lipstick79

Customer > Works

16 posts in this topic

Mclaren powered by Renault.  Will probably finish the season higher in the constructors,
than the works Renault team.
With Mclaren set 2 become a Mercedes customer, having been the unofficial Mercedes Works team.
Will it B possible/likely for Mclaren to finish the season higher in the constructors than the Mercedes Works team?
 

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Only if they have the budget that Mercedes has.

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Far more interesting question is what took them so long (since 2015?} for McLaren to realize they had it actually quite good  thing going with Mercedes?

Edited by Sakae

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Latest buzz from Germany - Mercedes (F1) is on the market for sale...

If true, I think several factors might have contributed:

1. There is (probably) nothing much to gain for Merc staying with Liberty.

2. Electrical cars and promise they hold for future.

3. Much has change in political arenas (UK, US), and global business is adverseky affected. I've raised these concerns several years ago, only to be chastised for it (mostly by UK fans) as total nonsence. Well, maybe, stay tune. We need to have this confirmed first. I see however Hamilton's concern that Wolff might be (considering?) leaving...one wonders why that would be.

Might be that Torger is bored, or physically and mentally exhausted...I would accept such reality and not hold it against him. Might be, new owners will want change in team's management and he has more information about it than we do.

Wiki

Quote

Källenius is a strong advocate of plug-in hybrids and electric vehicles within Daimler. He has pushed the new electric model initiative, product and technology brand EQ.[6] Within the initiative he has proposed and advocated for a series of ten new and purely electric Mercedes-Benz models[7] to be launched by 2022. The first car will be the Mercedes EQ SUV, dubbed the EQC, launching in the first half of 2019.[6]

Mr. Källenius replaced Dr. Zetsche in summer this year.

Edited by Sakae

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This is rumor that I gather is based upon a single source by a single reporter. I will wait for more confirming rumors before I take it seriously.

How many times have we heard of rumor team sales that never happen? For example, how many times did we hear that Toro Rosso was about to be sold? Now, there was some basis to these rumors...but...sometimes selling an F1 team does not work out. The perfect buyer rarely arrives (although hard to argue that Penske is not close to a perfect buyer). 

 

On the other hand, I do note that McLaren has signed up to run Mercedes engines. They certainly would not do that and diss Renault unless they had some guarantee of continuity. So perhaps the real situation is that Mercedes is looking for someone to take over the team in 2021 (which will be budget capped) and Mercedes will just continue with engines (which are not budget capped).

 

Edited by Ruslan

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True as you suggest, however I smell a lot of smoke around that story. With respect to engines, it has been said (same source), that Mercedes would be inclined to remain engaged with F1 as a PU ("engine") supplier.

Edited by Sakae

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Well I suspect they are contractually obligated to provide engines for a while. Regardless, even the rumors say they will continue as an engine manufacturer. There is a certain logic to them leaving F1 as a consructor, but I doubt they will do this. Hard to quit while you are ahead.

Edited by Ruslan

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In my eyes, as much as I love German cars, however Mercedes's legacy IMHO has been defined already. It is not how much they won, but how they won it. 

Edited by Sakae

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On 05/11/2019 at 7:07 AM, Sakae said:

Far more interesting question is what took them so long (since 2015?} for McLaren to realize they had it actually quite good  thing going with Mercedes?

It is NOT an interesting question - Obvious REALLY
Ron - OUSTED
(Ron) WANTED 2 REVIVE the Honda GLORY years - Honda  were NOT able to provide.
NEEDED 2 resign Alonso, so SIGNED with Renault -  Alonso NOW not IN F1
Re: ... realize they had it actually quite good  thing going with Mercedes 
>Mclaren will NOT B the works Mercedes team though - NOT the same situation

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5 hours ago, Sakae said:

In my eyes, as much as I love German cars, however Mercedes's legacy IMHO has been defined already. It is not how much they won, but how they won it. 

You're just p**sed because they beat your favorite driver.

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7 hours ago, Ruslan said:

You're just p**sed because they beat your favorite driver.

Well, maybe so, however more importantly, I think that no other "dynasty" in history of this sport was as protected by - may I say - inept regulations as this team is since intro of hybrids.

Teams are faced with complex technology requiring resources, time, and freedom to make mistakes in development without burying whole season, yet there is a roadblock after roadblock for competition to rise up from ashes disastrous flawed initial design of 2014 represented. And yet, if they do progress after long struggle, we see almost instantly TD(s) begin flowing one after another, air is soaked with nastiness of suspicion and name calling. Story is not closed yet on that and RBR is pushing for further investigation of Ferrari.

Sad fact also is, if this all insane environment was created in the name of saving Williams, Force India and alike, it is failed policy, as Sergio once said. Ferrari didn't saved a single € in the struggle to stay competitive and match a leader. It all just became more expensive.

That's how I, unapologetically, will remember Mercedes's tainted legacy. I am not really sure who is responsible for this mess, suspects could be named, but outcome is here for all to see. It might not be Mercedes's responsibility, however their victories under circumstances described sound very hollow to me. I am not alone in this observation. Just recall words of Tony Kanaan when Rosberg won the season; Hamilton is racing in series of two cars, and he came second best. Hamilton's fans might get upset over this, but implication of his words went beyond a simple slap. It represented sad state of the series. 

Edited by Sakae

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14 hours ago, Sakae said:

In my eyes, as much as I love German cars, however Mercedes's legacy IMHO has been defined already. It is not how much they won, but how they won it. 

But STILL a long way BEHIND Ferrari F1 GREATNESS
Ferrari WILL have the unbreakable FACT that Ferrari HAS been in F1 since day 1 
All the others can do is, create their own little records

I an NOT a Ferrari fan, I AM a Mclaren man.
I HAVE even been to the, Mclaren Technology Centre as a guest of Ron Dennis.

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19 hours ago, Ruslan said:

 

On the other hand, I do note that McLaren has signed up to run Mercedes engines. They certainly would not do that and diss Renault unless they had some guarantee of continuity. So perhaps the real situation is that Mercedes is looking for someone to take over the team in 2021 (which will be budget capped) and Mercedes will just continue with engines (which are not budget capped).

 

I like this theory (for someone to take over the team in 2021) Somebody like Brawn GP !!
In the V8 era.  Mclaren WERE the Unofficial Mercedes WORKS team.  Norbert Hague would OFTEN B seen 
in the Mclaren pit

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2 hours ago, lipstick79 said:

But STILL a long way BEHIND Ferrari F1 ...

Well, yes. Point is, new management is evaluating presence in F1 as a business decision, rather than worrying about legacy. GP racing is more than 100 years old, and many racing teams come an go. Both, Mercedes and Ferrari have glory filled past, however it is just in recent years when dark influence  from Tier 2 has taken over, steering direction of F1 into abyss.

The man who replaced Dr. Zetsche at the helm is someone who is impressed by a balance sheet, rather than being concerned whether Hamilton is happy with the team. Mercedes's future in F1 (so I hear) is under consideration, but not certain.

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