VILLENEUVE IN SAUBER TALKS

[Senna 0]

ok, so Rubens is good 2 races a year, 3 tops, hell of a teammate. Look, Senna beat Prost, in an equal car, can't see M$ either accepting a teammate of Prosts calibre or beating him!! As for M$ poles, those from last year onwards mean nothing with this system. Look, Schumacher is great, but Senna was better  8)

Absolutely true.

[Shadow 0]

Shadow, I don't think Gilles would have matched Senna, Ayrton was very very good technically and the like, whilst Gilles just drove the balls off the car, however in terms of raw speed, Gilles v Ayrton would have been the best contest F1 has ever seen!! Sadly we'll never know 

Just to clarify, I had only on track battles in mind when made that comment.

[AutoRacer5 0]

Besides no team would try to sign an equal for MS.

[Taku 0]

Besides no team would try to sign an equal for MS.

i believe you meant to say m$ would not allow his team to sign an equal for him.

now to the jv fans, did jacques ever veto any of his prospective teammates?

up until jb, and even he was an unknown quantity at the time, i dont recall jv having any a-grade teammates.

[nojvnof1 0]

Besides no team would try to sign an equal for MS.

i believe you meant to say m$ would not allow his team to sign an equal for him.

now to the jv fans, did jacques ever veto any of his prospective teammates?

up until jb, and even he was an unknown quantity at the time, i dont recall jv having any a-grade teammates.

JV never vetoed teammates, and doesn't pick and choose. He's had Damon Hill, Heinz Harald Frentzen (both at their peaks), Ricardo Zonta, Mika Salo (a few races in 99 when Zonta was injured), Olivier Panis, and Jenson Button as teammates. JV beat them all except for Hill, got damn close but in his first year, and Button, although there were mitigating circumstances, Richards politics and unreliability to name two. It's not JV's fault the team couldn't hire A-grade drivers, although at the time 96-98, Hill and Frentzen were A-grade. In '99, when BAR started Pollock said he was gunning for M$/JV partnership, JV's response, and the same response in the past few years when asked if he would like M$ as a teammate was "Bring it on". JV's always made noise about relishing the chance to be M$' teammate and I have the magazines with those quotes to prove it. When M$ was asked about having JV as a teammate, he dismissed it totally.

Got your point Shadow, yeah that would have been a terrific duel, brilliant!!!!

[Taku 0]

JV never vetoed teammates, and doesn't pick and choose. He's had Damon Hill, Heinz Harald Frentzen (both at their peaks), Ricardo Zonta, Mika Salo (a few races in 99 when Zonta was injured), Olivier Panis, and Jenson Button as teammates. JV beat them all except for Hill, got damn close but in his first year, and Button, although there were mitigating circumstances, Richards politics and unreliability to name two. It's not JV's fault the team couldn't hire A-grade drivers, although at the time 96-98, Hill and Frentzen were A-grade. In '99, when BAR started Pollock said he was gunning for M$/JV partnership, JV's response, and the same response in the past few years when asked if he would like M$ as a teammate was "Bring it on". JV's always made noise about relishing the chance to be M$' teammate and I have the magazines with those quotes to prove it. When M$ was asked about having JV as a teammate, he dismissed it totally.

Got your point Shadow, yeah that would have been a terrific duel, brilliant!!!!

when i said he had no a-grade team mate i meant at bar, when he was in a relative position of strength to build the team around him, and where i imagine he could have pulled his weight in driver choice.

but thanks mate, thats exactly what i wanted to know. :wink:

what with jv's salary tho, i doubt they'd have been able to afford an a-grade teammate for him anyway!

but what you've said above does show why so many (incl. the man bernie himself) want a character like jv back. a true competitor at heart.

[Shadow 0]

You know before signing JB, DR asked JV about his new team mates. And JV's response

1. MS

2. JB

After bringing JB on DR quoted him as world Champion etc..(you know the story) but JV was a driving force to have Button on the team. So, it proves he could spot competitive team-mates does'nt it?

[Senna 0]

JV was paired with Damon Hill, the 1996 F1 Champion and Michael Schumacher

[Shadow 0]

I see what you mean Senna. I am strongly reminded of the A-1 Ring when you say team orders.

[Taku 0]

Jenson Button is looking very good indeed - He

[Senna 0]

I see what you mean Senna. I am strongly reminded of the A-1 Ring when you say team orders.

So you should be for it was quite possibly the best example of the application of team orders ever and one where it simply wasn

[Senna 0]

annihilate would be too strong a use of language in this context...

removing mechanical reliability from the equation, "outperformed to date" would be more appropriate imo.  even so, so far this year he has out-qualified button on numerous occasions, been on the front row, and has also stepped onto the podium.   

just my 2 cents senna...

Jenson Button is 3rd in the WDC with 71 points and has been on the podium around 8 times this season. Takuma Sato is 9th in the WDC with a measly 23 points and has only been on the podium once. Sato is consistently slower than Button and has still spun, crashed and made futile excessively adventurous overtaking manoeuvres this season. Many of the times Sato has out qualified Button, who incidentally carries more fuel, it is because of mistakes by Jenson. Yet despite this, Jenson has still out qualified Sato more times than not. As for having your 2 cents Taku, that

[pumpdoc 2]

8) Hey Spink just what is your problem with Sato, are you a racist?

[Shadow 0]

8) Hey Spink just what is your problem with Sato, are you a racist?

No problems with Sato, but the point is JV would have comfortably outperformed MR.Crashaholic. :wink:

[Senna 0]

8) Hey Spink just what is your problem with Sato, are you a racist?

Yet another idiotic post! I dislike Sato simply because he has very little talent in an F1 car and took the drives of both Jean Alesi and Jacques Villeneuve simply because of his nationality. If you had understood my post as it was intended to be understood pumpdoc you would see that I only contrast the respective performances of both Sato and Button this year in terms of their on track record and certainly do not make any racist remarks or any remarks which could be perceived to have negative racial connotations. I was simply trying to point out the fact that Sato owes his drive at BAR to Honda and not his natural ability. Evidently you

[pumpdoc 2]

8) God I'd love to fly to England just to sit in a pub, knock a few back and watch a race with ya!

[AutoRacer5 0]

Wish we could all meet in a pub or place. I couldn't get in, I'm only 15...

[nojvnof1 0]

Jenson Button is looking very good indeed - He

[Taku 0]

Jenson Button is 3rd in the WDC with 71 points and has been on the podium around 8 times this season.  Takuma Sato is 9th in the WDC with a measly 23 points and has only been on the podium once.  Sato is consistently slower than Button and has still spun, crashed and made futile excessively adventurous overtaking manoeuvres this season.  Many of the times Sato has out qualified Button, who incidentally carries more fuel, it is because of mistakes by Jenson.  Yet despite this, Jenson has still out qualified Sato more times than not.  As for having your 2 cents Taku, that

[Taku 0]

No way has Webber annihalated Klein, the points score is 7-3, and they've both had similar reliability. He beat him, but didn't annihalate him.

it may be too early to say annihilated because kilen is certainly turning it around. however, those points are from only one points finish, webber did quali on the front row in the jag, and i do recall webber still beating him in one race this year despite an extra pitstop and a drive-through penalty.

yes, i agree i may have been a little harsh on ck.