How Do U Talk 2 Girls

[mock 0]

Is it any wonder I don't know whether you're in favour of equality or not?

In favour, very much. But my concept of equality does not extend to certain things - for example, a man can go bare chested on a hot day, in the middle of town. Equality would dictate that a woman too, should be allowed to perform similar actions, however, I do not think that that kind of equality is acceptable or warranted.....

I believe in equality, but my concept of equality does not extend to believing that women will be able to drive properly even if they were given an opportunity to do so. In short, try and keep them out of the drivers seat in a car, truck, bus or SUV or something similar.

I believe in equality but this does not extend to women serving actively in the armed forces in a war zone. That to me is stupidity.

I believe in equality but this does not extend to my preference to hire guys for my new office - when late work is to be done, it does not make sense to have women around - single ones face the transport back home, and irate parents should they be staying with their parents, and of course with marriage and kids around the corner, they become overheads, and if they are married and have kids well then, working late is not possible or fair is it ?

I believe in equality but I still wouldn't watch the Womens world cup football, and unlikely I would watch the Womens World cup for cricket.

Oh yes, I do believe in equality which is why I am in charge of washing the dishes, cooking once in a while, giving Mark his bath before he goes to sleep, changing his diapers and doing the grocery shopping and when needs be I do stuff like dusting, sweeping, mopping up. None of the traditional 'the woman is in charge of the home' BS for me..

Now, talking about the west, please explain to this lost soul on equality in the West.......

[pabloh20 1]

In favour, very much. But my concept of equality does not extend to certain things - for example, a man can go bare chested on a hot day, in the middle of town. Equality would dictate that a woman too, should be allowed to perform similar actions, however, I do not think that that kind of equality is acceptable or warranted.....

I believe in equality, but my concept of equality does not extend to believing that women will be able to drive properly even if they were given an opportunity to do so. In short, try and keep them out of the drivers seat in a car, truck, bus or SUV or something similar.

I believe in equality but this does not extend to women serving actively in the armed forces in a war zone. That to me is stupidity.

I believe in equality but this does not extend to my preference to hire guys for my new office - when late work is to be done, it does not make sense to have women around - single ones face the transport back home, and irate parents should they be staying with their parents, and of course with marriage and kids around the corner, they become overheads, and if they are married and have kids well then, working late is not possible or fair is it ?

I believe in equality but I still wouldn't watch the Womens world cup football, and unlikely I would watch the Womens World cup for cricket.

Oh yes, I do believe in equality which is why I am in charge of washing the dishes, cooking once in a while, giving Mark his bath before he goes to sleep, changing his diapers and doing the grocery shopping and when needs be I do stuff like dusting, sweeping, mopping up. None of the traditional 'the woman is in charge of the home' BS for me..

Now, talking about the west, please explain to this lost soul on equality in the West.......

They are allowed to go the football match these days, though it's not encouraged!

[cavallino 2]

In favour, very much. But my concept of equality does not extend to certain things - for example, a man can go bare chested on a hot day, in the middle of town. Equality would dictate that a woman too, should be allowed to perform similar actions, however, I do not think that that kind of equality is acceptable or warranted.....

Why?

I believe in equality, but my concept of equality does not extend to believing that women will be able to drive properly even if they were given an opportunity to do so. In short, try and keep them out of the drivers seat in a car, truck, bus or SUV or something similar.

Meaningless. Everybody can drive competently, you'd have to be badly hampered in some way to not be able to - and I am talking of Indian roads here - a three toad ape with unopposed thumbs could drive in the west. It's not rocket science. Most of the jackasses on Indian roads are men, most drunk drivers are men, msot drivers going too afst for their own good are men.

I believe in equality but this does not extend to women serving actively in the armed forces in a war zone. That to me is stupidity.

Well if they want to..

I believe in equality but this does not extend to my preference to hire guys for my new office - when late work is to be done, it does not make sense to have women around - single ones face the transport back home, and irate parents should they be staying with their parents, and of course with marriage and kids around the corner, they become overheads, and if they are married and have kids well then, working late is not possible or fair is it ?

In many a western country, you'd have been sued for millions, and you would have lost under anti discrimination laws. Justifiably so. It's a crying shame people like you run companies in one of the most progressive cities in India. Whose fault is it that it is unsafe for women to work late, theirs?

I believe in equality but I still wouldn't watch the Womens world cup football, and unlikely I would watch the Womens World cup for cricket.

That has nothing to do with equality.

Oh yes, I do believe in equality which is why I am in charge of washing the dishes, cooking once in a while, giving Mark his bath before he goes to sleep, changing his diapers and doing the grocery shopping and when needs be I do stuff like dusting, sweeping, mopping up. None of the traditional 'the woman is in charge of the home' BS for me..

How very kind of you

[Max Mosley 2]

In favour, very much. But my concept of equality does not extend to certain things

Equality doesn't mean that men and women have to be treated identically at all. For instance, there are good reasons why we only allow women to be grid girls. Likewise there are good reasons why men tend to pay for dinner on a date, even though women often earn more nowadays, or why it's more acceptable for a women to slap a man than vice versa. To say this is not to say we don't believe in equality - rather it's to understand precisely what equality means.

for example, a man can go bare chested on a hot day, in the middle of town. Equality would dictate that a woman too, should be allowed to perform similar actions, however, I do not think that that kind of equality is acceptable or warranted.....

Well there is clearly a distinction here between a man's chest and a woman's. The woman's chest is very sexual, whereas a man's is not to the same extent. You might argue that it is improper to be sexually provocative in such a public place, especially when there will be young children around, and so because of a real difference between men and women, we ought to be treated differently. That's not a problem for equality because men and women are treated differently because we are different in a way that is relevant to that situation.

For the record, I don't know what the rules on toplessness in the "West" are. Certainly women do very often go topless in public places, such as parks, beaches, bars, nightclubs, strip clubs etc, without ever being rebuked for it in my experience. I've seen people have sex in public places plenty of times, which probably is illegal. In fact I remember the Danish government recently paid women to go topless in public whilst holding placards telling drivers to slow down. The rules will be different in every country and personally I would favour a very liberal approach both out of self interest and also because I can't see any reason to stop it other than prudishness. Finally, in practice the reason women don't do this more often is really because they impose this rule on themselves: it's not men that object!

I believe in equality, but my concept of equality does not extend to believing that women will be able to drive properly even if they were given an opportunity to do so. In short, try and keep them out of the drivers seat in a car, truck, bus or SUV or something similar.

Well I'm in favour of women being allowed to drive but I agree they aren't very skilled drivers on average - again that's a genuine difference and nothing to do with equality. The only consolation is that they are safer drivers than young men.

I believe in equality but this does not extend to women serving actively in the armed forces in a war zone. That to me is stupidity.

I'm probably in favour of them serving. Only women who meet the same exacting standards as men should be allowed of course. There will be 10 men for every woman who can do the job therefore, but those that can should be allowed to do it. Sometimes people say that women shouldn't be allowed to do it because they want to protect the women! This is a form of discrimination imho: women are perfectly capable of making their own decisions and they have the right to do so. The only reason I can think of for not allowing women to serve would be if they would disrupt the army by inadvertently making the male soldiers act differently (maybe the men would disobey orders to protect women but not men colleagues). Whether this happens has to be tested empirically.

I believe in equality but this does not extend to my preference to hire guys for my new office - when late work is to be done, it does not make sense to have women around - single ones face the transport back home, and irate parents should they be staying with their parents, and of course with marriage and kids around the corner, they become overheads, and if they are married and have kids well then, working late is not possible or fair is it ?

Well it's your business and I really don't want to interfere but in the "West" that would be illegal. Women get paid less here but I personally think, somewhat controversially, that most of the gap is because of women's own actions and choices. Like you say, they are more likely to take time out, not work as late, give up work altogether etc. However there are lots of very capable women who do a great job and they must not be discriminated against just because they are anatomically capable of giving birth. I think the West's approach here is more or less right.

I believe in equality but I still wouldn't watch the Womens world cup football, and unlikely I would watch the Womens World cup for cricket.

Nor would I. Women aren't good at many sports. Thats not discrimination, it's a choice based on a real difference between men and women.

Oh yes, I do believe in equality which is why I am in charge of washing the dishes, cooking once in a while, giving Mark his bath before he goes to sleep, changing his diapers and doing the grocery shopping and when needs be I do stuff like dusting, sweeping, mopping up. None of the traditional 'the woman is in charge of the home' BS for me..

Good for you Mock! You're better than I am...

Now, talking about the west, please explain to this lost soul on equality in the West.......

Well I think generally women have more respect and equality in the West and that that's a good thing. Often people in other countries where women get a raw deal claim that women have more "respect" there than in the West based on a misunderstanding of equality and respect. You need only look at what the Taleban or Victorian Englanders said to see good examples of what I'm talking about. (India of course is nowhere near as bad as that but I just wanted to make the general point.)

[Max Mosley 2]

And I agree with Cav and Paul, as always.

[ykickamoocow 0]

In fact I remember the Danish government recently paid women to go topless in public whilst holding placards telling drivers to slow down.

Wouldnt that cause more accidents than it would prevent

[Max Mosley 2]

That's exactly what I thought, ykick! Apparently it did have some success though! http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6181788.stm

EDIT: OK it was only a video they made I think, so maybe it wasn't a very good example above.

[mock 0]

Well I think generally women have more respect and equality in the West and that that's a good thing. Often people in other countries where women get a raw deal claim that women have more "respect" there than in the West based on a misunderstanding of equality and respect. You need only look at what the Taleban or Victorian Englanders said to see good examples of what I'm talking about. (India of course is nowhere near as bad as that but I just wanted to make the general point.)

So we agree on most things. I would prefer to hire guys for my office simple because it makes more sense financially and economically and I have to show a profit at the end of the day. If I find a woman who can match up with a guy, stride for stride, I would prefer to hire her because they are more loyal and committed, at the end of the day, but you can't run a profit centre on loyalty and commitment only.

Well a lot of Indian culture and philosophy on women and sex and what is acceptable and what is not has been shaped by Victorian England.

We still don't have the same concepts of respect and equality and I'm OK with it. Everywhere you go, you have good examples and bad examples, there are very bad examples here to in India. And I guess I may also be speaking with a distorted view given the urban context and religious background I come from....

[cavallino 2]

So we agree on most things. I would prefer to hire guys for my office simple because it makes more sense financially and economically and I have to show a profit at the end of the day. If I find a woman who can match up with a guy, stride for stride, I would prefer to hire her because they are more loyal and committed, at the end of the day, but you can't run a profit centre on loyalty and commitment only.

I hope you get a nice profit at the end of the year , you are probably doing far more harm than the idiot who gropes women on a bus. Why don't you use child labour too? You'd get away with it and you can show a bigger profit. I do hope you don't pay any taxes, they eat into your profit you know. You do steal your electricity right, I hope you are not crazy enough to pay your bills, my what would that do to your profits.

[Max Mosley 2]

I hope you get a nice profit at the end of the year , you are probably doing far more harm than the idiot who gropes women on a bus. Why don't you use child labour too? You'd get away with it and you can show a bigger profit. I do hope you don't pay any taxes, they eat into your profit you know. You do steal your electricity right, I hope you are not crazy enough to pay your bills, my what would that do to your profits.

Yes I agree. Mock, you say that even if a woman genuinely wanted to have casual sex with you, you'd turn her down because you think it would be disrespectful, but you're happy to employ men instead of women purely based on their gender. This is exactly the sort of thing that always strikes me about people who talk about "respecting" women: they almost always have very old-fashioned notions that cause women great suffering.

Well a lot of Indian culture and philosophy on women and sex and what is acceptable and what is not has been shaped by Victorian England.

A more recent and very distinguished Englishman said "they fcuk you up, your parents, they don't mean to, but they do". Perhaps there's something in there for India to learn too?

We still don't have the same concepts of respect and equality and I'm OK with it. Everywhere you go, you have good examples and bad examples, there are very bad examples here to in India. And I guess I may also be speaking with a distorted view given the urban context and religious background I come from....

Of course there are bad examples everywhere you go, but that's no excuse for supporting the Victorian notions that women are not capable either of making a free decision about with whom to sleep or working as effectively as men.