325 replies to this topic

[BradSpeedMan]

DPR, on 19 March 2012 - 08:19 AM, said:

You reap what you sew!
Ferrari during the Kimi years actively encouraged Massa to push for #1 status and have since told him that he won't be considered for promotion and pushed him back into his #2 box.
Poor Massa was being asked to apply for Kimi's job one minute, then the next, they recruited from an external source (santander)!

No wonder Massa is demotivated (maybe even mentally scarred). If your boss kept grooming you for promotion, then signed a new contract with a new supplier - under the terms that the new supplier fill the vacancy. Then you too would feel like Sh#t.
Fact is, Ferrari have put all their eggs in one santander/alonso basket and it's not working!
In the past when they signed Scumi to be designated #1, they also signed his entire life support system too.

They are lucky that Massa is still deluded enough to think he may have a chance one day. He makes alonso look half decent in that pile of 2012 crap  - so for reason Santander will keep him for this year.

Alehop, in all seriousness, I think DPR's points here holds alot of weight...

Ferrari needs 2 strong drivers to succeed, one to drive Alonso to his limit, thats why I think that if they recruit Kubica (if he can return to his best form) is their best available option, if not Webber. This will bring additional problems though. Their biggest mistake was supporting a nr1 driver, since massa 2008 they've been on this downward spiral, and it will not help if they insist or show Massa this loyalty...

Edited by BradSpeedMan, 19 March 2012 - 12:23 PM.

[AleHop]

Ferrari need a competitive car more than anything else. Without that they'll still be like a poor with old memories of wealth.

[BradSpeedMan]

AleHop, on 19 March 2012 - 12:29 PM, said:

Ferrari need a competitive car more than anything else. Without that they'll still be like a poor with old memories of wealth.

and 2 competitive drivers to drive them to it... with the engineers. Right now they have only 1 in Alonso, thats where the problem lies...

every other top team has 2 excellent drivers...

Edited by BradSpeedMan, 19 March 2012 - 12:42 PM.

[DPR]

My personal hope is that they keep the same team that has failed since the santander take-over.
Quite frankly, if heritage mattered that much, there are plenty of vintage races around to enjoy.
Ferrari won't replace Massa until they can find another sap that sanntander are happy with. (Alguersuari??)
I wouldn't miss the cry baby Italians if they decided to walk away from F1 tomorrow

[Argento Reloaded]

Considering the current level of performance at Ferrari, I keep Massa and start to use his car as a lab-car in order to recover quickly.

[BradSpeedMan]

DPR, on 19 March 2012 - 12:53 PM, said:

Quite frankly, if heritage mattered that much, there are plenty of vintage races around to enjoy.

[BradSpeedMan]

I swear to God I only read this now...

http://www.pitpass.c...ture-at-Ferrari

[yurp]

After a decent effort from many of the new comers in Australia I'd like to see one of them get the Ferrari seat.
There are hungry drivers at Sauber amongst other teams who would do a better job than Massa.
But who knows, if this years goes the same way as the last few Alonso might be looking to jump ship too.

[Quiet One]

1.- Some teams work better with 2 competitive drivers, some teams prefer clear #1 and #2 drivers. And that usually depends on which drivers we are talking about. Red Bull and Ferrari obviously prefer the latter option, but should they have other drivers they might want it the other way. Macca almost destroyed themselves at least twice with their "we let them race against each other" so, despite all their fairplay talk, they usually end up chosing a de facto number one, Is not that they have none. It's that Button surprised them being as good as they boasted about while thinking "he will be a good girlfriend for Lewis". If JB keeps delivering, LH will be more and more not just looking like a number 2, but also having to play that part until he leaves or changes.

2. That is just to put the whole Alonso needs a crappy driver along him into perspective. Now, back to Ferrari and FA, it seems like the guy has learned a lot more than the fans, as they keep talking about 2007 and 2004 as if they happened yesterday, merrily ignoring everything else. Fact is, there aren't many drivers at FA level you can hire, so it's not just a matter that the guy wants to have a weak #2 driver (btw, name me one driver that would be happy to have a driver more competitive than him in the same car) it's just not easy to find one. Who would you hire? Lewis? What for? FA and LH would not get along and FA is delivering more than enough. LH will be of no help simply because the guy will not bring enough to compensate for the price of p**sing off Alonso. That is what every team thinks when they hire another driver to race along with their superstar. That is why RBR would never hire alonso to run along Vettel, or Vettel to run along Lewis.

3. So, we are talking about 2nd rate drivers here. Massa is a 4th rate driver (and I am being generous). For the record: ANY DRIVER FERRARI COULD REASONABLY HIRE WILL BE DEEMED AS 2ND RATE BY YOU SO STOP USING IT AS A PROOF THAT ALONSO NEEDS WEAKER TEAMMATES! If any, that proofs how highly you rate Nando

4. Trulli only beat Nando in your feverished minds. Trulli was ahead on points (against an alomst rookie Nando!) for a little while and he was already in bad terms with Flavio by then. Alonso (again, just a rookie, despite all the love he received from Flavio) was certainly not established enough to demand that a team like Renauult to get rid of a well established driver like Trulli should be kicked out to make place for him. In any case, history proved that he was vastly superior than Jarno. So Flav was right. And the fact that Jarno and FA are still close friends proves how idiotic the Jarno theory is.

5. Santander: Ferrari focus was always racing, not selling street cars. They sell street cars to keep the racing team running. That was like that since the Enzo days. That means that funding was never too much of a problem as long as the street cars kept being sold. Even during this world recession, Ferrari street cars sold like water and they kept making record sales in 2009 and 2011, so money was never an issue unlike most other teams. That does not mean that sponsos' money is not welcome, of course, but that means that they are not so desperate for sponsors' money as to accept whatever crap they want to impose. To say that Santander "brought as a condition" to hire Alonso is like saying that a the Barcelona "had as a condition" to keep Messi as a player. What kind of idiot would not keep/hire the best guy around? That is not an imposed clause, that is the obvious choice! As for "Santander money in exchange to crush Massa": Santander, unlike Ferrari, was deeply hit by world's recession. They fared better than most banks primarily due to their good numbers in Latin America, especially Brazil and Argentina which are countries that kept growing these years, and obviously of the two, Brazil making the big numbers. So, for Santander, it has been some years now where Brazil is one of their biggest targets, even above Spain. If there is some Santander pressure it would go to keep Massa, not go against him. Read the news, people!!!!

Now, any other silly comment? Next time we will talk about "poor Massa and his destroyed spirit". Another urban myth

[DPR]

Quote

But who knows, if this years goes the same way as the last few Alonso might be looking to jump ship too.

Excellent point - I doubt the monobrowed one (and his banking paymasters) would have signed a contract without a performance exit clause!
I'm already looking forward to 2013 Ferrari/Fiat sponsored by Murdoch's NewsCorp/SkyTV with topless female drivers!!!!

[Caesar]

if kubica wasn't injured he would be in ferrari in 2012 (that was alonso's wish), and alonso said that vettel can come right  now in ferrari as long as he brings newey.saying that alonso is afraid of hamilton and jarno, LMAO!

[BradSpeedMan]

Quiet One, on 19 March 2012 - 01:13 PM, said:

5. Santander: Ferrari focus was always racing, not selling street cars. They sell street cars to keep the racing team running. That was like that since the Enzo days. That means that funding was never too much of a problem as long as the street cars kept being sold. Even during this world recession, Ferrari street cars sold like water and they kept making record sales in 2009 and 2011, so money was never an issue unlike most other teams. That does not mean that sponsos' money is not welcome, of course, but that means that they are not so desperate for sponsors' money as to accept whatever crap they want to impose. To say that Santander "brought as a condition" to hire Alonso is like saying that a the Barcelona "had as a condition" to keep Messi as a player. What kind of idiot would not keep/hire the best guy around? That is not an imposed clause, that is the obvious choice! As for "Santander money in exchange to crush Massa": Santander, unlike Ferrari, was deeply hit by world's recession. They fared better than most banks primarily due to their good numbers in Latin America, especially Brazil and Argentina which are countries that kept growing these years, and obviously of the two, Brazil making the big numbers. So, for Santander, it has been some years now where Brazil is one of their biggest targets, even above Spain. If there is some Santander pressure it would go to keep Massa, not go against him. Read the news, people!!!!

So DPR was RIGHT all along...

[DPR]

Quote

Ferrari focus was always racing, not selling street cars. They sell street cars to keep the racing team running.

What utter tosh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I suppose Red Bull are only selling fizzy drinks to support their racing team!!!!!!!!!

This is the rose tinted crap that ferrari love to peddle - Fiat/Ferrari are just another European struggling car maker looking to improve the brand and therefore sales.
I honestly believe Nando is psychologically scarred by the mullering he received from the then rookie - Hammy.
As long as he's scared of having a top drawer team-mate, then the more responsibility falls on his shoulders - and so far, so far - he's looking like he's not capable of captaining Fiat in the way that Shumi could.

[Quiet One]

BradSpeedMan, on 19 March 2012 - 01:22 PM, said:

So DPR was RIGHT all along...

Depends on whether he actually meant that Alonso is one of the best, that Alonso will make any other driver along him look like a number two, and that Alonso has not objected to any driver (even admitting that we all think he would not be happy with LH) contacted so far, not even the likes of vettel or kubica, and that he actually meant that Santander's money has no actual impact on teams decision anymore than Lucozade has in Mac Laren.

Somehow I doubt he meant any of those

[Quiet One]

DPR, on 19 March 2012 - 01:24 PM, said:

What utter tosh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I suppose Red Bull are only selling fizzy drinks to support their racing team!!!!!!!!!

This is the rose tinted crap that ferrari love to peddle - Fiat/Ferrari are just another European struggling car maker looking to improve the brand and therefore sales.
I honestly believe Nando is psychologically scarred by the mullering he received from the then rookie - Hammy.
As long as he's scared of having a top drawer team-mate, then the more responsibility falls on his shoulders - and so far, so far - he's looking like he's not capable of captaining Fiat in the way that Shumi could.

See, Brad? I told you so...

[BradSpeedMan]

DPR, on 19 March 2012 - 01:24 PM, said:

I honestly believe Nando is psychologically scarred by the mullering he received from the then rookie - Hammy.

The scarring started when Trulli beat him...

[Quiet One]

BradSpeedMan, on 19 March 2012 - 01:33 PM, said:

The scarring started when Trulli beat him...

Bah, you are not seriously discussing anymore, you are just trying to wind me up. No fun.

[DPR]

Q.O. .....oh dear!
Nando would never have allow himself to have LH as a team-mate.
And actually, McLaren are more of a racing entity than Ferrari.
If Ferrari stopped racing, Fiat/Ferrari would continue to make road cars - If McLaren stopped racing - NO BUSINESS!
I wonder how many races it will be this year before we hear the same old Nando/Domi crap about concentrating on next years car?

What's the difference between the current Ferrari set-up and a used tampon ( Both Scarlet, Both Stink and Both Have Their Strings Pulled From Outside)....oh yeah....at least the tampon is useful for 1 week in 4!  

[BradSpeedMan]

Quiet One, on 19 March 2012 - 01:30 PM, said:

See, Brad? I told you so...

well, you can't just have things your own way all the time.   What other choice do you give him? he's a delusional vengeful anti-Alonso fan? You're either a fan or not, and if you're not, you have your reasons

Edited by BradSpeedMan, 19 March 2012 - 01:42 PM.

[BradSpeedMan]

Quiet One, on 19 March 2012 - 01:37 PM, said:

Bah, you are not seriously discussing anymore, you are just trying to wind me up. No fun.

You fail to see I was in winding mode since the Trulli beat Alonso post answering to Alehop

[Quiet One]

BradSpeedMan, on 19 March 2012 - 01:43 PM, said:

You fail to see I was in winding mode since the Trulli beat Alonso post answering to Alehop

I wasn't sure, but as some people actually believes that I took the opportunity to set that (and Santander stuff) right

You are mean, considering I abstained myself of making jokes about Kimi's vs Grosjean performances during qualy

One of these days I will send you my Santander thugs after you...

[Caesar]

   FA :   Are you afraid of Grosjean? He looks scary to me! He looks like Trulli!

[BradSpeedMan]

Quiet One, on 19 March 2012 - 01:48 PM, said:

You are mean, considering I abstained myself of making jokes about Kimi's vs Grosjean performances during qualy

It's the points that matter at the end of the day my friend

[BradSpeedMan]

Caesar, on 19 March 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

Nvu1W.jpg   FA :   Are you afraid of Grosjean? He looks scary to me! He looks like Trulli!

Looks like they both decided to just  hijack Lewis's ride

[AleHop]

BradSpeedMan, on 19 March 2012 - 01:43 PM, said:

You fail to see I was in winding mode since the Trulli beat Alonso post answering to Alehop

Brad, you know you can't wind me up anymore. At least not with the usual Alonso/Santander/teammates/Singapore'08/... mantra.

[Caesar]

BradSpeedMan, on 19 March 2012 - 01:59 PM, said:

Looks like they both decided to just  hijack Lewis's ride

notice the license plate on that 'Lewis's ride'. LOL!

[AleHop]

Quiet One, on 19 March 2012 - 01:13 PM, said:

1.- Some teams work better with 2 competitive drivers, some teams prefer clear #1 and #2 drivers. And that usually depends on which drivers we are talking about. Red Bull and Ferrari obviously prefer the latter option, but should they have other drivers they might want it the other way. Macca almost destroyed themselves at least twice with their "we let them race against each other" so, despite all their fairplay talk, they usually end up chosing a de facto number one, Is not that they have none. It's that Button surprised them being as good as they boasted about while thinking "he will be a good girlfriend for Lewis". If JB keeps delivering, LH will be more and more not just looking like a number 2, but also having to play that part until he leaves or changes.

2. That is just to put the whole Alonso needs a crappy driver along him into perspective. Now, back to Ferrari and FA, it seems like the guy has learned a lot more than the fans, as they keep talking about 2007 and 2004 as if they happened yesterday, merrily ignoring everything else. Fact is, there aren't many drivers at FA level you can hire, so it's not just a matter that the guy wants to have a weak #2 driver (btw, name me one driver that would be happy to have a driver more competitive than him in the same car) it's just not easy to find one. Who would you hire? Lewis? What for? FA and LH would not get along and FA is delivering more than enough. LH will be of no help simply because the guy will not bring enough to compensate for the price of p**sing off Alonso. That is what every team thinks when they hire another driver to race along with their superstar. That is why RBR would never hire alonso to run along Vettel, or Vettel to run along Lewis.

3. So, we are talking about 2nd rate drivers here. Massa is a 4th rate driver (and I am being generous). For the record: ANY DRIVER FERRARI COULD REASONABLY HIRE WILL BE DEEMED AS 2ND RATE BY YOU SO STOP USING IT AS A PROOF THAT ALONSO NEEDS WEAKER TEAMMATES! If any, that proofs how highly you rate Nando

4. Trulli only beat Nando in your feverished minds. Trulli was ahead on points (against an alomst rookie Nando!) for a little while and he was already in bad terms with Flavio by then. Alonso (again, just a rookie, despite all the love he received from Flavio) was certainly not established enough to demand that a team like Renauult to get rid of a well established driver like Trulli should be kicked out to make place for him. In any case, history proved that he was vastly superior than Jarno. So Flav was right. And the fact that Jarno and FA are still close friends proves how idiotic the Jarno theory is.

5. Santander: Ferrari focus was always racing, not selling street cars. They sell street cars to keep the racing team running. That was like that since the Enzo days. That means that funding was never too much of a problem as long as the street cars kept being sold. Even during this world recession, Ferrari street cars sold like water and they kept making record sales in 2009 and 2011, so money was never an issue unlike most other teams. That does not mean that sponsos' money is not welcome, of course, but that means that they are not so desperate for sponsors' money as to accept whatever crap they want to impose. To say that Santander "brought as a condition" to hire Alonso is like saying that a the Barcelona "had as a condition" to keep Messi as a player. What kind of idiot would not keep/hire the best guy around? That is not an imposed clause, that is the obvious choice! As for "Santander money in exchange to crush Massa": Santander, unlike Ferrari, was deeply hit by world's recession. They fared better than most banks primarily due to their good numbers in Latin America, especially Brazil and Argentina which are countries that kept growing these years, and obviously of the two, Brazil making the big numbers. So, for Santander, it has been some years now where Brazil is one of their biggest targets, even above Spain. If there is some Santander pressure it would go to keep Massa, not go against him. Read the news, people!!!!

Now, any other silly comment? Next time we will talk about "poor Massa and his destroyed spirit". Another urban myth

Chapeau, chapó, hats off!!!

I'll keep it for future reference.

[BradSpeedMan]

Caesar, on 19 March 2012 - 02:05 PM, said:

notice the license plate on that 'Lewis's ride'. LOL!

[DPR]

KIMI: Man, things are bad now - I have to put a vodka bottle between my legs to impress the ladie.

NAND: Could be worse, look at me - I'm a d#ckless wonder these days!

[DPR]

NANDO: When I grow up I want to be just like Schumi.

PHOTGRAPHER: Sorry kid, that will never happen