218 replies to this topic

[Rainmaster]

Well, it's true that lower tier championship results are not conclusive and sometimes not even indicative of F1 performance. But if you don't have that then you must be spotted by someone in the know, like Briatore, who has a great eye for drivers. Ma Qing Hua's problem is that he has neither of those things!

To be fair, I've never seen him race, and whoever goes into that car is always going to be touring around at the back of the grid, anyway. In a way I'd rather they hire "rubbish" drivers (still probably a decent driver relatively speaking) than hire an amazing driver who doesn't get noticed and it ruins his career.

[AleHop]

Quiet One, on 10 September 2012 - 05:01 PM, said:

You people have too much faith in the so called "feeder series". I'd rather trust Briatore's or Stoddard's intuition any day over a hundred cups won in lower formulae.

It's a pity because with today's F1 probably Alonso, Raikkonen, Kubica and others wouldn't have gone through the "feeder categories" to F1.

Alonso was Renault test driver in 2002 after a rookie year in 2001 at Minardi. Test driver? What's that for? woould ask the younger fans.

[JHS18]

Rainmaster, on 10 September 2012 - 05:48 PM, said:

To be fair, I've never seen him race, and whoever goes into that car is always going to be touring around at the back of the grid, anyway. In a way I'd rather they hire "rubbish" drivers (still probably a decent driver relatively speaking) than hire an amazing driver who doesn't get noticed and it ruins his career.

Alonso and Webber started at Minardi. Raikkonen and Massa started at Sauber. Vettel started his proper career at Toro Rosso. Not what you'd think as front running teams. Never did their careers any damage.

[Rainmaster]

I don't think Minardi, Sauber and Toro Rosso then were as bad as HRT now, though. All were not "top tier" teams but the former three were long established organisations who didn't always finish at the back of the grid, like HRT. I am not criticising HRT, just pointing to facts here. Toro Rosso certainly were nothing like starting in a HRT, they were effectively a Red Bull B team and when Vettel was there the car was almost identical to the Red Bull chassis but had a better engine, iirc. By the time Vettel started outperforming the car it was already a strong midfield car (stronger than the Red Bull, I think). I don't know that much about Sauber and Minardi in the days those drivers were there (before I watched F1) but I suspect they weren't always back of the grid guaranteed finishing position teams. Not diminishing the achievements of Raikkonen et al but I am not sure you would notice such strong drivers in a HRT. I think maybe the team would realise what they had and maybe it would spread through the paddock, but I'm not sure the opportunity to outperform a HRT is actually there in terms of results (esp. since now the grid is closer in the front to lower middle positions, driving standards are probably higher, and retirements are fewer).

What does everyone else think?

Edited by Rainmaster, 10 September 2012 - 07:49 PM.

[AleHop]

Rainmaster, on 10 September 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

What does everyone else think?

I agree but Minardi in 2001 wasn't much better than HRT today. A lot of mechanical failures more than 50% I think but as you say all teams have very few problems these days.

[The Shadow]

Those teams have history within the sport. With history comes a certain level of rose-tinted pedigree.

Hindsight allows us to forget that in the early 2000's Minardi used to be slow and at around 70% race distance celebrate its achievement by catching fire. HRT by virtue of reliability is only consistently slow.

Sauber were a quite well funded Ferrari B team, and used to regularly finish in the points and end up between 4th to 6th in the championship.

Toro Rosso were a pantomime prancing horse with a chassis that gives it wings, so yeah.. It is a Pegasus -and bound to share the fortunes of the previous year's Red Bull (yet have the strength of Modena's best in the engine department)

[JHS18]

So di Montezemolo has essentially ruled out Perez for next year, saying he's not ready for a Ferrari drive. He's also reconfirmed that he wants to sign Vettel.

Why do I get the impression that nothing is going to change? I bet they'll keep Massa for an extra year before signing Vettel in '14.

Maybe it is for the best though. I can't imagine anyone, not least Perez, would agree to a one year contract knowing they'd be replaced the following year.

Now my dream situation, not like it will ever happen, is that Schumacher will move from Mercedes to Ferrari. Have one last year at his old team, retire, and then move over for Vettel.

[Rainmaster]

Perez said that he is ready for a top team drive, clearly a reply to Montezemolo. Point is, he's certainly much more ready than Massa has been this season and last, though that's not saying much.

Anyway, there is some movement going on in the driver market, Jaime Alguersuari tweeted that he'd signed to drive somewhere next year and we'd find out soon. I'm guessing that's in F1.

[Massa]

I typed out a post and then a thing happened and now it's gone.  I don't really remember what I was talking about, just like I don't really remember that Dr. Alguersuari, Buemi, or Sutil were ever F1 drivers, but I was basically saying I think it'd make the most sense if he signed with Sauber.

[Massa]

Massa might be back after all...

http://formula-one.s...massa-for-2013/

I love Alonso's comments.  He can use team as a first-person noun for himself to defend Massa, knowing well that he is their core.

(And don't get me wrong, I completely, 100% believe Massa should always have to move over for Alonso when ahead of him and when possible without costing the team total points in the WCC).

I still think Massa has to be taking a paycut to stay, though.  Maybe some sort of deal where he gets less pay, but is now guaranteed work with Ferrari after his F1 career ends or something like that.

[Rainmaster]

Alonso does lay it on a bit thick with his comments sometimes Alright, we get it, you love being number 1 and you love the fact Massa is terrible and for you it'd be fantastic if he stayed.

It would be a big shame for us viewers. He really has had his time.

[Massa]

So now we turn to McLaren watch.  Who replaces Hamilton?

I know McLaren can sense the potential for discontent in the Pérez/Ferrari relationship, but there will never be discontent in the Pérez/Telmex one so Vodafone has to be on the way out (which they may be).  I'm assuming any clauses preventing subsequent telecommunications deals would be avoided by Pérez just having Telmex as a personal sponsor, and not as a team partner.  If we even get that far.

Both of Force India's drivers have shown moments.  Neither one really does it for me, but if the rumors are true that Alguersuari has signed there, well, that's a sign.

Not much else out there.  Button's probably the most underrated WDC I've encountered so I have full confidence in his ability to lead the team forward, but I'd definitely want someone young to inherit that spot soon enough.  Stealing from Ferrari would make it even sweeter, but I'd find it more likely for there to be some kind of Mercedes saying "okay fine, we got your guy, you take ours," with their guy being di Resta.

[LabradoRacer]

Alguersari might be in McLaren next year. His statements about being in F1 next year leads me to believe so.

Gutted for Schumi.

[Rainmaster]

It's Perez who gets the Mclaren seat. Pretty happy about that. I have a feeling Ferrari might come to regret letting him go in the not too distant future.

[dribbler]

As I said, Lewis will not stay at McLaren.

Ahem.

[Caesar]

BBC says that he will have No.1 driver status in Merc.

[pabloh20]

Rainmaster, on 28 September 2012 - 07:06 AM, said:

It's Perez who gets the Mclaren seat. Pretty happy about that. I have a feeling Ferrari might come to regret letting him go in the not too distant future.

Yep, I think so too.

It will also be interesting to see if Perez can 'out-Button' Button in managing tyres while still keeping the speed.

[pabloh20]

dribbler, on 28 September 2012 - 07:28 AM, said:

As I said, Lewis will not stay at McLaren.

Ahem.

I do remember you saying this

[pabloh20]

Caesar, on 28 September 2012 - 07:42 AM, said:

BBC says that he will have No.1 driver status in Merc.

I would love to know how this sort of information comes about.  I guess it's like the media have always done and a lot of internet reporting follows suit now - make a guess and report is as fact

[Caesar]

i think it was reported by Andrew Benson, guys like him always know lot of F1 team personnel.

[brambilla]

It's official. McLaren confirm that Lewis is on his way out , and that Perez is in. They didnt say where Lewis is headed, guess he'll be making an announcement soon enough.

http://planetf1.com/...wis-Hello-Perez

[Quiet One]

dribbler, on 28 September 2012 - 07:28 AM, said:

As I said, Lewis will not stay at McLaren.

Ahem.

Nice save!
How do you want your hat, sir? Medium? Rare?

Edited by Quiet One, 28 September 2012 - 11:39 AM.

[pabloh20]

Caesar, on 28 September 2012 - 08:08 AM, said:

i think it was reported by Andrew Benson, guys like him always know lot of F1 team personnel.

Yes, but I would imagine the only team personnel who would know this information would be the team personnel who don't want this information to be public knoweldge.  Therein lies the contradiction.

[AleHop]

Only Alonso has #1 driver status in F1. The rest of the grid only pursuit sport values and... Errr...

[pabloh20]

AleHop, on 28 September 2012 - 12:30 PM, said:

Only Alonso has #1 driver status in F1. The rest of the grid only pursuit sport values and... Errr...

That wasn't my point, sarcastic bollocks!

If Alonso has number one status within Ferrari, we guess it through the actions of the team, not because somebody saw Alonso's contract with Ferrari and let us all know.

[Quiet One]

pabloh20, on 28 September 2012 - 01:57 PM, said:

That wasn't my point, sarcastic bollocks!

If Alonso has number one status within Ferrari, we guess it through the actions of the team, not because somebody saw Alonso's contract with Ferrari and let us all know.

Actually, there is no written contract between Alonso and Ferrari. It was more of a ritual in which Domenicalli, Massa and LdM gave their souls. It involved rubber chickens and the chant: "One Brow To Rule Them All".
Then, Alonso took their souls.

There wasn't much to be taken, to be honest.

[freaky2]

British media, British driver, since he's going to a *gasp* German team it must be because of the #1 status, obviously.

[freaky2]

Quiet One, on 28 September 2012 - 02:29 PM, said:

Actually, there is no written contract between Alonso and Ferrari. It was more of a ritual in which Domenicalli, Massa and LdM gave their souls. It involved rubber chickens and the chant: "One Brow To Rule Them All".
Then, Alonso took their souls.

There wasn't much to be taken, to be honest.

If I could roll on the floor and laugh without losing my apparent dignity, I would have done it now

[pabloh20]

Quiet One, on 28 September 2012 - 02:29 PM, said:

Actually, there is no written contract between Alonso and Ferrari. It was more of a ritual in which Domenicalli, Massa and LdM gave their souls. It involved rubber chickens and the chant: "One Brow To Rule Them All".
Then, Alonso took their souls.

There wasn't much to be taken, to be honest.

Although, you do seem to be mentioning rubber chickens a lot lately.  Maybe this is more a projection of your own fetish??

[LabradoRacer]

I am hoping Sauber offers Schumi a seat, but seems it'll go to Alguersuari.