost, Senna, Mansell, he speaks for alot of people. The only difference between most of these people and Jacques is that Jacques has the balls to make such opinions voice. You M$ fans may not want to hear it, but there are people who hold those 3 racers in a higher regard than they do Michael, just as there are many who hold Michael in the highest of regards.

Already alot are saying JV will be forgotten easily and the like. I think not. Sure, he doesn't have the same statistics and has not had anywhere near the success of Michael, but people will remember Jacques for alot of his on track antics, and many who don't will remember him as the guy who rightly or wrongly, voiced his opinion on anything and everything. An asset/flaw (depending on which side of the fence you're on) which is severely lacking in this PC friendly F1 world. Further, JV never said people would remember him over Michael, he just said that many people will speak more fondly of Prost/Senna/Mansell, and again, there are people who think that. Therefore those making the Villewho or JV who jokes are doing nothing but acknowledging the man himself and the comments he makes, hence nullifying your own "who is this guy" argument.

Remember, these comments were made when he was still racing for BMW Sauber so these aren't the comments of a guy in retirement. He was asked a question, and answered as honestly as he could. Alot of you will/already have take great exception to it. In a way, if I were a Michael fan, I'd be pretty angry as JV has really launched a significant verbal attack on the guy, but Michael gives as good as he gets so they're both as guilty as each other as I said earlier.

What did he say about the two masters?
He said both will be remembered by F1 fans longer than Michael ever will be.
Rest assured MS will not dignify these remarks with any kind of response.

Just like he didn't mock JV's singing career, or JV's run at BAR. Both have given as good as they've got, Michael isn't the innocent party you make him out to be.

Michael has more class in his lttle finger than JV will ever have.
I must have missed all that class when he tried to take out Michael and Damon, and in Monaco this year.
Why not kiss and make up with MS, Patrick head, Mario etc.

What has he done wrong to Michael? Last I checked it was Michael who turned in on him, it was Michael who acted like a royal goose that night, last I checked Michael was giving JV alot of verbal as well.

What has he done wrong to Patrick? So he should apologise for not using Patrick's settings which worked so well for Frenzten?

What has he done wrong to Mario? He should apologise for performing far better than the team or most people thought he would and gave Nick a good run for his money I suppose.

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In life, it's not about what you know rather who you know. If JV is going around bad mouthing influential people it will come back to bite him in the long run.
Meh, I'd rather he leave F1 remaining his outspoken self than kiss butt to stay in F1.
Never liked JV and this dosent do much for helping me to like him...if he said it while still in an F1 team though

As I said earlier, the interview was most likely conducted when JV was still racing with BMW Sauber, it's just being released in print next week and on the next over the last couple days, therefore he was still an F1 racer when these comments were made.

Judging by this thread JV sure has shaken up the Ferrari/Shumacher fans... I love it!
:lol: He's hit a raw nerve. It's funny how the same guys claiming they've already forgotten about JV are giving Jacques as good as he gave Michael.
No he didn't and that makes it even sadder for him.

:lol: Have you not read what the Tifosi have said in this thread?? They're going off!!!!

Why JV has to make an unprovoked attack on a guy that he doesn't talk to and last locked horns, competitively, almost 10 years ago is beyond my comprehension.
Since it was an interview for F1 Racing, I'm guessing they either asked him his thoughts on Michael and/or for JV to reveal what happened in the GPDA meeting after Monaco, so it's not unprovoked.
The only explanation that I can give is that this is JV's way of reminding the world that he is/was an equal of MS on the track

From the excerpts we've seen so far, JV has not compared himself to Michael or inferring in any way what you are. He's comparing Michael to Ayrton, Alain and Nigel. Further, he's not discrediting Michael's talent or comparing his talent to those aforementioned racers, but the respect they command from the fans.

JV thinks he is better than he actually is and finds comfort in referring to himself in the same company of greats such as Senna, Prost & Mansell
Where the heck did he compare himself to those guys? Please highlight which part of the excerpts he compared himself to them. He was comparing your boy to them, not himself.
In the real world, an individual that makes an unprovoked attack on another, be it verbal or physical, could find himself sectioned under mental health legislation.

That's taking it abit to far.

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Meh, I'd rather he leave F1 remaining his outspoken self than kiss butt to stay in F1.

As I said earlier, the interview was most likely conducted when JV was still racing with BMW Sauber, it's just being released in print next week and on the next over the last couple days, therefore he was still an F1 racer when these comments were made.

:lol: He's hit a raw nerve. It's funny how the same guys claiming they've already forgotten about JV are giving Jacques as good as he gave Michael.

:lol: Have you not read what the Tifosi have said in this thread?? They're going off!!!!

Since it was an interview for F1 Racing, I'm guessing they either asked him his thoughts on Michael and/or for JV to reveal what happened in the GPDA meeting after Monaco, so it's not unprovoked.

From the excerpts we've seen so far, JV has not compared himself to Michael or inferring in any way what you are. He's comparing Michael to Ayrton, Alain and Nigel. Further, he's not discrediting Michael's talent or comparing his talent to those aforementioned racers, but the respect they command from the fans.

Where the heck did he compare himself to those guys? Please highlight which part of the excerpts he compared himself to them. He was comparing your boy to them, not himself.

That's taking it abit to far.

You take blind loyalty to a new level man!

Bravo :clap3:

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How so? I'm only defending the driver I support and am no more "blindly loyal" than your good self. I'd rather you argue against my points and answer the questions I put forward to you rather than resort to such personal attacks, but I guess that's the way this forum is heading, pity really.

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It's not often you see jealousy taken to that level from one professional sports man to another. This guy is clearly bitter about Schumacher's success and he's certainly not afraid to hide it. I can understand, he's angry and upset that he's not good enough for F1 anymore, but then again he hasn't been for about 5 years now. Get over it Jacques, you wern't that good, it's ok.

I'm sure when F1 has forgotten who Schumacher is in 20 years (yah, right!), Jacques will still be an icon!!!!

The fact that he said it's ok what Senna did because he said he was going to do it shows how dilusional this man is. BMW made the right choice.

Thanks for the memories Jacques (the few that there were nearly 10 years ago), dont let the door hit ya on the way out.

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How so? I'm only defending the driver I support and am no more "blindly loyal" than your good self. I'd rather you argue against my points and answer the questions I put forward to you rather than resort to such personal attacks, but I guess that's the way this forum is heading, pity really.

I dont do personal attacks I have too much respect for you and others to do that.

In life there are times when one should just admit that they or someone that they support is wrong. Jerez 1997 and Adelaide (Hill) I offer no defence for MS or, indeed, Monaco 2006. Where MS's antics are inexcusable I will not waste my time trying to defend the indefensible.

I am not going to bother analysing your arguments as it is obvious to most that JV's tirade are the words of a bitter and self obsessed man. Whatever I write you will have a counter argument that profers your slanted subjective view on matters JV.

I prefer to have a balanced view in life, it helps to keep me sane.

<_<

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And although his comments could have led to yet another sparring match between the old rivals, Schumacher has instead, opted to keep his silence.

"We have been aware of the quotes since yesterday. We don't even want to make a 'no comment' on this," the German's spokeswoman Sabine Kehm told Reuters

PLANETF1

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Once you scratch below the surface of this apparent off the cut rant by JV, one uncovers a very sad and insecure man. Why JV has to make an unprovoked attack on a guy that he doesn't talk to and last locked horns, competitively, almost 10 years ago is beyond my comprehension.

The only explanation that I can give is that this is JV's way of reminding the world that he is/was an equal of MS on the track. His actual performance on track belies this impression, but JV has never doubted that he is MS's equal and goes to great pains to inform a largely non plussed world.

He tried to emulate MS's move to Ferrari by forming BAR and negotiating a salary second only to MS. 10 years on and MS has 7 wdc, 80+ wins whilst JV was unceremoniously dumped by BAR and now BMW, both teams unconvinced of JV's notions of grandeur.

This is narcissistic behaviour of the highest order and needs to be recognised as the personality disorder that it is. JV thinks he is better than he actually is and finds comfort in referring to himself in the same company of greats such as Senna, Prost & Mansell - he is wrong of course.

JV needs to find peace within himself. In the real world, an individual that makes an unprovoked attack on another, be it verbal or physical, could find himself sectioned under mental health legislation. Michael, I am sure, will not dignify JV's comments with a response.

Let it go Jaques, let it go.

Bravo Senor :clap3:

JV is a sad little man living in his own sad little world. If he didn't get a drive for next year, he only has himself to blame. He didn't get it because he isn't good enough, not good enough to compete with Heidfeld, forget the better drivers. He has already turned into one of those bitter ex F1 drivers who have nothing better to do than to criticize Michael and the sport in general - people like Mansell and Lauda, except that the question of whether JV was ever 'great' is still open to debate. He can't stgand the fact that there is a driver 2(?) years older than him, who has a blank contract for next year in a top team, which he can sign any time. Do you think people are going to be falling over to help if JV decides to set up his own F1 team? There are good people and bad people, but if everyione hates you, it's not because everyone else is wrong. You can't always be right JV. JV's a press whore, his fans are always pointing out how the press is against him, but he is always willing to use the press to criticize others (honest and outspoken :rolleyes2: ), why complain when he gets it back. Michael has maintained rare dignity in the face of JV's spiteful bulls##t throughout this year, I'd love it if he came out and said something, something thatreally hits hard (sohuldn't be too hard to think of something like that when it comes to JV). JV is Montoya, but with an illustrious name which still gets people steamy eyed and gets him some sympathy. They both are immensely popular in their own countries siimply because they were the only F1 drivers from there, and have a small but rabid bunch of supporters are people who hang on his every word, and have an alternate world view, where everything to do with the JV is paramount. Schumacher fans, except the gloryhunters always admit to his faults, hell even some Senna fans do. But everything to do with JV is someone else's fault. You're a very small man Jacques, fade away fast. I have no pity anymore.

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I am not going to bother analysing your arguments as it is obvious to most that JV's tirade are the words of a bitter and self obsessed man.
So you're OK with making the harsh and rash statements against JV, but when questioned to back up some of those statements with facts, you just dismiss them because they come from a JV fan?? I thought the whole point of this forum was to have some hearty debates. You can hardly argue that your views are not heavily biased in favour of Michael and against Jacques. You can't call me out for that then not acknowledge you're doing exactly the same thing.
Whatever I write you will have a counter argument

I thought that was the whole point of a debate, how wrong was I to think that?! As for my views being in favour of JV, of course they would, but they'd be no more slanted by who I support than your posts on JV are.

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