mock 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Flavio Furious Over Massa Posted by: MSulka on Oct 07, 2006 - 07:40 AM A grumpy Flavio Briatore pointed a finger in the direction of Michelin after championship challenger Fernando Alonso qualified behind four Bridgestone-shod cars at Suzuka. ''The Toyotas definitely have less fuel on board than us,'' the Renault boss told German television, ''but this is still not a good result for us. ''It was impossible for us to do better today.'' Italian Briatore also threatened to re-open old wounds by suggesting that Suzuka stewards - although Alonso was penalised after a similar incident at Monza - will not investigate Felipe Massa's slow driving in front of Alonso. He said: ''What Fernando did (at Monza) was not deliberate, but what Massa did was (deliberate).'' ------------------------------------------------------- I could not watch the QF session. Did anyone see this, what happened actually ??? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UrKo 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Flavio Furious Over MassaPosted by: MSulka on Oct 07, 2006 - 07:40 AM A grumpy Flavio Briatore pointed a finger in the direction of Michelin after championship challenger Fernando Alonso qualified behind four Bridgestone-shod cars at Suzuka. ''The Toyotas definitely have less fuel on board than us,'' the Renault boss told German television, ''but this is still not a good result for us. ''It was impossible for us to do better today.'' Italian Briatore also threatened to re-open old wounds by suggesting that Suzuka stewards - although Alonso was penalised after a similar incident at Monza - will not investigate Felipe Massa's slow driving in front of Alonso. He said: ''What Fernando did (at Monza) was not deliberate, but what Massa did was (deliberate).'' ------------------------------------------------------- I could not watch the QF session. Did anyone see this, what happened actually ??? Massa did drive much slower than you would expect from him in normal circumstances. Im not surprised if FIA will not give hime the penalty he deserve. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ferrariphile 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 I saw what looked like some effective pacing by Massa. Could it be termed "blocking"? Sure, but there was no overt blocking, i.e., Massa sliding up or down to take a different line in order that he keep Alonso behind him. That's just from what I saw on the world feed, if the stewards saw something different or if Alonso could make a case about it like Massa did that is another story. But it wasn't like he kept them so far off pace they missed the checkered and an opportunity for another hot lap, it occurred in the first three or four minutes of Q3. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Nothing happened it is just bulls##t from Flav. Massa was slower and did not Alonso through, however unlike Monza, both of them were on the same hot laps, so Massa was under no obligation to let him through. Which he didn't. It was in any case in the fuel burning part of qualifying, Alonso's later runs were clear, and he was just too slow then. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ykickamoocow 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 I saw what looked like some effective pacing by Massa. Could it be termed "blocking"? Sure, but there was no overt blocking, i.e., Massa sliding up or down to take a different line in order that he keep Alonso behind him. That's just from what I saw on the world feed, if the stewards saw something different or if Alonso could make a case about it like Massa did that is another story. But it wasn't like he kept them so far off pace they missed the checkered and an opportunity for another hot lap, it occurred in the first three or four minutes of Q3. The real question is did Massa block also as much as Alonso blocked Massa afew GP's ago. If the answer is yes then Massa should be penalised. The stewards need to remain consistant. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tifosi too! 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Flavio has taken it even further with Massa and Ferrari ... from ITV http://www.totalf1.com/view-article.php?newsid=179318 The Renault driver expressed frustration over the team radio and appeared annoyed on-track Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mock 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Alonso's later runs were clear, and he was just too slow then. We still have to blame that on someone, don't we ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UrKo 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Nothing happened it is just bulls##t from Flav. Massa was slower and did not Alonso through, however unlike Monza, both of them were on the same hot laps, so Massa was under no obligation to let him through. Which he didn't. It was in any case in the fuel burning part of qualifying, Alonso's later runs were clear, and he was just too slow then. Didnt expect anything different from u cav... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Didnt expect anything different from u cav... That's right, attack the poster, not the post itself. How incredibly mature of you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sato 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 and they wonder why people say FIArrari..... If thats not blocking and that Monza crap is, then im not here. Alonso was clearly keen to put a banker lap in, and Massa was clearly keen to hold him up, and let michael sprint off to get room, whilst making sure alonso would be screwed if it rained. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 The real question is did Massa block also as much as Alonso blocked Massa afew GP's ago. If the answer is yes then Massa should be penalised. The stewards need to remain consistant. Massa was on a hot lap too, so there is no question of penalising him. and they wonder why people say FIArrari..... Wow what clever original wordplay, care to address the facts instead? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sato 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Care to read the rest of my post? Massa was on a hot lap too, so there is no question of penalising him. Sato was on a lap in China last week too, but he was penalised... Why should it be different in qualifying? Massa was slower, for more then a lap, and sure as hell made no effort to get out of the way for a moment. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 There is no obligation to move over if you're doing a hot lap, if Sato is doing a hot lap in front of you, even if he is 6 seconds slower he is not obliged to move over. What does a race incident have to do with this? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tifosi too! 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 and they wonder why people say FIArrari.....If thats not blocking and that Monza crap is, then im not here. Alonso was clearly keen to put a banker lap in, and Massa was clearly keen to hold him up, and let michael sprint off to get room, whilst making sure alonso would be screwed if it rained. They were on the SAME LAP. Sato was on a lap in China last week too, but he was penalised... Why should it be different in qualifying? Massa was slower, for more then a lap, and sure as hell made no effort to get out of the way for a moment. Sato was a backmarker and didn't move over. FA in Monza was on the out-lap and FM on the flying lap. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sato 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 FA was alot further ahead of Massa in Monza, and not crusing around to play with him, aswell. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 HOT LAP, OUT LAP bloody hell will I have to explain what they are now? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sato 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Crusing is not a hot lap, do I have to explain that? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 No, but the rule applies to out laps, you are not obliged to move over if you are not on an out lap, (or an in lap I guess). Haven't you seen Michael and Alonso playing around during the fuel burning period overtaking each other many times, trying to get to the front of the pack? Why is this time so different that all these stupid conspiracy theories are all in vogue again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sato 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Other drivers have been penalised for hot lap on hot lap blocking.... JV was in Europe IIRC, and he wasn't the only one this year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tifosi too! 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Other drivers have been penalised for hot lap on hot lap blocking....JV was in Europe IIRC, and he wasn't the only one this year. No if they are both on a hotlap then its up to the teams and the driver to regulate the correct timing.If they were to ruin their hotlaps just to let another faster car through then half the grid wouldn't be able to make a decent lap. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 JV WAS ON HIS OUT LAP in Nurburgring, not that that wasn't a stupid decision, made in favour of Alonso which set the precedent for Monza, which make Renault's complaints a bit silly. Not as silly as today though, Flavio and Fernando are both pathetic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sato 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 How did that JV thing help Alonso... It was Fisi who it helped. Flavio and Fernando have every right to whinge after Monza, its a load of crap that something like that is blocking, and this isn't. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 Repeating it won't make it any truer, you are not obliged to move over on a timed lap, simple as that. Renault were helped in N'ring, Renault were the ones who complained there, it came back to bite them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sudarshan the shumi fan 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 dont see anything wrong in this. massa and shumacher were ahead of alonso.FIA will penalize you only if u are blocked when doing flying laps. Clearly they were all just burning off fuel, no point talking about it. Massa held up Alonso only for 1 lap, after that MASSA picked up speed. So why so much controversy?Such a minor issue and Flavio gets upto to his never for such silly things. guys please dont talk about sato in here, he is a clear piece of bulls##t. he doesnt know how to drive, which ever car you give him he will either do stupid moves or ramm onto somone. he will be involved in some incident or the other in almost very race. deserves his license to be stripped. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sato 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2006 "Clearly they were all just burning off fuel, no point talking about it." Bullcrap! Alonso CLEARLY wanted to get on with it, with the fear of rain coming. He wanted to set a fast lap, so he had the safety. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites