Mclaren To Lose All Constructor Points?

[cristiano84 0]

According to many websites, Fernando Alonso, Pedro De La Rosa and Lewis Hamilton have been granted no punishment from the FIA in exchange for a confession about the spy story at the FIA WMSC in Paris next tuesday.

If this is true I only see a likely outcome: McLaren will lose all the points from the constructor championship

Shame on FIArrari and F.1 again

[Eric 0]

How severe is this penalty? How much do constructors points REALLY mean? To me, they mean nothing, but in F1 in general, does this penalty really make a difference?

[UrKo 0]

This is getting boring. FIA clearly isn't capable of solving this matter, so after a few months we're still reading and hearing new "Sh#t" about this affair.

Pls. let them decide already, so that i can watch the race in peace without listening our stupid commentator who's trying to figure it out who really is quilty and who's not!

I might just start watching ballet instead. more relaxing...i think

[rodders47 2]

Well UrKo they way this SAGA is going, and the likelyhood of McLaren out for the rest of this year and 2008, I suggest Ballet would be more interesting but even more would be WATCHING GRASS GROW

Bernie will be the LOOSER big time if this happens, the rest of us can switch over and watch a REAL race Formula, i.e. Moto GP, they dont appear to have all this constant SH##T. They just RACE even though it's on 2 and not 4 wheels

[aussief1 4]

How severe is this penalty? How much do constructors points REALLY mean? To me, they mean nothing, but in F1 in general, does this penalty really make a difference?

The penalty is very severe and has massive ramifications to the way McLaren operate. The fallout with sponsors will be huge with most if not all sponsors not wanting anything to do with a team that had been involved and proven guilty of these charges. Especially the amount of money that they are paying for their space on the car.

Another possible problem is the loss of money from the governing body through the loss of constructor

[FUschumi 0]

This is getting boring. FIA clearly isn't capable of solving this matter, so after a few months we're still reading and hearing new "Sh#t" about this affair.

Pls. let them decide already, so that i can watch the race in peace without listening our stupid commentator who's trying to figure it out who really is quilty and who's not!

I might just start watching ballet instead. more relaxing...i think

I think Max Mosley has done a good job for FIA and Ferrari. He somehow made a loose ended decision at the first place and let Ferrari to go to court of appeal and now inviting/dragging all suspects into play especially at the crucial stage of the championship.

If I were Max, I would deduct McLaren championship points and impose hefty fine at the first meeting and would not impose open ended penalty such as "if McLaren found ........, will be disqualified..........". Oh gosh, he just kicked McLaren's door opened and given Ferrari time and opportunity to find alternative ways to get rid of McLaren.

With Max and Todt playing around, I don't think we can see McLaren around for long.

Lets put more hopes on BMW and Renault or others to challenge Ferrari in the future. Just forget McLaren from now.

[cristiano84 0]

GREAT HAMILTON!!!!!

He said that he wants to win on Ferrari home soil this weekend because they are doing Sh#t to McLaren!!!!

Lewis I'll be there for you kick their ****ing red asses

MAFIOSI!!!

[BradSpeedMan 6]

you 2....FUschumie and christiano48...are 2 of the most delusional people I've ever met on TF1

[f1reviews 0]

The bad thing is that this problem surfaced just because they caught people involved almost "on action".

They act as if they can't believe what's happening. Everyone is spying on others and ferrari is no different.

According to Mika Salo, Ferrari used to do the same. He also revealed that after every testing period, people from his team used to give him a piece of paper with the exact dialogue between Mika Hakinen and his mechanic. They were interfering with McLaren's radio frequency. And don't forget that at that time radio communication was not open for all to hear.

Anyway it's not something new to F1. And I hate the fact that everyone is acting like the sky crashed on their heads. I think it's like the doping issues on other sports. Everyone is soooooo clean, and the bad guy is the one being caught, who is being ripped by reporters and sporting authorities.

[FUschumi 0]

you 2....FUschumie and christiano48...are 2 of the most delusional people I've ever met on TF1

We just gave our point of views. Please feel free to correct my replies/posts if I were wrong. Thanks!

[pabloh20 1]

We just gave our point of views. Please feel free to correct my replies/posts if I were wrong. Thanks!

I'm not sure anybody has enough time to go through every one of your posts, to be honest.

[Wez 0]

How severe is this penalty? How much do constructors points REALLY mean? To me, they mean nothing, but in F1 in general, does this penalty really make a difference?

For the team The constructors is more important than the drivers championship.

The constructors is worth massive amounts of money to teams as well.

Personally, so long as Alonso isn't penalized I couldn't give a Sh#t what happens to those w@nkers running the team!

[FUschumi 0]

I'm not sure anybody has enough time to go through every one of your posts, to be honest.

Oh I see. That's why I feel your replies always jumping into conclusion without referring to the posts/facts/opinions. Anyway, no offence to me. Cheers!

[pabloh20 1]

Oh I see. That's why I feel your replies always jumping into conclusion without referring to the posts/facts/opinions. Anyway, no offence to me. Cheers!

You're most welcome, glad I could help.

[UrKo 0]

How severe is this penalty? How much do constructors points REALLY mean? To me, they mean nothing, but in F1 in general, does this penalty really make a difference?

I remember Frank Williams said that he prefer to win WCC over WDC. That was said back in the 90' i think when Hill won the title...

[David Adams 0]

Its all a big mess, there are many threads with many posts from all sides of the arguement stating 1 clear fact. F1 will suffer, not the team.

If McLaren are in any way penalised we will no doubt see the demise of any "racing" in F1 for the next season or two at the least, while other teams *try* to beat Ferrari and McLaren sit there, in the fancy staff room playing soduka to try and keep their minds active until such a time they can build and race a car again.

F1reviewer also made the correct comment, all teams spy and hire companies to analyse other teams. *urgh*

[Quiet One 15]

Its all a big mess, there are many threads with many posts from all sides of the arguement stating 1 clear fact. F1 will suffer, not the team.

If McLaren are in any way penalised we will no doubt see the demise of any "racing" in F1 for the next season or two at the least, while other teams *try* to beat Ferrari and McLaren sit there, in the fancy staff room playing soduka to try and keep their minds active until such a time they can build and race a car again.

Thats a result of McLaren's actions, if proven guilty.

F1reviewer also made the correct comment, all teams spy and hire companies to analyse other teams. *urgh*

If F1reviewer has any evidence of a generalized cheating, it would be good if they could bring it to justice. Otherwise, it would be better if they just STFU instead of tainting everybody else and the sport.

What's even worse. That does not relieves McLaren of any responsibility.

[f1reviews 0]

Thats a result of McLaren's actions, if proven guilty.

If F1reviewer has any evidence of a generalized cheating, it would be good if they could bring it to justice. Otherwise, it would be better if they just STFU instead of tainting everybody else and the sport.

What's even worse. That does not relieves McLaren of any responsibility.

I never said that this fact relieves McLaren of any responsibility. But it's a fact that all teams are spying on their opponents one way or another. You can look at what Mika Salo said about Ferrari. If you can't accept it, it's like trying to hide behind your finger. I just said that everybody is acting like they could never imagine this could ever happen. McLaren is responsible, and should be punished. But come on guys just because this is the first incident brought to justice (the last few years), it doesn't mean that it is the only one.

I am just talking about the fact that everyone plays surprised.

It's like Carl Lewis accusing Ben Johnson of using steroids lol..........

[Halfie 0]

I never said that this fact relieves McLaren of any responsibility. But it's a fact that all teams are spying on their opponents one way or another. You can look at what Mika Salo said about Ferrari. If you can't accept it, it's like trying to hide behind your finger. I just said that everybody is acting like they could never imagine this could ever happen. McLaren is responsible, and should be punished. But come on guys just because this is the first incident brought to justice (the last few years), it doesn't mean that it is the only one.

I am just talking about the fact that everyone plays surprised.

It's like Carl Lewis accusing Ben Johnson of using steroids lol..........

I agree 100% besides I dont think this dossier has really given Mclaren a so called advantage. Many Ferrari supporters argue its why Mclaren are competitive, but lets face it those wheel covers they have havent been copied by anyone, and Mclaren will have produced an entirely different Chassis to Ferrari so the actual usefulness of the information is at question here. 780 pages of information isnt an awful lot for a Formula 1 car, anyone involved in product development will realise theres 100's of pages just for certain components and such like, so 780 pages whilst it may sound like a lot communicates very little about the car.

I think if Mclaren were to lose all the constructor points it would be an unfair and overly harsh punishment. But Ferrari have not let this drop and therefore have been guilty of bringing the sport into disrepute and breaching article 151c anyway. By the very fact that Mclaren cant control Coughlan and his actions and therefore the team should not suffer means they should not be punished in such a way. And to all the Ferrari fans who say they should, you should suffer the same punishment for failing to control the employee that gava the dossier in the first place, which brought the sport into disrepute.

[Rainmaster 7]

According to many websites, Fernando Alonso, Pedro De La Rosa and Lewis Hamilton have been granted no punishment from the FIA in exchange for a confession about the spy story at the FIA WMSC in Paris next tuesday.

If this is true I only see a likely outcome: McLaren will lose all the points from the constructor championship

Shame on FIArrari and F.1 again

Anything that starts with 'according to many websites' instantly makes me doubt the accuracy, maybe you should give a source if you start a thread like this.

Why shame on Ferrari if Mclaren get punished? Why shame on the FIA if Mclaren get punished?

If Mclaren get punished then the FIA must have substantial evidence against them, furthermore the punishment must reflect the extent of the crime - as Ron Dennis put it 'the punishment fits the crime'. They (the FIA) can't punish them without evidence, but they can overdo the punishment - if that's what happens then it won't be 'shame on the FIA', it certainly won't be, 'shame on Ferrari'. It will just be further proof of FIA's incompetence. I can't see the FIA taking away all of Mclaren's constructor's points, how can you take away constructor's points but not drivers? I don't think it's in their best interest to punish Mclaren severely. I predict a fine, or nothing or I don't care or a riot.

Do you really think Ferrari and FIA are working together to destroy Mclaren's credibility? I think that's a bit ridiculous to say FIA are working in Ferrari's interests.

TBH I hope this is dead before next season, the spy story that is.

Also why do you type F1 as F.1, is that how you say it as well?

[Halfie 0]

I thnk the situation is getting worse for Mclaren though: http://www.totalf1.com/view-article.php?newsid=225484

[Shumi*8 0]

HI Guys, New to TF1. If Mclaren is found guilty i think they will be punished harshly. I really do hope they are not guilty. I would rather see the battle fought on the track. But Mclaren will get punished harshly if found guilty. If found guilty, i hope they throw the book at them as what they did is cheating. I feel sorry for Hamilton. Where will he go if Mclaren is not here next season????

[Shumi*8 0]

I think if Mclaren were to lose all the constructor points it would be an unfair and overly harsh punishment. But Ferrari have not let this drop and therefore have been guilty of bringing the sport into disrepute and breaching article 151c anyway. By the very fact that Mclaren cant control Coughlan and his actions and therefore the team should not suffer means they should not be punished in such a way. And to all the Ferrari fans who say they should, you should suffer the same punishment for failing to control the employee that gava the dossier in the first place, which brought the sport into disrepute.

Hale, I am a ferrari fan and i do think Mclaren should get punished if and only if the rest of the team new about it and kept it a secret. If it was only Coughlan and Stepney then fine the case should be over. But if it is true that more than Coughlan and now maybe even Pedro then hell ya they should be punished. I also agree with you that Mclaren wouldn't have had much use out of it, but surely they got something out of it. At the lease would be the wieght distribution. Nontheless, i really hope they are not guilty so we can enjoy the rest of the season and i hope i'm not biased.

[Autumnpuma 0]

I never said that this fact relieves McLaren of any responsibility. But it's a fact that all teams are spying on their opponents one way or another. You can look at what Mika Salo said about Ferrari. If you can't accept it, it's like trying to hide behind your finger. I just said that everybody is acting like they could never imagine this could ever happen. McLaren is responsible, and should be punished. But come on guys just because this is the first incident brought to justice (the last few years), it doesn't mean that it is the only one.

I am just talking about the fact that everyone plays surprised.

It's like Carl Lewis accusing Ben Johnson of using steroids lol..........

How are McLaren responsible again? The FIA determined that an employee of the team had Ferrari designs, but the team didn't use any information on their car. That's why McLaren weren't punished....the team actually gained nothing from the actions of one rogue employee. That hasn't changed until we know the nature of the new evidence presented by Alonso and de la Rosa.

You're overstating when you say 'it happens all the time'. It doesn't. It happens occasionally and the trick is correctly determining what happened on which occasion. I think you're losing sight of that in your eagerness to throw a large blanket of guilt on the McLaren team.

EDIT: typos.

[stopkidding 0]

the spy saga is depressing, for the sake of the sport, i really hope no team or driver is penalized! those hoping that action against mclaren would help ferrari and its drivers don't really know what F1 is. a fight should be on the track, by hook or by crook! I am a ferrari fan and I would like to see my team dominate by winning on the track, and not the court. having said that, if mclaren have done something grave, they would lose constructor points at most. nothing more.....