What's Wrong With Bar-honda ?

[Kay 0]

I think it is rather amusing...

They know the problem, but to rectify the problem they create a new problem (low top speeds) and to rectify that problem they remain with the original problem.

Not that I enjoy seeing Button towards the back of the grid.

[krish 0]

It may be because they are finding themselves in Renault's position due to the sudden change to Bridgestones, rememeber, Super Aguris already have had one more year experience with Bridgestones. That may be the reason why we see them out performing Honda.

would they switch back to their old engines for future races ?

[Taku 0]

The people in Japan and the people in UK arent focusing on common goals & ideas, there are disagreements & disputes and its led to Willis being sacked & some idiot brought in from Japan who doesnt know what he's doing

agree, but nakamoto isn't an idiot, fry is the idiot. letting willis go was a huge mistake.

read on gp2006.com that fry spread the rumour about brawn in the hope that making it public would prevent it happenning. brawn would obviously want to be team principal. brawn + + nakamoto would be much better with fry out of the picture. he is your typical self-centred cover-your-a##(hole) and the sooner he is gone the better

[Wez 0]

Bar Honda was one of the better teams of last year and was expected that the new Earth Car would be moving a head of their last year positions.

On paper it should have been the best of the ground effect cars, with its extensive areas intended to suck the car to the ground like a leech; in reality, it was almost undriveable, porpoising down the straights as the low pressure area wandered around under the car as it pleased.

<a href="http://www.formula1latest.com/2007/04/07/so-whats-with-honda/" target="_blank">Source

</a>

You could see rubins on radio complaining about ill handling of the car.

None expected such a bad performance form Honda.

What went wrong ?

Krish

I could write you an essay on whats with the car....

Basically though they went for a completely new design in 2007 hoping to challenge for the title & it failed horribly.

The new car is infact significantly faster than the old car in a straight line but as soon as the new car turns in for corners at an angle of 5% or more the airflow over the car is significantly affected (particularly over the back wing) with the car loosing rear down force.

As a result the Traction control is kicking in on every high speed corner when rear downforce is lost and the car then has no pull out of the corner because of the reduced revs caused by the TC.

[Shane2 0]

The new car is infact significantly faster than the old car in a straight line

If that is the case, and Rubens says the car is "like a parachute" on the straights, that doesn't say much for the '06 car

[c21 0]

If that is the case, and Rubens says the car is "like a parachute" on the straights, that doesn't say much for the '06 car

Ask the Super Aguri drivers.

They seem to be quite fast with it!

[Shane2 0]

Well in that case, your comment makes little sense to me, because Rubens seems to think their new car is terminally slow in a straight line

[DOF_power 0]

No more Prodrive perhaps.

[Autumnpuma 0]

Well in that case, your comment makes little sense to me, because Rubens seems to think their new car is terminally slow in a straight line

The '06 car was designed by a master of chassis design, Geoff Willis. That brilliant man is no longer at Honduh. Put those together and you get the Super Aguri's with the Willis car really looking better than the design-by-committe-Honduh. Shuhei has done a fine job with organization and team structure (something Willis sucked at) but they need a star chassis designer.

[Autumnpuma 0]

I put in bold the part that's relevant to our discussion:from itv-f1.com

***

Jenson Button's manager says the Briton is not considering leaving Honda despite the team's dreadful start to 2007.

Honda has tumbled down the order with its new RA107 and has yet to post a top ten finish this season.

Button and team-mate Rubens Barrichello have struggled to get through the first qualifying cut-off, leaving both drivers frustrated.

But Button's manager Richard Goddard told Autosport magazine that Jenson remained committed to the team.

"Jenson is still supporting Honda," said Goddard.

"Clearly, the team is not where it should be - but we're not going to jump ship.

"We're not shopping around and I'm not talking to anyone at the moment.

"There is no other team that can give us a better place to be."

Button signed a long-term contract with Honda after being the subject of a tug-of-love between his current team and former employer Williams in 2004/5.

Despite insisting that Honda remained the best prospect for Button's future, Goddard admitted that were areas of concern about the team.

"A number of key technical personnel left last year and we have to make sure the team rebuilds in that area," he told Autosport.

"We can't afford to keep starting the season with a slow car."

*****

[Shane2 0]

Jenson seems ever the eternal optimist. I wonder when hes gonna finally sit back and think "Wht the fcuk have I done"

[Autumnpuma 0]

Picking the right team and negotiating the political landscape is a very important, and often neglected, skill for a driver to have. All these F1 drivers are good, but often the difference between a champion and an also-ran is a lack of political acumen. Button is fast but is faster yet at becoming another Amon.

[aussief1 4]

Picking the right team and negotiating the political landscape is a very important, and often neglected, skill for a driver to have. All these F1 drivers are good, but often the difference between a champion and an also-ran is a lack of political acumen. Button is fast but is faster yet at becoming another Amon.

I agree, but there was no way of Jenson telling that Willis would be demoted and end up leaving Honda and them to place some MotoGP wannabe designer in charge of the program. These things are in the hands of the gods when a driver put pen to paper.

Just like Webber to Williams, it all looked hunky dorey with Williams looking to improve upon a reasonably strong couple of years when he signed the contract and as soon as the ink had dried the first signs of problems with the relationship between BMW and Williams began to appear, and as we all know a differcult two years was the result, with Webber still trying to prove his worth.

[krish 0]

Jenson seems ever the eternal optimist. I wonder when hes gonna finally sit back and think "Wht the fcuk have I done"

What about rubins ?

what must he thinking about his future in honda

[Shane2 0]

It depends really if he can get a drive in another team, I am sure he would leave if he had the chance. The reason I mentioned button is because he committed long term, and I don't think rubens did

[monza gorilla 1]

I think Rubens signed for 2 years, which means he's out of contract at the end of 07. As for Button, I don't know whether he's on a 5 year deal or 3 years with options. No doubt someone can shed light.

[Jenson_Rules 0]

Its a 3 year with options aparently, from what I heard!

Rubens I think will be sacked at the end of the year possibly, especially if they can get a better driver in the car to challenge Jenson and thus make him go faster (much like whats happened to Heidfeld recently!)

[ykickamoocow 0]

Its a 3 year with options aparently, from what I heard!

Rubens I think will be sacked at the end of the year possibly, especially if they can get a better driver in the car to challenge Jenson and thus make him go faster (much like whats happened to Heidfeld recently!)

Rubens has been quicker than Button so far this season so if that continues then he will be retained.

[LabradoRacer 2]

BAR-Honda no longer exists. It p**ses me off that SOME people on here are so thick that they don't even know the names of the teams! ****ing get it right if you want to post something!

And the car this year is just plain crap!

Oh ,you're right! It's no longer BAR-Honda. It's BAD-Honda now.

[c21 0]

Oh ,you're right! It's no longer BAR-Honda. It's BAD-Honda now.

Ooooh, very good!

Also, I think Rubens wouldnt shed too many tears if he were not retained.

He could go to STR, or maybe to the old folks home of RBR.

[ykickamoocow 0]

He could go to STR, or maybe to the old folks home of RBR.

The old folks home is currently full. There is however jobs avaliable which Rubens could peform as DC really needs someone to give him a bath everyday

[Autumnpuma 0]

I agree, but there was no way of Jenson telling that Willis would be demoted and end up leaving Honda and them to place some MotoGP wannabe designer in charge of the program. These things are in the hands of the gods when a driver put pen to paper.

Just like Webber to Williams, it all looked hunky dorey with Williams looking to improve upon a reasonably strong couple of years when he signed the contract and as soon as the ink had dried the first signs of problems with the relationship between BMW and Williams began to appear, and as we all know a differcult two years was the result, with Webber still trying to prove his worth.

Very true, yet Button's stated desire to remain at Honduh now that he know the score is a knock against him. Everyone forgives a winner and if he would move to a team that would help him win, the circumstances of that move would be forgotten.

Webber should have stayed with Williams. Hakkinen stayed true to McLaren for many years, enduring the horrid Peugeot period, and what was his reward? Two championships and a slew of wins.

[ykickamoocow 0]

Webber should have stayed with Williams.

I dont agree. Red Bull are very close to the pace of Williams at the moment and we know from various reports that the RB3 has alot of unused potentual whereas for all we know the Williams car may be at its maximum potentual right now.

[mikathegreat2 2]

The old folks home is currently full. There is however jobs avaliable which Rubens could peform as DC really needs someone to give him a bath everyday

Soo funny !

[krish 0]