Mclarens Problems Hamilton's Fault?

[Max Mosley 2]

As much as I disagree with Alonso and his part in Spygate, I personally feel that practically any driver on the grid would have acted in the same way, even (shock horror) the Ferrari drivers. Formula 1 drivers want a car that goes faster than their competitors, and they want to win. Schumacher acted in the same way, except he did his cheating on the track, yet most of his fans defend him. Alonso was acting in the same manner, except he didn\'t do it on the track, and I have came to the conclusion that F1 drivers are competitive animals and they will do anything to win. Alonso is not alone in that.

Of course. But so are team principles competitive animals. They all cheat.

[hookedon-f1 0]

my sentiments, exactly.

Well said !!

[Rainmaster 7]

As Dr. Gregory House would say 'everybody lies'. They are all cheating b#####ds, and it's hardly surprising considering the money involved.

Mclaren ****ed up the season and that's all anyone needs to know, Ron Dennis c#cked up and so did Alonso.

[elgo 1]

Nerd! (Cubics are cute though.)

I'll pretend I didn't hear it.

OOOOHH!!!!BTW!!!!!I've just solved the equation!

X₁=1.33463907827319

X₂=-1.36764980193121

X₃=-0.76698927634199

[Max Mosley 2]

You can only keep 14 decimal places in your mind at once? Awwwwww.

You got me thinking about my favourite equations. What a nerd I am. But the calculus of variations was always very sexy to me. It's totally amazing how much of modern physics is based on it, like quantum field theory, financial maths and sophisticated classical mechanics. It's a lot simpler than it looks and it's very beautiful:

[Quiet One 15]

I am going to throw up, hope you guys won't mind.

[aussief1 4]

Lewis wasn't the cause of any of McLaren's problems in 07 he was simply just a player in the game that was being played out between Fernando and Ron, Ferrari and McLaren, Himself and Fernando. Despite some comments he made that in hindsight where not really needed and did add fuel to the fire, but with the lure of winning the WC in his rookie year he could be forgiven for the comments in my view.

Yes I support Fernando but I was ashamed of the way he carried himself at McLaren. I expected better of him and in time I think Fernando will look back and feel the same way. He did alot of damage to his reputation that will take years to rebuild.

[BRMC 0]

Partly and No

I don't support either driver but I do reckon Ron has a paternal connection with Lewis and this was pretty obvious to the average joe so imagine what it was like for Fernando to witness this upclose. Fernie left a good team as the favourite driver and went to another formerly winning team expecting to be the revered 2X WC and was mighty shocked when he wasn't. This shock coupled with the paternal nature of the Lewis Ron relationship caused friction, this escalated and as mentioned in earlier posts poor driver/team management failed to prevent a meltdown.

Fernie is better off at Renault where his ego will stroked, Hamilton is best as McLaren where 'daddy' Ron can look after him and we're all better off for the whole fiasco having happened as it added yet another titillating chapter to 'F1 '07'.

[dribbler 6]

F*ck me. Have we not discussed this over and f*cking over again more than enough? No? Okay, call me when you're all done, i'm gonna go w8nk with a hand full of nettles.

[maure 1]

You seriously think that Ron Dennis gave Coughlan orders to steal another teams data?

Put your crack pipe down mate

I never said such a thing. I will say, however, that it is extremely amussing to me that you are forced to lie to have something to say.

I can't see anyone denying that in general, though the specifics of this case are unknown and therefore debatable. But there is at least as much evidence that Alonso did those things too, and people do seem to argue on that issue.

No evidence? Of course there is. You talk of nothing else and have explained over and over that Alonso cheated as much as RD, you know, because you believe that driving for a team is exactly the same as running a team.

Of course, McLaren cheated and lied regardless of whether or not Alonso was in it. But this is of no consequence... to you because, again, if anyone brings up anything regarding McLaren's catastrophic season you run hysterically to lynch the scapegoat designated by RD (by your own admission).

[maure 1]

O.K Maure, your defense dosen't Make sense,

You are the one defending RD and it is your defense what is falling to pieces. I expect that the rest of your reply will indeed be nothing but fantasy.

Your first Paragraph states that Ron extremely Likely that he didn't know about the Espionage scandal until It came to light at the British GP. (well that the way it seems to me the way you wrote it),

As expected, here is your first lie.

Read the sentence I wrote again and pay close attention to the use of the conditional... as in "if not from the go", again, "IF not from the go", one more time, "IF not from the go". Do you see it now? Good boy. Now you may be able to process the entire sentence, pay attention "in fact, it is nearly impossible that he didn't know, if not from the go, from the moment the sht hit the fan". In other words, the exact opposite of what your lie claims.

Then you said in the second Paragraph that he was Giving Espionage orders to Mike Coughlan and that he may have offered Nigel Stepney a role in McLaren.

As expected, another blatant lie.

I said that such a thing is POSSIBLE, not that such a thing happened... as a matter of fact, I even listed several other options.

Now wouldn't that have been during/Before the espionage that Ron Dennis didn't know about till the British Gp?

Perhaps... or perhaps RD knew all along because he was the one that put it into motion.

Maure you have lost me.

I would say you were lost to begin with. Who wouldn't be in your shoes? You have lost e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g this season and STILL kiss the a## of the man that did it to you.

Oh and what do I do in my Brain?

Read what I wrote and, this time, try not to lie to yourself as to what it says. You will understand everything.

[Jean Todt 4]

F*ck me. Have we not discussed this over and f*cking over again more than enough? No? Okay, call me when you're all done, i'm gonna go w8nk with a hand full of nettles.

just ignore Steve. Just like I am doing. Or else a certain member will claim that Some of us are on Jihad against him. He will soon blow himself anyways!

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

just ignore Steve. Just like I am doing. Or else a certain member will claim that Some of us are on Jihad against him. He will soon blow himself anyways!

Absolutely.. you know - I like F1 but not *that much* that I could get so emotional about it or any team life's too short...

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

just ignore Steve. Just like I am doing. Or else a certain member will claim that Some of us are on Jihad against him. He will soon blow himself anyways!

Absolutely.. you know - I like F1 but not *that much* that I could get so emotional about it or any team life's too short...

[Bro. 0]

You are the one defending RD and it is your defense what is falling to pieces. I expect that the rest of your reply will indeed be nothing but fantasy.

Hey its your defense that is falling to Pieces all that you can accuse me of is being a liar which is something in which I never do

As expected, here is your first lie.

My First Lie?

Read the sentence I wrote again and pay close attention to the use of the conditional... as in "if not from the go", again, "IF not from the go", one more time, "IF not from the go". Do you see it now? Good boy. Now you may be able to process the entire sentence, pay attention "in fact, it is nearly impossible that he didn't know, if not from the go, from the moment the sht hit the fan". In other words, the exact opposite of what your lie claims.

Well I asked for Clarafaction if you EVEN bothered to read my Post rather than yourself having a Bat over Fernando Alonso once Again

Ok Maure now your calling me a Liar? Hmmm? Don't you dare call me a Liar, If you do again all I'm going to say is WATCH YOUR BACK!

And I am not Kidding.

As expected, another blatant lie.

I said that such a thing is POSSIBLE, not that such a thing happened... as a matter of fact, I even listed several other options.

Which is why I said He MAY have NOT HE DID YOU SEE!

Perhaps... or perhaps RD knew all along because he was the one that put it into motion.

I would say you were lost to begin with. Who wouldn't be in your shoes? You have lost e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g this season and STILL kiss the a## of the man that did it to you.

Nah Bro You're the one who has suffered amnesia for having to Repeat yourself 3 times over early on in this post you good Boy !

Read what I wrote and, this time, try not to lie to yourself as to what it says. You will understand everything.

Ah ok Maure, I wont Lie, You lousy cook.

clean your manners out and STOP accusing me of Lying when all you're doing is defending Fernando Alonso.

I'm not happy with your Personal attack on me.

[Bro. 0]

I didn't mean to Make my point hard to read

[Jean Todt 4]

Absolutely.. you know - I like F1 but not *that much* that I could get so emotional about it or any team life's too short...

I love F1, but just as you say not *that much*. I didnt get p**sed off when I saw Lewis losing.But happy that Kimi won, but I was the happiest when I learnt Alonso won't win! Honestly, I would just carry on with my life even if Lewis is kicked out. Its really sad to see a certain member calling Lewis's fans with a name (homemade) they are not comfortable with. Calling them names is simply a personal insult. Well I can still come back and start insulting him. Anyways I myself have called others names they are not comfortable with. I have decided not to go down their level..

There were times in this forum, when I enjoyed threads and posts no way related to f1. Gheezzz.....some of these guys do know to chase the fun away.

[Jean Todt 4]

Ah ok Maure, I wont Lie, You lousy cook.

clean your manners out and STOP accusing me of Lying when all you're doing is defending Fernando Alonso.

I'm not happy with your Personal attack on me.

Just ignore those guys.

[ClinkF1 0]

Silver Arrow I hope your views were not directed at me

[Quiet One 15]

The core of all these endless discussions is precisely, that everytime somebody criticises the actions of some of the characters involved, the other posters automatically think that you are trying to excuse the others not criticised in your post, i.e.: You make a post to criticise Ron, someone replies that you are trying to excuse Nando. You make a post to criticise Nando, someone replies that you are trying to excuse the FIA, and so on, and so on....ad nauseam.

Nobody with at least hal a neurone still working would try to excuse any of the guys involved. You might discuss levels of responsability, but, frankly, I don't see the point as no ones qualifies for a "not guilty" label amongst the involved. THey all did the best they could to mess things up, they all had to pay a price for it. They all lost reputation.

As Fedup would put it: Just my take.

[Max Mosley 2]

No evidence? Of course there is. You talk of nothing else and have explained over and over that Alonso cheated as much as RD, you know, because you believe that driving for a team is exactly the same as running a team.

Of course, McLaren cheated and lied regardless of whether or not Alonso was in it. But this is of no consequence... to you because, again, if anyone brings up anything regarding McLaren's catastrophic season you run hysterically to lynch the scapegoat designated by RD (by your own admission).

I think you are a prank poster, but in any case no one is taking you seriously, and you refuse to be bound by the rules of logic, so there is little point in showing all the errors in the above post.

The core of all these endless discussions is precisely, that everytime somebody criticises the actions of some of the characters involved, the other posters automatically think that you are trying to excuse the others not criticised in your post, i.e.: You make a post to criticise Ron, someone replies that you are trying to excuse Nando. You make a post to criticise Nando, someone replies that you are trying to excuse the FIA, and so on, and so on....ad nauseam.

Nobody with at least hal a neurone still working would try to excuse any of the guys involved. You might discuss levels of responsability, but, frankly, I don't see the point as no ones qualifies for a "not guilty" label amongst the involved. THey all did the best they could to mess things up, they all had to pay a price for it. They all lost reputation.

As Fedup would put it: Just my take.

Yes, but my take is that your take is always too evenly balanced. The quality of posts we get from the Nando fans is exceptionally low - yourself, Kiko and Angie excepted.

[Quiet One 15]

I think you are a prank poster, but in any case no one is taking you seriously, and you refuse to be bound by the rules of logic, so there is little point in showing all the errors in the above post.

Yes, but my take is that your take is always too evenly balanced. The quality of posts we get from the Nando fans is exceptionally low - yourself, Kiko and Angie excepted.

So you say I should be more unbalanced? Ok, LISTEN TO ME!!! EVERYBODY EXCEPT LIUZZI SUCKS! THEY ARE ALL A BUNCH OF CHEATERS!!! THEY ALL DESERVE TO DIE, PAINFULLY!! THEY ALL STOLE THE WDC FROM LIUZZI, THE ONLY WORTHY CANDIDATE FOR THE TITLE!!!

There, is that any better?

[Silver_Arrows 0]

I never said such a thing. I will say, however, that it is extremely amussing to me that you are forced to lie to have something to say.

Are you mentally retarded or something maure? all that I said was that I find the idea of Ron Dennis ordering a member of his team to steal someone else\'s documents increadibly hard to believe. I was not lying for something to say, I was making a comment about the total idiocity of your post.

[Bro. 0]

Just ignore those guys.

It looks as though I'm going to have too, Thanks for the Advice Abbas.

The Reason why I kept on responding is so that I will not let him win over me, if I ingorned him maybe he would have thought he would have won over me.

I wish that the forumers like Senna, Monza Gorilla, NoJVNoF1, Bajo39, V12, ETC. came back and replaced these idiots who come and post on this forum and when you reply back your called a Liar?---And I am not the only one...

Bring back the real posters who respects your response like yourself Abbas, I wish I could have spoken to them when they used to post

[Jean Todt 4]

It looks as though I'm going to have too, Thanks for the Advice Abbas.

The Reason why I kept on responding is so that I will not let him win over me, if I ingorned him maybe he would have thought he would have won over me.

I wish that the forumers like Senna, Monza Gorilla, NoJVNoF1, Bajo39, V12, ETC. came back and replaced these idiots who come and post on this forum and when you reply back your called a Liar?---And I am not the only one...

Bring back the real posters who respects your response like yourself Abbas, I wish I could have spoken to them when they used to post

Never argue with an idiot. He will make you go down to his level and beat you with experience. You would have read this else where in this forum.

I have read both your's and HIS posts and I say you discus it out with other members.

For record, there are many more good posters still sticking to this forum, example

Muzza, Andres (so called Quite one), Steve (the dribbler), DOF_Renault( the f1 dictionary and encyclopedia), cav (really interesting arguments) Mike, Paul, Kay, Katy, Eric,c21 etc etc etc. it goes on..sorry I I am too lazy to type everyone's names.