Alonso Demoted To Sixth In Hungary

[AleHop 0]

Tbh I still am not convinced Ron lied or that Alonso "cheated". It's just too weird and stupid. Maybe they did but in that case there should be far greater penalties for both of them, especially Ron.

I agree, it is too much to believe they could plot altogether (FA and McLaren) such atrocity. But if they did it should be penalized with Alonso demoted to 22nd and Ron Dennis should have lost any credit he still had about the spy-Ferrari-scandal.

[Kati 0]

Oh man I'm loving this...................................

You're definately not the only My bday gift is just growing and growing hehe

Now serious. I heard about investigation after qlf but i didnt think it would get that serious. nothing ever gets that serious. i thought it would b like: hes wrong, but whatever.

[Kay 0]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61373

Letter from the stewards!

[Fed up 0]

It is strange.

If this incident was the first one this year and not the spying saga also I can see him taking the risk, but now? And again why include Lewis if he didn't really do it? Surely it's a bit far fetched to cook up that story than to say "Alonso was misinformed" which would be much easier - they didn't need to bring Lewis into it unless he did have something to do with it. Conclusion? Lewis is walking on glass right now. His market value could plummet if it's clear he put the team in this situation, as who would want a driver that isn't even loyal to the team who made him?

So Lewis winds Alonso up by disobeying the team. He gets hot headed on the radio? Perhaps whoever was listening to him on the radio decided to hold Alonso longer because he felt it was necessary (payback with the added reason of traffic)? Normally they are the ones who know the strategy, If Alonso was angry enough to do this alone then Alonso was also angry enough not to be able to think this up and time it well.

Alonso is the problem not Lewis. Alonso has already demonstrated instances where his emotions have got the better of him. I repeat, he colluded with his engineer to deliberately block Lewis from completing a lap. Now the real issue is did the whole team collude to prevent Lewis from completing the lap or was a rogue element of Nando his engineer and the physio. My thoughts lean to the latter, but Ron has implicated the whole team by trying to spin the story.

[Quiet One 15]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61373

Letter from the stewards!

I have to give FIA some credit on one point, Alonso and the team's stories don't match. That IS stupid!

Of course, Lewis story is no better. But I bet he doesn't give a crap because thanks to his shady tactics he will win the WDC. Way to go, little Schumi!

[Kay 0]

Alonso is the problem not Lewis. Alonso has already demonstrated instances where his emotions have got the better of him. I repeat, he colluded with his engineer to deliberately block Lewis from completing a lap. Now the real issue is did the whole team collude to prevent Lewis from completing the lap or was a rogue element of Nando his engineer and the physio. My thoughts lean to the latter, but Ron has implicated the whole team by trying to spin the story.

WTF? Of course Lewis is the problem. Lewis caused this whole sorry mess with a selfish act that led to another selfish act. Sure Alonso shouldn't have waited, but Lewis shouldn't have disobeyed rules. If he hadn't then we wouldn't be discussing this right now but how Fisichella should / shouldn't be punished.

The employability of Lewis has gone right down. Nobody wants a guy who isn't even loyal to the team that MADE him. He's incredibly ungrateful that Mclaren have given him this opportunity. Unfortunately for him, now Alonso has been punished along with the team, he's the only one that goes unpunished and so will seem like the ultimate bad guy in all this. He's clever, I'll give it that, but his unbelievable arrogance is shining on through. Hamilton has a huge reputation to lose, Alonso as you say is already known as emotional and will go a bit too far... this is new territory for Hamilton.

[Kay 0]

I have to give FIA some credit on one point, Alonso and the team's stories don't match. That IS stupid!

Of course, Lewis story is no better. But I bet he doesn't give a crap because thanks to his shady tactics he will win the WDC. Way to go, little Schumi!

Will it though? Ron sided with Alonso and that is an important point to remember. That means that the team will be annoyed at Hamilton as otherwise they would side with him. Alonso isn't far off the WDC, it is ONLY to sixth. A decent start off the grid and he can still get second (first if Hamilton has problems). Look at the problems between Speed and Toro Rosso... when a team and driver fall out they tend to do it on a big scale.

[mikathegreat2 2]

I'm starting to get confused here! If Alonso did it on purpose then why blame Hamilton??? Somebody explain, actually don't because I'll get even more confused!

[Oli 1]

Will it though? Ron sided with Alonso and that is an important point to remember.

Presumably that was purely to avoid a grid penalty though. Lewis disobeyed team orders, which obviously is not going to go down well, but Alonso's retaliation (if indeed that's what it was- hard to tell with all this misinformation) was his own doing I would think, and will not have gone down at all well with Ron either. My guess is that both drivers will have a somewhat stern talking to (that's British understatement right there), especially now that Ron's damage limitation exercise has failed.

McLaren need to get their house in order.

[AleHop 0]

I have to give FIA some credit on one point, Alonso and the team's stories don't match. That IS stupid!

At the same time I think that letter from the stewards is so rambling that I do not give anybody credit.

[Max Mosley 2]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61373

Letter from the stewards!

Thanks! This is what we needed. Well assuming the stewards' facts are correct, I think they make a very strong case.

About who will lose out in the long run within McLaren, I just don't know atm. As you say Ron sided with Alonso, and indeed it may possibly have been Ron who wanted Lewis punished more than Nando did. On the other hand do you think Lewis blew this story up? I mean ITV were ranting about it long before Lewis got out of the car. It's hard to say what the average McLaren team member will make of it all. I suspect the top brass will react as you predict in favour of Alonso (since after all this incident is basically a challenge to their authority) but I think many junior members will side with Lewis, as they tend to like "fair play" (the top brass know this doesn't exist in F1) and Britishness.

[pumpdoc 2]

McLaren has a big Spanish omlett on their face as of now They are the laughing stock of F1....................

[Max Mosley 2]

Yup! (Though I know how painful it was for you to say that Bruce )

[xenna 0]

I have to give FIA some credit on one point, Alonso and the team's stories don't match. That IS stupid!

Of course, Lewis story is no better. But I bet he doesn't give a crap because thanks to his shady tactics he will win the WDC. Way to go, little Schumi!

What shady tactics are you on about? Why don't you then go ahead and blame Lewis for Global warming!!

[Stub-o-matic 0]

Absolutely unveliavable... the team manager said Fernando was following the team orders and now he

[Fed up 0]

I'm starting to get confused here! If Alonso did it on purpose then why blame Hamilton??? Somebody explain, actually don't because I'll get even more confused!

What you have to do is isolate the two - Lewis demonstrated petulance by ignoring an order to yield a position to Nando. Why Nando was so slow in that opening phase escapes me as Kimi was even trying to overtake and locked up his wheels in doing so. It is fair to assume that at Nando's early pace there would have been a danger of Lewis being overtaken by both Nando and Kimi if he reduced his pace, so I give Lewis the benefit of the doubt there. His actions, however, did not prevent a driver from completing a lap.

Nando, as a form of revenge, then decided to claim the extra lap he was 'owed' by deliberately holding Lewis up in the pits when cleared to depart by the lolipop man. This act has been deemed illegal and Alonso punished accordingly. If that were the great Schumi he would have probably found a way to stall the car at the crucial point and then restart it, delaying his team mate in the same way.

Hope this helps

[pumpdoc 2]

Yup! (Though I know how painful it was for you to say that Bruce )

You know Murray right now you couldn't wipe the smile off of my face if Ferrari came dead last in this race. McLaren has been exposed for what they are.............a laughing stock.................

[Fed up 0]

Aren't TEAM ORDERS against the regulations?

Exactly! and the stupid Ron announces the fact to the whole world

[kiko01 0]

Thanks! This is what we needed. Well assuming the stewards' facts are correct, I think they make a very strong case.

About who will lose out in the long run within McLaren, I just don't know atm. As you say Ron sided with Alonso, and indeed it may possibly have been Ron who wanted Lewis punished more than Nando did. On the other hand do you think Lewis blew this story up? I mean ITV were ranting about it long before Lewis got out of the car. It's hard to say what the average McLaren team member will make of it all. I suspect the top brass will react as you predict in favour of Alonso (since after all this incident is basically a challenge to their authority) but I think many junior members will side with Lewis, as they tend to like "fair play" (the top brass know this doesn't exist in F1) and Britishness.

Yeah, Lewis showed he

[AleHop 0]

...but I think many junior members will side with Lewis, as they tend to like "fair play" (the top brass know this doesn't exist in F1) and Britishness.

Now it seems that fair play at McLaren is anything that benefits or at least don't harm Lewis.

If they agreed that the extra lap at Silverstone was for Hamilton and Alonso proceed as the team ordered and we hear it is not fair now, it was not fair that time either.

I wish LH crash tomorrow.

[Grint 0]

I am with Kay here. Seems to me that Hamilton is NOT the nice guy he pretends to be and decided to take team strategy in his own hands and as a result it is going to cost McLaren all their points and probably Alonso any shot at the win. Also now RD looks like a liar because Hamilton didn't shut up when he should.

Basically Hamilton has disobeyed a direct team order, one which impacts directly on Alonso's race strategy, and Alonso retaliates by reducing the amount of laps that Hamilton can put in during fuel-burn.

Perhaps there's a little bit of guilt on both sides but Hamilton appears to have been the catalyst.

LH ignores the directive to move over in Q3 and Alonso ignores the lollipop man. Seems an equitable response to me, but only Alonso is penalised?

It starts to sound as though they want to gift the title to LH since the relative treatment of each driver doesn't seem fair to me.

[xenna 0]

So much negativity towards a guy that didn't do anything but do his job... You guys should just admit it.. Your boy Alonso is crap and a cry baby. He's getting his arse kicked by some mixed race man and you lot just absolutely hates it!!!! lol

[Fed up 0]

Yeah, Lewis showed he

[Max Mosley 2]

What shady tactics are you on about? Why don't you then go ahead and blame Lewis for Global warming!!

Hey! Welcome back Xenna. Why don't you post some more again.

Why Nando was so slow in that opening phase escapes me as Kimi was even trying to overtake and locked up his wheels in doing so.

I did wonder whether he was playing games. Trying to make Lewis slow down more than he (Lewis) wanted to, or trying to help Kimi past Lewis. I have no evidence though.

Yeah, Lewis showed he

[Max Mosley 2]

I am with Kay here.

Always wise. Welcome mate!

Seems to me that Hamilton is NOT the nice guy he pretends to be

I should hope not. He wouldn't win anything at that rate.