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#271 Quiet One

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 01:04 PM

View PostDPR, on 02 March 2012 - 12:39 PM, said:

Q.O. - I think you disregarded the word "projected" before you bothered typing your rant.
Crappy teams have indeed always been part of F1 - but not to really compete in F1, they are seduced by the global audience and the potential advertising revenue!

in no other global premier sport would you have players able to have a place in the 1st division simply because they were financially attractive.
Footballers are paid highly BY THE TEAM not the other way around - otherwise all the top football (or soccer for our american friends) would be composed completely of the sons of bankers and dictators - this simply does not happen (usually!)

Sadly that implies that other sports have more talent competing for places than F1, and this will never change when most teams start their negotiations for a new driver with the opening gambit "HOW MUCH CAN YOU PAY US TO DRIVE?".
I would rather have 6 or 7 well funded teams, with the possibility of relegation from the grid if they fail to offer anything.

They all big up the talk to get the place on the grid, but after they've coughed up for uncle bernie - nothing. lapped once purely on performance - pretty bad, lapped more than once - obviously unworthy!
As RBR and MERC have proven, you can come to the grid and mean business .
:lol: Actually I read the word "projected" and it made me hesitate before replying to you...then, of course, my "I want to make a rant anyways" took the better part of me. I don't regret it, though, that's what's behind most forum posts, everywhere :P

I agree with you that looking at a guy's pockets instead of his skills is by no means the ideal selection process for the self-designated pinnacle of motorsport. But my point wasn't that. My point was that it has been going since the beginning, thus the prevalence or not of paid drivers is irrelevant to asess any season above any other.

And yes, I am fully aware that it was not your point. You will find that I have this unnerving practice of picking up some post (usually #46's ones) and take from there to make an entirely different point, so I am  not actually replying to it but merely taking it as a starting point for my rambling posts, sorry about that! :lol:
"There is more stupidity than hydrogen in the Universe, and it has a longer shelf life" - Frank Zappa

"Great drivers are the ones who win the races they're not supposed to" - K.Chandhok


"On the rare occasions that I play a racing game I often think ‘you know what this needs? A boss battle or two.’ A Formula One game in which, suddenly, everybody else has a monster truck and their sole desire is to squash you. A street racing game with a tank or two blowing the roads and buildings to bits. A Nascar game with a track that occasionally bends to the right" (Adam Smith - RPS)

#272 BradSpeedMan

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 01:06 PM

View PostCaesar, on 02 March 2012 - 12:51 PM, said:

ooohhh.. four post in a row. does that makes me a great poster?
4 makes you a legend! :D
Posted Image

We keep on working, we do our thing, Vettel shouts over the team radio,We are who we are!

"Vettel is a champion. That’s not referring to his achievements, but rather to his approach to everything he does. He wins. All the time. His preparation is meticulous, his attention to detail reminiscent of Michael Schumacher at his peak, and his performance on the track is almost always flawless. Vettel is capable only of domination. He knows no other way... Vettel is not in Formula One to be liked. He is there to win. And in the words of Ayrton Senna, perhaps the greatest of all Formula One drivers, “Nice men don’t win.”"
Chris Cameron-Dow

#273 DPR

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 01:27 PM

Q.O. please don't apologise for ranting. it's the only thing that makes this ever decreasing circle still interesting!


For my part, my moaning is simply to disguise the fact I'm desperately trying to convince myself that this season will not be as predictable as last.

RBR have the best package right now (and I use the word package to mean CAR, Designers, engineers and drivers), perhaps none the top trump, but the some of their parts .... etc etc. (History suggests that the best package always ends up on top - only the margin differs)
McL are pretty close, but still no cigar - I'm not too convinced that there current driver line up truly compliment each other (or the team)
Given the fact that Ferrari publicly give up on last years car quire early and started to work on this mid way through last season - should we be expecting more from a team with 4 months head start?!

Meanwhile, back to the testing! the times don't mean sh#t, but the reports on handling are very informative - more please!







#274 Rainmaster

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 01:27 PM

View PostQuiet One, on 02 March 2012 - 01:04 PM, said:

...

And yes, I am fully aware that it was not your point. You will find that I have this unnerving practice of picking up some post (usually #46's ones) and take from there to make an entirely different point, so I am  not actually replying to it but merely taking it as a starting point for my rambling posts, sorry about that! :lol:

This is true. It is, of course, a great regret whenever one of my posts leads to QO posting anything!
Never stay up on the barren heights of cleverness, but come down into the green valleys of silliness ~ Ludwig Wittgenstein

#275 Delta

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 02:20 PM

Ferrari simply can't afford to fail yet again this year, but the noises coming from motorsport enthusiasts, pundits, and even to some degree the team itself aren't all that convincing. Something simply doesn't seem right in their camp.

#276 BradSpeedMan

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 02:43 PM

View PostDelta, on 02 March 2012 - 02:20 PM, said:

Ferrari simply can't afford to fail yet again this year, but the noises coming from motorsport enthusiasts, pundits, and even to some degree the team itself aren't all that convincing. Something simply doesn't seem right in their camp.
The car definately has speed, as proven by Alonso, it's just difficult to drive...
Posted Image

We keep on working, we do our thing, Vettel shouts over the team radio,We are who we are!

"Vettel is a champion. That’s not referring to his achievements, but rather to his approach to everything he does. He wins. All the time. His preparation is meticulous, his attention to detail reminiscent of Michael Schumacher at his peak, and his performance on the track is almost always flawless. Vettel is capable only of domination. He knows no other way... Vettel is not in Formula One to be liked. He is there to win. And in the words of Ayrton Senna, perhaps the greatest of all Formula One drivers, “Nice men don’t win.”"
Chris Cameron-Dow

#277 BradSpeedMan

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 03:16 PM

Tell you what... That Lotus is looking really good, both on short stints this morning and now on it's longer runs....


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


15:15 Alonso seems to get five or six good laps out of a set of softs before the pace drops away, but Grosjean's hold up a little longer.


lovely stuff!!!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

15:55 Stint one was 11 laps on soft tyres, mostly in mid-1m30s, with a few 1m31s.

Stint two was 13 laps on softs, almost all in mid 1m29s before a few mid 1m30s at the end.

Stint three was 10 laps on softs, mostly in low 1m28s, with a handful of mid 1m29s at the end.

Then he finished up with 25 laps on hards, mainly in mid 1m27s, before eventually trailing off to mid/high 1m28s.

Loses about a second or so like the RB...

15:58 The drop-off across a stint does seem more severe for the Ferrari than for Grosjean's Lotus on its comparable run.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

16:13 Alonso's race simulation/very long run is over, here's how it looked:

16:15 Stint one was nine laps on mediums, consistently in 1m30s with a few 1m31s.

Stint two was eight laps on softs, starting in low 1m29s, then going up to mid 1m30s before a single 1m32s.

Stint three was 12 laps on softs, going up from low 1m28s to mid 1m31s.

Stint four was 14 laps on mediums, going from mid 1m27s to mid 1m29s.

Stint five was 14 laps on mediums again, from mid 1m24s to high 1m26s.

Edited by BradSpeedMan, 02 March 2012 - 04:20 PM.

Posted Image

We keep on working, we do our thing, Vettel shouts over the team radio,We are who we are!

"Vettel is a champion. That’s not referring to his achievements, but rather to his approach to everything he does. He wins. All the time. His preparation is meticulous, his attention to detail reminiscent of Michael Schumacher at his peak, and his performance on the track is almost always flawless. Vettel is capable only of domination. He knows no other way... Vettel is not in Formula One to be liked. He is there to win. And in the words of Ayrton Senna, perhaps the greatest of all Formula One drivers, “Nice men don’t win.”"
Chris Cameron-Dow

#278 Caesar

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:21 PM

AutoSprint & F1Today.nl confirms Ferrari's race sim conducted on USED tyres. Lotus was on new tyres
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#279 Caesar

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:22 PM

View PostBradSpeedMan, on 02 March 2012 - 01:06 PM, said:

4 makes you a legend! :D

:thbup:
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#280 AleHop

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:33 PM

RB will bring a new configuration tomorrow and they asked to use #2chassis. The rest of the teams agreed ok.

JFFS!!!  They should say NO WAY, making it easier for RB? BAH!!!


:P


Fray Luis de León said:

As we were saying yesterday...
Fray Luis de León wrote mystical poems which prompted Cervantes to proclaim León "a genius who astounds the world and who, in ecstasy, might rob us of our senses." León was also an active man who taught at the University of Salamanca, translated classical and biblical literature, and wrote on religious themes. Twice denounced before the Inquisition, he was imprisoned for "heresy," though he returned to the University to later hold the chairs of Moral Philosophy and Biblical Studies.

Tradition has it that he began his lecture the first day after returning from four years' imprisonment with the words "as we were saying yesterday..."

#281 BradSpeedMan

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:34 PM

Thanks for that invalueble info Ceasar... but not ALL done on new tyres by Grosjean...

Fastest laptimes for today:

Grosjean's time done on softs with Vergne on super-softs, both look like qualifying runs
1 Grosjean Lotus 1m22.614s 122
2 Vergne Toro Rosso 1m23.126s  +0.512 31
3 Vettel Red Bull 1m23.361s  +0.747 85
4 Alonso Ferrari 1m23.447s  +0.833 123
5 Kovalainen Caterham 1m23.828s  +1.214 104
6 Kobayashi Sauber 1m23.836s  +1.222 76
7 Hulkenberg Force India 1m23.893s  +1.279 33
8 Schumacher Mercedes 1m23.978s  +1.364 77
9 Hamilton McLaren 1m24.111s  +1.497 65
10 Senna Williams 1m24.925s  +2.311 48
11 Maldonado Williams 1m25.801s  +3.187 20
Posted Image

We keep on working, we do our thing, Vettel shouts over the team radio,We are who we are!

"Vettel is a champion. That’s not referring to his achievements, but rather to his approach to everything he does. He wins. All the time. His preparation is meticulous, his attention to detail reminiscent of Michael Schumacher at his peak, and his performance on the track is almost always flawless. Vettel is capable only of domination. He knows no other way... Vettel is not in Formula One to be liked. He is there to win. And in the words of Ayrton Senna, perhaps the greatest of all Formula One drivers, “Nice men don’t win.”"
Chris Cameron-Dow

#282 Caesar

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:39 PM

View PostBradSpeedMan, on 02 March 2012 - 04:34 PM, said:

Thanks for that invalueble info Ceasar... but not ALL done on new tyres by Grosjean...

Fastest laptimes for today:

Grosjean's time done on softs with Vergne on super-softs, both look like qualifying runs
1     Grosjean Lotus     1m22.614s 122
2     Vergne Toro Rosso     1m23.126s  +0.512 31
3     Vettel Red Bull     1m23.361s  +0.747 85
4     Alonso Ferrari     1m23.447s  +0.833 123
5     Kovalainen Caterham     1m23.828s  +1.214 104
6     Kobayashi Sauber     1m23.836s  +1.222 76
7     Hulkenberg Force India     1m23.893s  +1.279 33
8     Schumacher Mercedes     1m23.978s  +1.364 77
9     Hamilton McLaren     1m24.111s  +1.497 65
10     Senna Williams     1m24.925s  +2.311 48
11     Maldonado Williams     1m25.801s  +3.187 20

alonso fans have to keep their hopes warm...
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#283 Caesar

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:40 PM

lotus has plenty of new tyres cause they missed first barcelona test
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#284 BradSpeedMan

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:40 PM

View PostCaesar, on 02 March 2012 - 04:39 PM, said:

alonso fans have to keep their hopes warm...
:lol:
Posted Image

We keep on working, we do our thing, Vettel shouts over the team radio,We are who we are!

"Vettel is a champion. That’s not referring to his achievements, but rather to his approach to everything he does. He wins. All the time. His preparation is meticulous, his attention to detail reminiscent of Michael Schumacher at his peak, and his performance on the track is almost always flawless. Vettel is capable only of domination. He knows no other way... Vettel is not in Formula One to be liked. He is there to win. And in the words of Ayrton Senna, perhaps the greatest of all Formula One drivers, “Nice men don’t win.”"
Chris Cameron-Dow

#285 BradSpeedMan

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:42 PM

View PostCaesar, on 02 March 2012 - 04:40 PM, said:

lotus has plenty of new tyres cause they missed first barcelona test
and ferrari had acquired more data for their car...

still, good signs for both teams....
Posted Image

We keep on working, we do our thing, Vettel shouts over the team radio,We are who we are!

"Vettel is a champion. That’s not referring to his achievements, but rather to his approach to everything he does. He wins. All the time. His preparation is meticulous, his attention to detail reminiscent of Michael Schumacher at his peak, and his performance on the track is almost always flawless. Vettel is capable only of domination. He knows no other way... Vettel is not in Formula One to be liked. He is there to win. And in the words of Ayrton Senna, perhaps the greatest of all Formula One drivers, “Nice men don’t win.”"
Chris Cameron-Dow

#286 Caesar

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:43 PM

tweet from Lotus_F1Team: "Guess who's just dropped into the Lotus F1  team motorhome for a cup of coffee? A clue... the coffee may be hot but  he's ice cold..."
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#287 BradSpeedMan

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 04:46 PM

View PostCaesar, on 02 March 2012 - 04:43 PM, said:

tweet from Lotus_F1Team: "Guess who's just dropped into the Lotus F1  team motorhome for a cup of coffee? A clue... the coffee may be hot but  he's ice cold..."
lol ...saw that
Posted Image

We keep on working, we do our thing, Vettel shouts over the team radio,We are who we are!

"Vettel is a champion. That’s not referring to his achievements, but rather to his approach to everything he does. He wins. All the time. His preparation is meticulous, his attention to detail reminiscent of Michael Schumacher at his peak, and his performance on the track is almost always flawless. Vettel is capable only of domination. He knows no other way... Vettel is not in Formula One to be liked. He is there to win. And in the words of Ayrton Senna, perhaps the greatest of all Formula One drivers, “Nice men don’t win.”"
Chris Cameron-Dow

#288 HandyNZL

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 05:37 PM

View PostCaesar, on 02 March 2012 - 04:43 PM, said:

tweet from Lotus_F1Team: "Guess who's just dropped into the Lotus F1  team motorhome for a cup of coffee? A clue... the coffee may be hot but  he's ice cold..."          

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Posted Image


#289 HandyNZL

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 05:41 PM

View PostDPR, on 02 March 2012 - 12:39 PM, said:

Q.O. - I think you disregarded the word "projected" before you bothered typing your rant.
Crappy teams have indeed always been part of F1 - but not to really compete in F1, they are seduced by the global audience and the potential advertising revenue!

in no other global premier sport would you have players able to have a place in the 1st division simply because they were financially attractive.
Footballers are paid highly BY THE TEAM not the other way around - otherwise all the top football (or soccer for our american friends) would be composed completely of the sons of bankers and dictators - this simply does not happen (usually!)

Sadly that implies that other sports have more talent competing for places than F1, and this will never change when most teams start their negotiations for a new driver with the opening gambit "HOW MUCH CAN YOU PAY US TO DRIVE?".
I would rather have 6 or 7 well funded teams, with the possibility of relegation from the grid if they fail to offer anything.

They all big up the talk to get the place on the grid, but after they've coughed up for uncle bernie - nothing. lapped once purely on performance - pretty bad, lapped more than once - obviously unworthy!
As RBR and MERC have proven, you can come to the grid and mean business .

Sigh...

Red Bull and Mercedes both are only new teams in name.  Each team bought out an existing team, including infrastructure and employees, and rebranded the team.  And yet still, it took Red Bull five years to do anything, and Merc, well, they're still trying.

Marussia, Caterham, and HRT are all start up teams, with much much less money than either Red Bull or Merc to use to attract engineering staff and designers, which is where any teams success comes from.

To use Red Bull and Merc to make your point, is a bit more akin to scoring an own goal....they don't compare to the other three in any way, apart from the fact they race in Formula 1

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#290 Caesar

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 05:44 PM

View PostHandyNZL, on 02 March 2012 - 05:37 PM, said:

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well, he said he'll be back

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#291 AleHop

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 06:07 PM

Good, we have F1 this weekend!

No one will beat Alonso.  :nono1:

He carries more fuel...
He tests the brakes and clutch...
:icon2_flag:
And he wins!!!

Fray Luis de León said:

As we were saying yesterday...
Fray Luis de León wrote mystical poems which prompted Cervantes to proclaim León "a genius who astounds the world and who, in ecstasy, might rob us of our senses." León was also an active man who taught at the University of Salamanca, translated classical and biblical literature, and wrote on religious themes. Twice denounced before the Inquisition, he was imprisoned for "heresy," though he returned to the University to later hold the chairs of Moral Philosophy and Biblical Studies.

Tradition has it that he began his lecture the first day after returning from four years' imprisonment with the words "as we were saying yesterday..."

#292 Autumnpuma

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 07:11 PM

View PostHandyNZL, on 01 March 2012 - 05:15 AM, said:

Well yes, you set your base line....then every lap thereafter, every change is to make the car FASTER....and with all the telemetary they have these day's they do need to go as fast as possible in certain areas, such as a sweeper corner to ascertain results from yaw sensors, pressure through hydraulic shocks, deflection of A-arms etc etc...they can't leave the track with the last 5-10% as theoretical.  It takes nothing to go as fast as  possible for an entire lap, then button off before crossing the line, using their own timing beam set up somewhere along the pit wall that they use to record their times before buttoning off.

And in any case, I was taking the p**s at Brad with his "???" post, to wit, we bantered along between each other for a short while last night.  Or did you miss that bit? :P

No, I caught the banter. But what you said was inaccurate, so I corrected you. Thank you for backing that up with your post. We are in agreement. If you wish to take the p!ss out of someone, nothing works better than accuracy. ;)

View PostHandyNZL, on 02 March 2012 - 06:27 AM, said:

Like suduku?

No, that's how Lewis sets his car up.
Don't rest in peace, Bruce. Raise Hell.
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______
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That's all I'll ever need.
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"Gilles was the last great driver. The rest of us are just a bunch of good professionals."
----Alain Prost


The only true sports are motor racing and mountain climbing; everything else is just a game.

TF1 Blogs: be afraid, be very, very afraid..........

#293 Quiet One

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 08:49 PM

View PostCaesar, on 02 March 2012 - 04:43 PM, said:

tweet from Lotus_F1Team: "Guess who's just dropped into the Lotus F1  team motorhome for a cup of coffee? A clue... the coffee may be hot but  he's ice cold..."
What the hell is Vanilla Ice doing in Team Poochie's motorhome?
"There is more stupidity than hydrogen in the Universe, and it has a longer shelf life" - Frank Zappa

"Great drivers are the ones who win the races they're not supposed to" - K.Chandhok


"On the rare occasions that I play a racing game I often think ‘you know what this needs? A boss battle or two.’ A Formula One game in which, suddenly, everybody else has a monster truck and their sole desire is to squash you. A street racing game with a tank or two blowing the roads and buildings to bits. A Nascar game with a track that occasionally bends to the right" (Adam Smith - RPS)

#294 Caesar

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 09:29 PM

View PostQuiet One, on 02 March 2012 - 08:49 PM, said:

What the hell is Vanilla Ice doing in Team Poochie's motorhome?

he is just chillin
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#295 Quiet One

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 09:48 PM

View PostCaesar, on 02 March 2012 - 09:29 PM, said:

he is just chillin
So, just cheking the new cones?
"There is more stupidity than hydrogen in the Universe, and it has a longer shelf life" - Frank Zappa

"Great drivers are the ones who win the races they're not supposed to" - K.Chandhok


"On the rare occasions that I play a racing game I often think ‘you know what this needs? A boss battle or two.’ A Formula One game in which, suddenly, everybody else has a monster truck and their sole desire is to squash you. A street racing game with a tank or two blowing the roads and buildings to bits. A Nascar game with a track that occasionally bends to the right" (Adam Smith - RPS)

#296 Caesar

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 10:02 PM

View PostQuiet One, on 02 March 2012 - 09:48 PM, said:

So, just cheking the new cones?
:icecream:
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#297 Caesar

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 01:02 AM


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#298 Autumnpuma

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 01:32 AM

View PostCaesar, on 03 March 2012 - 01:02 AM, said:


No fair. Jet engines are *not allowed* under the current rules. Red Bull should be banned for this outrage.
Don't rest in peace, Bruce. Raise Hell.
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Give me a roof over my head, some food to eat and a fast car. That's all I need.
That's all I'll ever need.
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"Gilles was the last great driver. The rest of us are just a bunch of good professionals."
----Alain Prost


The only true sports are motor racing and mountain climbing; everything else is just a game.

TF1 Blogs: be afraid, be very, very afraid..........

#299 Quiet One

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 01:40 AM

Somehow I can imagine the other teams setting their cars on fire just in case that's something Newey came up with

Edited by Quiet One, 03 March 2012 - 01:41 AM.

"There is more stupidity than hydrogen in the Universe, and it has a longer shelf life" - Frank Zappa

"Great drivers are the ones who win the races they're not supposed to" - K.Chandhok


"On the rare occasions that I play a racing game I often think ‘you know what this needs? A boss battle or two.’ A Formula One game in which, suddenly, everybody else has a monster truck and their sole desire is to squash you. A street racing game with a tank or two blowing the roads and buildings to bits. A Nascar game with a track that occasionally bends to the right" (Adam Smith - RPS)

#300 Rainmaster

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 01:45 AM

Clearly, Red Bull were on a hot lap there. (that's my entry :P).

View PostQuiet One, on 03 March 2012 - 01:40 AM, said:

Somehow I can imagine the other teams setting their cars on fire just in case that's something Newey came up with


I heard HRT just stared. Their engineers had not seen fire before.
Never stay up on the barren heights of cleverness, but come down into the green valleys of silliness ~ Ludwig Wittgenstein




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