spitfire 0 Report post Posted December 24, 2007 Aren't you way too old to be using a computer? that is funny You actually have no idea about me at all I'm sure you think you know but...... we all know how well you think Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Quiet One 15 Report post Posted December 24, 2007 Hey, I live in cloud cuckoo land, what do you expect I imagine every single person who doesn't have a gun will go around murdering people if they had one. I imagine every single man is a potential muderer, rapist and much besides, they just need the opportunity. Wow, just wow, the kind of pathetic lame excuses people can come up with to defend the bald headed crook. This is how the law works - there are innocent people and there are accused people and there are guilty people. However for all purposes the accused people are the same as innocent people. That is to prevent people like you, who will go around accusing people of anything from harming innocent people. Now now. Why do you suddenly attack me? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Silver_Arrows 0 Report post Posted December 24, 2007 I imagine every single person who doesnt have a gun will go around murdering people if they had one. I imagine every single man is a potential muderer, rapist and much besides, they just need the opportunity.I suppose the fact that some employees within McLaren had access to Ferrari data automatically makes the team principle, and every other team member a cheat? Your posts are, as Kryten from red dwarf once said Garbled, Confusing, and frankly duller than an in-flight magazine produced by Air-Belgium Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rainmaster 7 Report post Posted December 25, 2007 Now now. Why do you suddenly attack me? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eric 0 Report post Posted December 25, 2007 OMGZZZZ GET THEM OUT OF F1 WAAAAH WAAAAAHA WAAAAHHHHHH OMGZZZZZZZ GET RID OF THE CHEATERS I ONLY WANT GENTLEMAN WAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH I ONLY WANT HONEST ABE (who raped women or something) IN F1 WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH WAAAAAAH Kill this thread and all of it's brothers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Oli 1 Report post Posted December 25, 2007 Agreed. He either lied, was incompetent or both. None of us know, and even fewer care. Time to move on. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jean Todt 4 Report post Posted December 25, 2007 OMGZZZZ GET THEM OUT OF F1 WAAAAH WAAAAAHA WAAAAHHHHHH OMGZZZZZZZ GET RID OF THE CHEATERS I ONLY WANT GENTLEMAN WAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH I ONLY WANT HONEST ABE (who raped women or something) IN F1 WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH WAAAAAAH Kill this thread and all of it's brothers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cavallino 2 Report post Posted December 25, 2007 Now now. Why do you suddenly attack me? Don't flatter yourself I suppose the fact that some employees within McLaren had access to Ferrari data automatically makes the team principle, and every other team member a cheat? Your posts are, as Kryten from red dwarf once said Garbled, Confusing, and frankly duller than an in-flight magazine produced by Air-Belgium OF course, they're all cheats. And his fans are cheats too by implication. So you're a cheat. Cheat Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spitfire 0 Report post Posted December 25, 2007 OF course, they're all cheats. And his fans are cheats too by implication. So you're a cheat. Cheat Well Cav thanks for that admission because even Shu has admitted that he was a cheat and that he considered it a useful tactic and that he would do it again....so by your logic because you are a fan of his, presto, that makes you a cheat to. that is not my statement it's yours. I quite frankly do not believe that being a fan of a cheat makes one a cheat, but to each his own no matter how deluded. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Silver_Arrows 0 Report post Posted December 27, 2007 Actually I am completely honest unless I have a very good reason not to be (usually only to spare someone\'s feelings), but that is besides the point really, it would appear that Cavallino has mental issues and the chances are that people that act like he does on the Internet usually have real life inadequacy issues that they have to cover by acting like a smart alec on the internet Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dribbler 6 Report post Posted December 28, 2007 Well Cav thanks for that admission because even Shu has admitted that he was a cheat and that he considered it a useful tactic and that he would do it again.... Quote please. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fed up 0 Report post Posted January 16, 2008 http://www.spiegel.de/sport/sonst/0,1518,528933,00.html Looks like the end of Mclaren Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shooting Star 0 Report post Posted January 16, 2008 http://www.spiegel.de/sport/sonst/0,1518,528933,00.htmlLooks like the end of Mclaren If that means we won't be seeing Ron's bald head sandwiched between pit-lane headphones couple of dozen times a race then YAY! Anyway...they will still be the gray, boring team with the personality of a corpse. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dribbler 6 Report post Posted January 16, 2008 http://www.spiegel.de/sport/sonst/0,1518,528933,00.htmlLooks like the end of Mclaren Was ist das? Ich nicht sprecken deutsch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goferrarigo 0 Report post Posted January 16, 2008 Was ist das? Ich nicht sprecken deutsch. Yes a translation would be nice of the article.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4 Report post Posted January 16, 2008 Yes a translation would be nice of the article.... Essentially it is reporting that Mercedes are to take a bigger share in the McLaren team above the 40% they already own and that a heads of agreement has already been put together for this. The article does not say what the new percentage ownership will be. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rainmaster 7 Report post Posted January 16, 2008 The story in full. Mercedes coy on McLaren share report By Michael ShieldsWednesday, January 16th 2008, 13:07 GMT Mercedes has refused to comment on a report that it is poised to take a majority share in McLaren. A report in German magazine Auto Motor und Sport suggested that Daimler AG intends to boost its 40 percent stake in McLaren to a majority and has already agreed the main points of a deal. The publication cited sources close to McLaren as saying talks with Daimler's Mercedes arm had been going on since October and a deal should be announced before the season starts in mid-March. A spokesman for Mercedes motorsport would not confirm the report. "The status quo has not changed at all. Daimler still holds 40 percent of the McLaren Group. We ask for your understanding that we will not comment on speculation beyond this," he said. There has been regular speculation in recent years about Mercedes, who paid an estimated $400 million for their stake in 1999, taking control of McLaren. Last January, Dennis and Saudi business partner Mansour Ojjeh announced they were selling half their stakes in the team to Bahrain's Mumtalakat Holding Company. That left Mercedes with 40 percent, Mumtalakat with 30 and Dennis and Ojjeh with 15 percent each. http://www.autosport.com/news/grapevine.php/id/64720 Not sure how this equals the end of Mclaren though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goferrarigo 0 Report post Posted January 17, 2008 Essentially it is reporting that Mercedes are to take a bigger share in the McLaren team above the 40% they already own and that a heads of agreement has already been put together for this.The article does not say what the new percentage ownership will be. Mercedes was also earlier reported to go above 50% last year sometime... I think there is very little real news, so journalists go back and re-bring up old topics... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maure 1 Report post Posted January 17, 2008 Mercedes was also earlier reported to go above 50% last year sometime... I think there is very little real news, so journalists go back and re-bring up old topics... True. At the same time, it is now more important than ever for Mercedes to step up and go from fixing someone else's messes to simply running the team. The own 40% now anyways... does it make sense to let someone else run the team while they receive 40% of the pounding? And let's be honest, RD has precipitated the handover. It makes sense for Mercedes to step up. Heck, it would even make more sense if the move implies removing the 'McLaren' part from the team's name... sad as that is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wapi 4 Report post Posted January 17, 2008 If I were FIA I would ask for RD retirement as part of the "suspended development package in exchange of droping charges deal". So it might be there. If he is forced to retire he might have decided to sell his share of the company to the obvious buyer.... If Daimler has any common sense they are going to buy RD's share of the company. On the top of everything MP4-23 was rolled out in Stuttgart, Germany! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maure 1 Report post Posted January 17, 2008 The question is what is best for the team, not for RD. Selling his share is not the point, really. He should simply remove himself (or be removed) as teamboss. Everyone will benefit, starting with Hamilton. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4 Report post Posted January 17, 2008 True.At the same time, it is now more important than ever for Mercedes to step up and go from fixing someone else's messes to simply running the team. The own 40% now anyways... does it make sense to let someone else run the team while they receive 40% of the pounding? And let's be honest, RD has precipitated the handover. It makes sense for Mercedes to step up. Heck, it would even make more sense if the move implies removing the 'McLaren' part from the team's name... sad as that is. Well the Tag Mclaren Group does a lot more than just F1 so maybe they have been reluctant to acquire all of that. The other thing is that Mercedes have been rumoured to up their stake for some time now. Don't think that Ron makes a huge difference in this - you could argue that the 2007 troubles could have made them want to invest less - distance themselves from it, etc. Of course, by owning 40% of McLaren, it also makes them 40% liable for any actions of the company esp. as the shareholders are responsible for appointing the board of directors and the directors are legally acting on behalf of the interests of the shareholders..... I would say that they would see this as a long term thing and have probably been more spooked by BMW acquiring Sauber than by Ron. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goferrarigo 0 Report post Posted January 17, 2008 Well the Tag Mclaren Group does a lot more than just F1 so maybe they have been reluctant to acquire all of that.The other thing is that Mercedes have been rumoured to up their stake for some time now. Don't think that Ron makes a huge difference in this - you could argue that the 2007 troubles could have made them want to invest less - distance themselves from it, etc. Of course, by owning 40% of McLaren, it also makes them 40% liable for any actions of the company esp. as the shareholders are responsible for appointing the board of directors and the directors are legally acting on behalf of the interests of the shareholders..... I would say that they would see this as a long term thing and have probably been more spooked by BMW acquiring Sauber than by Ron. Yes management is supposed to look after shareholder interests.. But i just remember the Merill Lynch example where the CEO have the company its biggest loss of 9.6 billion and got quite a few million dollars as compensation for being fired.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maure 1 Report post Posted January 18, 2008 Well the Tag Mclaren Group does a lot more than just F1 so maybe they have been reluctant to acquire all of that.The other thing is that Mercedes have been rumoured to up their stake for some time now. Don't think that Ron makes a huge difference in this - you could argue that the 2007 troubles could have made them want to invest less - distance themselves from it, etc. Of course, by owning 40% of McLaren, it also makes them 40% liable for any actions of the company esp. as the shareholders are responsible for appointing the board of directors and the directors are legally acting on behalf of the interests of the shareholders..... I would say that they would see this as a long term thing and have probably been more spooked by BMW acquiring Sauber than by Ron. Yep. RD does not make much of a difference which is why there is no reason to distance themselves. McLaren is not dead as a team, quite the contrary, it just behaved as such under RD's management last season. From a business point of view, this presents an opportunity to take the next step... better weak now than strong tomorrow... you know, buy low sell high. The issue of the "tag" would not be unlike Fiat and Ferrari... if that is how Mercedes wants to play it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maure 1 Report post Posted January 18, 2008 Yes management is supposed to look after shareholder interests.. But i just remember the Merill Lynch example where the CEO have the company its biggest loss of 9.6 billion and got quite a few million dollars as compensation for being fired.... The lessons of hindsight... it would have been far cheaper to fire him sooner. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites