Alonso Demoted To Sixth In Hungary

[AleHop 0]

but the penalized is Fernando Alonso.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61370

I'm lost now. If Ron Dennis told the truth Alonso did what the team told him to do but FIA still consider Alonso guilty... of what?

[Oli 1]

Surely that must be erroneous?

Every other source I can find says the stewards have confirmed the pole. Curious!

[Fed up 0]

I'm afraid it was too obvious that he had prevented Lewis from posting a final qualifying lap. What he should have done was to have competed as usual on track and insist that the team sanction Lewis off track.

I refused to deny what I had seen with my own eyes and it seems the Stewards agreed. I genuinely feel sorry for Nando but there is a time and a place to air grievances. Taking the law into your own hands is not conducive to a sporting community.

[kiko01 0]

Absolutely unveliavable... the team manager said Fernando was following the team orders and now he

[AleHop 0]

I'm afraid it was too obvious that he had prevented Lewis from posting a final qualifying lap. What he should have done was to have competed as usual on track and insist that the team sanction Lewis off track.

I refused to deny what I had seen with my own eyes and it seems the Stewards agreed. I genuinely feel sorry for Nando but there is a time and a place to air grievances. Taking the law into your own hands is not conducive to a sporting community.

It has been the team who told him to hold on his place. Ron Dennis said he was told to do that and it is not fair to penalize him. It should have been the team who had said him to compete as usual on track he cannot make a decission which the team do not approve.

I can only think that Ron Dennis was lying but do not think so.

[Fed up 0]

I'm glad to say that I was right all along

What Lewis failed to do was a form of team order which are not permitted in F1 - The incidents need to be seperated from a sporting perspective. Lewis didn't do any unsporting from an F1 perspective as there was sufficient time for both drivers to complete a quali lap in the dying seconds. What Alonso did was deliberate and prevented another driver from competing on the track.

It was obvious to me but others allowed their emotions to get in the way of reality.

[Kay 0]

If Ron lied then two things:

1. Has to be punished and more than no constructors points in this race.

2. What does this say for the Spy case? If he lies now...

I think it is now Lewis who will be in the naughty chair at Mclaren. I can't see them backing him for the title fight when he does this... causes a problem that was completely unnecessary. It also makes me wonder why they didn't just own up in the press conference. Lying just makes it worse and I think it will have long term effects.

[Ducado 0]

I'm glad to say that I was right all along

What Lewis failed to do was a form of team order which are not permitted in F1 - The incidents need to be seperated from a sporting perspective. Lewis didn't do any unsporting from an F1 perspective as there was sufficient time for both drivers to complete a quali lap in the dying seconds. What Alonso did was deliberate and prevented another driver from competing on the track.

It was obvious to me but others allowed their emotions to get in the way of reality.

Fantastic. Fire him - He can always get a job on SUPERNATURAL Saturday on BBC America - Have you seen that?

[kiko01 0]

I'm afraid it was too obvious that he had prevented Lewis from posting a final qualifying lap. What he should have done was to have competed as usual on track and insist that the team sanction Lewis off track.

I refused to deny what I had seen with my own eyes and it seems the Stewards agreed. I genuinely feel sorry for Nando but there is a time and a place to air grievances. Taking the law into your own hands is not conducive to a sporting community.

Whatever... even if you

[Fed up 0]

It has been the team who told him to hold on his place. Ron Dennis said he was told to do that and it is not fair to penalize him. It should have been the team who had said him to compete as usual on track he cannot make a decission which the team do not approve.

I can only think that Ron Dennis was lying but do not think so.

The problem they had with this line is that the lolipop had been raised, yet Alonso remained stationary. I reiterate, James Allen was spot on and picked it up within seconds.

Mclaren had to come up with that story as there was a danger that Alonso could be penalised and they would lose their front row advantage. It was obvious to me that Ron was spinning the story to deflect attention from Alonso's deliberate act.

[AleHop 0]

They punished FA and McLaren will not get any points for the WCC.

1) If it was McLaren who told Alonso to hold then Alonso should be free, and 2) if it was Alonso who did it on his own and Ron Dennis lie it should be both the team and Fernando Alonso penalized.

Now, is it 1 or is it 2?

Or maybe it is none, it sounds like Alonso's last year penalty for blocking Massa.

[Max Mosley 2]

OMG!!!! This is unbelievable. I agree with everything Kay said, at this stage, though my opinions change every hour today! We have to wait for the stewards' justification of their decision. What an absolutely incredible turn of events. This is the most amazing qualifying session I've ever seen.

[Quiet One 15]

[WTF?

This does not makes any sense does it????

Nevermind, you are already discussing it

Well, it still makes no sense. I hope the marshall's statement clarifies things up a little, because right now this is what I understand:

1) Alonso held Lewis on purpose.

2) This was made with the help or under the command of Ron Dennis.

3) Ergo, Ron loves Alonso so much that he conspired with Nando to ruin his other driver's chances for a pole (no matter what, the obvious result would have been Lewis totally mad at that or demotivated) and then instead of playing innocent, they put all the blame on Lewis. Do somebody honestly believe that???

The fact that all this was initiated by Lewis surely makes him worthy of a couple thousand Schumi Points...congrats little boy.

[Fed up 0]

Whatever... even if you

[Ducado 0]

The problem they had with this line is that the lolipop had been raised, yet Alonso remained stationary. I reiterate, James Allen was spot on and picked it up within seconds.

Mclaren had to come up with that story as there was a danger that Alonso could be penalised and they would lose their front row advantage. It was obvious to me that Ron was spinning the story to deflect attention from Alonso's deliberate act.

I agree - BAD ON RON DENNIS

[Kay 0]

Wait a second?

Was Fisichella punished?

If not the FIA are UNJUST once again.

[Fed up 0]

[WTF?

This does not makes any sense does it????

It does make sense - Alonso's team colluded to prevent Lewis from posting a quali lap - Ron's spin has been seen for what it is, spin!

[AleHop 0]

Lewis will not come out of this well either, but at least he has the opportunity to win the race and extend his lead on his esteemed 2xWDC team mate.

You think it is so important to extend his lead that now I see sporting is not so important for you after all.

1) Alonso did it on his own -> well done FIA.

2) The team told him to hold -> again FIA doing things normal people do not understand.

Yes, you are not normal people. I don't give a Sh#t about F1 racing if I have to see things like a crane taking LH back on track and now this. I prefer to watch something where rules are for all and above all.

[Fed up 0]

[WTF?

This does not makes any sense does it????

Nevermind, you are already discussing it

Well, it still makes no sense. I hope the marshall's statement clarifies things up a little, because right now this is what I understand:

1) Alonso held Lewis on purpose.

2) This was made with the help or under the command of Ron Dennis.

3) Ergo, Ron loves Alonso so much that he conspired with Nando to ruin his other driver's chances for a pole (no matter what, the obvious result would have been Lewis totally mad at that or demotivated) and then instead of playing innocent, they put all the blame on Lewis. Do somebody honestly believe that???

The fact that all this was initiated by Lewis surely makes him worthy of a couple thousand Schumi Points...congrats little boy.

Ron was not part of the collusion, his reaction on the pit wall made it obvious that he was not happy Nando's Physio. The collusion was between Alonso and his engineer, the latter choosing to halt his driver despite the lolipop having been raised. All of their plotting would have been recorded on the team radio.

Why Ron even bothered to put a spin on the story escapes me. The man is losing his marbles

[pumpdoc 2]

Oh man I'm loving this...................................

[Max Mosley 2]

If Ron can be proven to have lied to the stewards, he has lost a huge amount of credibility. I almost can't believe he would allow that to happen.

If Alonso asked/suggested they try lying so he didn't get penalised, I think Alonso's status in the team will take a huge tumble too. On the other hand Lewis could suffer because with his cooperation this might not have become such a huge issue.

Tbh I still am not convinced Ron lied or that Alonso "cheated". It's just too weird and stupid. Maybe they did but in that case there should be far greater penalties for both of them, especially Ron.

[pumpdoc 2]

I see a BIG implosion coming

[Fed up 0]

If Ron can be proven to have lied to the stewards, he has lost a huge amount of credibility. I almost can't believe he would allow that to happen.

If Alonso asked/suggested they try lying so he didn't get penalised, I think Alonso's status in the team will take a huge tumble too. On the other hand Lewis could suffer because with his cooperation this might not have become such a huge issue.

Tbh I still am not convinced Ron lied or that Alonso "cheated". It's just too weird and stupid. Maybe they did but in that case there should be far greater penalties for both of them, especially Ron.

Ron didn't lie - If you read his full statement he doesn't say anything that could directly implicate himself - He says

Asked why, then did Alonso sit ahead of Hamilton in the pit box for some ten seconds, Dennis replied: "He's under the control of his engineer. He determined when he goes. That's the sequence. And if you think that was a deliberate thing, then you can think what you want. I have given you exactly what happened."

He is a very clever man and cn not be implicated in any way shape or form

[kiko01 0]

I see a BIG implosion coming

indeed... i can

[Kay 0]

If Ron can be proven to have lied to the stewards, he has lost a huge amount of credibility. I almost can't believe he would allow that to happen.

If Alonso asked/suggested they try lying so he didn't get penalised, I think Alonso's status in the team will take a huge tumble too. On the other hand Lewis could suffer because with his cooperation this might not have become such a huge issue.

Tbh I still am not convinced Ron lied or that Alonso "cheated". It's just too weird and stupid. Maybe they did but in that case there should be far greater penalties for both of them, especially Ron.

It is strange.

If this incident was the first one this year and not the spying saga also I can see him taking the risk, but now? And again why include Lewis if he didn't really do it? Surely it's a bit far fetched to cook up that story than to say "Alonso was misinformed" which would be much easier - they didn't need to bring Lewis into it unless he did have something to do with it. Conclusion? Lewis is walking on glass right now. His market value could plummet if it's clear he put the team in this situation, as who would want a driver that isn't even loyal to the team who made him?

So Lewis winds Alonso up by disobeying the team. He gets hot headed on the radio? Perhaps whoever was listening to him on the radio decided to hold Alonso longer because he felt it was necessary (payback with the added reason of traffic)? Normally they are the ones who know the strategy, If Alonso was angry enough to do this alone then Alonso was also angry enough not to be able to think this up and time it well.