17 replies to this topic

[Quiet One]

Some thoughts about this season. Want to make them now, because once the championship is over they will be only taken within the context of the actual result (i.e.: excuses )
So, I guess we all agree by now that this was one of the most exciting seasons in a long, long time. If you spare my infidelity, I must recognize that this year, more than any other, I spent a lot of time reading other forums as well as this one, which gave me a broader sense of other people's opinions, so perhaps my comments do not reflect what most people in our forum think. Sorry about that.

Reflecting on a couple of things:

- I think most of us would agree that this is one of the most exciting season in ages. It is funny, reading comments in other places, how the same people that complained about unpredictability at the beginning of the season now bemoan the boredom of the end of season. Some people can never be satisfied! But, yeah, somehow it was a season of extremes. At the beginning of season, a barrage of changes and unpredictable weather mixed things a little bit too much for some tastes. Interesting how fast the teams fell back so quickly to their 2011 levels (almost). I'm not sure piling  up artificial challenges trying to destabilize the RBR domination and 'mix up things' a little is a good idea. I think we should stop asking for reinstallment of things that made racing boring in the past (e.g.: refuelling) or sprinkles or silly things like that and request what would and should be the ultimately only legit way of 'mixing up the field': teams should strive to make cars as good as RBR. Problem solved. More ingenuity from the teams would mean less micro management from FIA.
How can they achieve that? No expenditure cap? More photocopiers? Lewis and his twitter account to RBR? No idea, but at this stage trying to blindingly introduce new aerodynamic regulations in the hopes of somehow hurt RBR has clearly  not worked, and made teams spend more and more in less and less useful development roads. I don't think this is making things for smaller teams any easier.

- Other comments on the net are about how 'unfair" would it be if Vettel won the championship, something I bet irritate Seb fans to no end. They should admit that after such a closely fought championship and wonderful battles, it does seem anti climatic. They should also admit that as much as Vettel did deliver, it is also true that, unlike in  the "Alonso has the fastest car but talks it down to highlight his own achievements", there is a clear mechanical advantage here, as Mark's own improvement shows. When did you saw a front row lockout from Ferrari or a 1-2 finish? In that sense, it is not exactly unfair, but anti climatic it is.

On the other hand, I started to wonder (like most of us desperate Alonso fans watching the title chances slip out of view) "oh, how good it would be if the Vettel had a DNF, or something wrong is found on the RBRs!" But, then again, I would probably feel ecstatic come Interlagos if that meant a WDC for Alonso but the next day I would have this little guy whispering in my ear (it's a little guy that looks remarkably like Brad, btw): "Hey, what's the sense of victory if the WDC only came because the other team failed"? So, in  the present status, an Alonso championship through some catastrophic failure from RBR/Vettel would feel equally as unfulfilling.

- So, unless something unexpected happens (and it can happen!) My feeling is that the only 'fair' result should be a well deserved WCC championship for RBR, those guys keep making magic and have been laughing at all the other teams for at least 3 seasons now. A well deserved championship for the wunderkind and his much hated finger. Had he not delivered as best as he could in the early parts of the season whe it was much more open, he would have not have been there now. Was he lucky with Alonso's DNFs? For sure. Hvae not Alonso be equally lucky about the alternators on the RBRs? Whoever tries to explain championships merely by fortune should watch tic-tac-toe championships, and not F1.

Alonso has been unofficially officially nominated 'the people's champion' (not just by Alonso fans!) and I think it's fair enough. He did drove masterfully, and had earned himself an admiration only us fans had for him before. Not sure how much comfort he will find in that, but for me is extremely comforting

Oh, I don't know...just some random babbling I need to write from time to time.

[The Shadow]

And in other pre conclusions, I have enjoyed your comments this year. Keep in mind that that could also change come the final round in Brazil..

In a way, even if we seem to be getting into an anti-climax stage in the championship from now on, it's still been a good ride. Formula 1 should be like this..

Still, Whitmarsh should go!!

[BradSpeedMan]

Quiet One, on 29 October 2012 - 04:02 PM, said:

On the other hand, I started to wonder (like most of us desperate Alonso fans watching the title chances slip out of view) "oh, how good it would be if the Vettel had a DNF, or something wrong is found on the RBRs!" But, then again, I would probably feel ecstatic come Interlagos if that meant a WDC for Alonso but the next day I would have this little guy whispering in my ear (it's a little guy that looks remarkably like Brad, btw): "Hey, what's the sense of victory if the WDC only came because the other team failed"? So, in  the present status, an Alonso championship through some catastrophic failure from RBR/Vettel would feel equally as unfulfilling.

for sure for sure
I have just decided that that particular character will wear a red-clown outfit and have flashing little neon-sign horns. Although he  has develop abit of a potbelly he will taunt ear and sundry with a wickedly devious laugh and wont stop screaming" Viva Vettel for president!!! That should be punishment enough!!!

Quiet One, on 29 October 2012 - 04:02 PM, said:

Alonso has been unofficially officially nominated 'the people's champion' (not just by Alonso fans!) and I think it's fair enough. He did drove masterfully, and had earned himself an admiration only us fans had for him before. Not sure how much comfort he will find in that, but for me is extremely comforting

fair enough, he has driven brilliantly,... reminds me of 2005 when Kimi drove brilliantly and won the Best Racer of the ear award while Alonso won the championship

[F1 FANatic]

I have to say this season has gotten 10 times better since the break. And I am not saying that because I am a Vettel fan which I am, and I am not saying that because I can only grudgingly stand Alonso, only because he is driving for Ferrari and when I get up at 4 in the morning here in California to watch races I wear my Ferrari Shirt, my Ferrari Shoes, my Ferrari Belt and sit under a Ferrari Blanket.

Through the last bits of the race in india I was rooting for Vettel to win and for Alonso to pass him not because of Alonso but because I still want a Ferrari to win more than anything else.

The thing is, Alonso is driving really well. Really Really Well. But Vettel is driving Really Really Well Too, you can't be a mediocre driver and still win the race after your team tells you 10 laps from the end that your tires will explode any second, you can't be just any driver if you do 30 laps of a 60 lap race on the softs and then tell the team you can stay out longer if need be while your teamate and the teamate of your biggest rival plead to be allowed to pit.

And If the Ferrari were as good as it is now at the bigining of the season nobody would be talking about how Alonso is hoisting the car up. The Ferrari has been the Second best car on the grid behind the RBR for the last 3/4 of the season. the McLaren has been good in quali but lacks in race pace all season.

The way I see the season go though is that the best driver/car combo is going to win: Vettel/RBR. And I don't care if this makes 3 in a row for him. I don't care if he wins a 4th next year by wining every race. To me, watching a driver and team absolutely crush the compitition is just as exciting as watching 4 people be points equal in the last race and all qualli within .001 seconds of pole. And that is because watching someone dominate is part of Formula one. Did people complain when the Mp4/4 won ever race except for Itally in 88? OF course, but now we look at that season and think of not only the magisty of Ferrari wining in itally but also the technical masterpiece the Mp4/4 was and still is.

I don't begrudge RBR because they dominate. Every team strives to dominate, only a few do.

[Quiet One]

The Shadow, on 29 October 2012 - 04:54 PM, said:

And in other pre conclusions, I have enjoyed your comments this year. Keep in mind that that could also change come the final round in Brazil..

In a way, even if we seem to be getting into an anti-climax stage in the championship from now on, it's still been a good ride. Formula 1 should be like this..

Still, Whitmarsh should go!!

Why, thank you! Wait...did you actually read them?

I do agree about the ride, btw.

[Argento Reloaded]

Burn the Lotus!!!!!
Not quite yet... let´s wait to Brazil!!!

[Quiet One]

More random thoughts, a sort of scoreboard without scores. And without a board. Wait...

The former WDCs No-Score, no-board, scoreboard (and their cars):

1 - RBR car: Up and down but the most consistently at the top performance drives. Alternator issues aside (and the KERS curse) nothing seem to have hurt the car's performance so badly, although had it been a little more reliable this season might have been over by Monaco! The team has worked marvels, btw. Many rulings aimed at hurting some critical 'something' that makes those damn cars drive like on rails. Yet nothing delayed the upgrade pace too much. Pitstops, development...everything seemed as good as it gets.

2 - McLaren: I've already pointed how dismal their season was. Reliability wise a poor car almost all year, awful pitstops at the start, yet a car that showed many times that it was as fast if not faster than the RBR. Good from the team they could recover from the worst pitstops in F1 history to setting records.

3.- Ferrari: for second consecutive year they find out that the wind tunnel failed. Without a proper wind tunnel, you could as well design shopping carts instead of cars and that is very much what they got at the start of season. Blame on them for not fixing something so basic. Kudos for working extremely hard all year to overcome that, finally giving a car that more than once was able to at  least give a decent fight to the top 2 teams and match them on race pace, although never seemed able to dominate them. Reliability is soemthing Ferrari keeps shining for many years now, really amazing and a big advantage. Less strategic errors this year as well

4.- Lotus: A car that seemed sometimes as good as the McLarens at least and some others as awful as the Mercs. Most of their problems came from bad strategy calls, though and too much focus on "The Device"...the most useless PoS never to be used in an F1 car . If talking about the 'package' they had the most terrain to recover in that sense as it was unfamiliar territory against more established 'packages' at the top. Building seems  to be proceeding slowly but getting better and better as Abu Dhabi showed.

5.- Merc: awful car. Not even Nico's lonely win could hide the fact that the car could be quick at the beginning of season and that's almost all you could say about it. And that's something they also lost in the upgrades race.

Next post: the drivers.

[BradSpeedMan]

Quiet One, on 06 November 2012 - 12:37 PM, said:

3.- Ferrari: for second consecutive year they find out that the wind tunnel failed. Without a proper wind tunnel, you could as well design shopping carts instead of cars and that is very much what they got at the start of season. Blame on them for not fixing something so basic. Kudos for working extremely hard all year to overcome that, finally giving a car that more than once was able to at  least give a decent fight to the top 2 teams and match them on race pace, although never seemed able to dominate them. Reliability is soemthing Ferrari keeps shining for many years now, really amazing and a big advantage. Less strategic errors this year as well

This is certainly the factor in Alonso's chances of WDC, the RB still seems fragile and is likely to break down every now and then. Alonso deserves more credit for just being so close to Vettel in the championship, and can deliver a deadly blow if indeed this happens.

[Quiet One]

(@Brad: Indeed, although hoping for other cars to break before yours is hardly an inspiring position when you are trying to fight for a championship)

Caveat on drivers. I am pretty much taking into account the cars as said before. I will try to compare each driver with himself as much as I can. Cross comparisons will not be  too useful and will probably be controversial.

The drivers:

- Sebastian "Die Finger" Vettel: This is where I will probably get the most flak (besides Alonso). I know it is going to sound like sour grapes and blah  blah, but I don't think this year meant a step forward regarding Vettel's performance in any way. Yes, he is about to (quite possibly) become one of the few 3x WDCs in history and quite deservedly so. I've highlited many times his working ethics (he always seems so focused and he seems to spend a lot of time with engineers and on the pitwall.) He is ambitious but his fighting skills are on par with his ambition. Give him a winning car and he will almost never fail to deliver with it.
So, why will I bash him? Because when the car wasn't so bright we also witnessed some average drives, some unforced errors and although I tend to be lenient with frustration signs from drivers, Vettel probably leads the ranking of the less likeable ways of venting it. Wouldn't be so bad if they were merely verbal excesses, but they usually came paired with unforced errors on track showing that he gets upset quite easily when outside of his comfort zone.
He has shown this year that he can overtake but not many of his overtaking moves were particularly impressive and more than a couple were outright dubious. Compared with previous versions of Vettel, this year's Seb seemed a little bit too insecure under pressure. Thte good news is that the guy is just so good in other aspects as to compensate for these, and this year pressure was especially important.

- Alonso: Ok, being an Alonso fan I guess it won't surprise you that I can hardly think of anything bad to say about MY guy This s being defined as Alonso's drive of his life but many journos and analysts which used to have a less than romantic view on the Spaniard. He has honed his many skills to perfection this year and shone in almost every aspect. It was not enough to guarantee a WDC, granted, but I  think that, oddly, this role as underdog fits his abilities better than a leading place in a RBR would have done for him.
Besides the much mentioned abilities to drag the car beyond its limits, he has also shown impressive rallying abilities. He has bragged, and moaned, and kicked the team when Stefano and Luca didn't. He spent days he could have taken off for rest at Maranello with the engineers, he acted more the team principal than a washed out Stefano, in short. He has also mature nicely on track. The fact that I pointed half in jest about him being one of the only two drivers without a penalty this year is no small feat. His drives were fair for the most part, and for any hard manoeuvre he did this year (I think he had at least a couple of very aggressive moves), you could name 5 from the other guys, and none of his really as relevant or dangerous.
Was he perfect? Not at all. But for me, this was the best Alonso I've seen.

- Lewis: As with Alonso, this version of Lewis is the best I've seen. A couple of slumps were noticeable, but he had to face a much more frustrating year than Alonso with regards of effort vs results. He still  managed to deal with a year that would have drove any other driver crazy. Coming from arguably his worst year in F1, this year it was a completely different person. More calm, more focused, less prone to errors on track, still fast, still a furious overtaker...the fact that he has gone up and down so many times in his career makes him a little less easy to rely on than Alonso. He has taken a huge risk moving to Merc, buut it makes him greater in my eyes for that. The potential is there and it's a pity how much of it was wasted these years. This year he could have been a worthy WDC as much as Alonso or Vettel, and I dare to say that a little more deserving than Vettel based on drivers performance alone. Unless Merc can do something with the car, his absence in the title fight nexty year will be a big blow to the F1 circus.

Button: Oops...I guess this will also make me no new friends here... Sorry, I still can't find anything too impressive about him. This year is a step back for him compared to last, quite the opposite from Lewis. Even all the McLaren mistakes couldn't mask that he was unable to extract anything useful from the car even in the few times it worked well (yes, I kknow you will tell me about his two wins, but finishing either first or 8th is not an encouraging sign, mostly when he is usually closer to the latter than to the former...) . Would like to say more things to soften somehow the blow both because I like the Buttonites here and because the guy is nice, but I can't think of many saving graces except  that he is never THAT bad. Next year he will be in position to become the leader at McLaren, and with Whitmarsh being somehow like Stefano (not dictators), he will have the chance to become mcLaren's Alonso. Let's see how he does.

Kimi: Well, anything good you can say about the Iceman is probably being said now somewhere on the net! Despite having a personality that calls for a level of fandom based more on how look he sounds or how hot he looks which is the kind of fandom often associated with teenager, hysterical girls and Brad () he has been thoroughly impressive, He is still blindingly fast, cold headed, focused on racing, great both from the lead and in the middle of the pack...Weak points? Waaaaay too "cool". Past certain point, some emotional involvement is needed. He doesn't seem to push except by his results. Perhaps a little more inspiration from him would have helped them achieve the results earlier than merely sitting at the press conferences and saying "I am not happy". In any case, the car was never championship winning material because the performace varied too much until they finally got some consistent increasing performance curve.
If they can keep this up next year...I suggest banning Brad now to avoid us having to cope with him next year!

Michael: He was...he had...errr...He has a strong chin.
GIven the means at his disposal, Monaco was more significant that you would think. Other than that, as nice as the guy has gotten over the years, it was obvious that conciously or inconsciously his mind was not anymore in F1 anymore. He might still enjoy the racing, but he couldn't lift the dead elephant that was Merc back on its feet by himself. To compare his comeback with Kimi's is a littel unfair, as Kimi came back to a place not so much different that the one he was a couple of years ago (the struggling Ferrari vs the striggling Lotus). Michael had to come back to a place he hadn't been for 15 years at least. And that's where his aging showed. Sadly, nothing too interesting to say about this year except that he at least has gained the respect of many Schumi haters in his last reencarnation. Without the blinding light of the Ferrari, the inner light of Michael showed through, and we could see it was not as bad.

[AleHop]

More conclusions of the pre conclusions...

http://www.totalf1.c...mpionship_most/

[Rainmaster]

That's a fair analysis.

[AleHop]

Rainmaster, on 06 November 2012 - 10:37 PM, said:

That's a fair analysis.

Quiet One's is fair too.

P.D.- Oh, and he did his first.

Edited by AleHop, 06 November 2012 - 10:54 PM.

[BradSpeedMan]

Quiet One, on 06 November 2012 - 03:41 PM, said:

(@Brad: Indeed, although hoping for other cars to break before yours is hardly an inspiring position when you are trying to fight for a championship)

Caveat on drivers. I am pretty much taking into account the cars as said before. I will try to compare each driver with himself as much as I can. Cross comparisons will not be  too useful and will probably be controversial.

The drivers:

- Sebastian "Die Finger" Vettel: This is where I will probably get the most flak (besides Alonso). I know it is going to sound like sour grapes and blah  blah, but I don't think this year meant a step forward regarding Vettel's performance in any way. Yes, he is about to (quite possibly) become one of the few 3x WDCs in history and quite deservedly so. I've highlited many times his working ethics (he always seems so focused and he seems to spend a lot of time with engineers and on the pitwall.) He is ambitious but his fighting skills are on par with his ambition. Give him a winning car and he will almost never fail to deliver with it.
So, why will I bash him? Because when the car wasn't so bright we also witnessed some average drives, some unforced errors and although I tend to be lenient with frustration signs from drivers, Vettel probably leads the ranking of the less likeable ways of venting it. Wouldn't be so bad if they were merely verbal excesses, but they usually came paired with unforced errors on track showing that he gets upset quite easily when outside of his comfort zone.
He has shown this year that he can overtake but not many of his overtaking moves were particularly impressive and more than a couple were outright dubious. Compared with previous versions of Vettel, this year's Seb seemed a little bit too insecure under pressure. Thte good news is that the guy is just so good in other aspects as to compensate for these, and this year pressure was especially important.

You realy think so? He drove really well in a car equal to Ferrari and Mclaren, put himself in a position to pounce when Alonso had dnf's, and like his first year winning the  WDC, performed when he really needed to. Don't forget how hard he worked with his team to bring the car up to scratch and to bring the car more to his liking, the way the car moved forward is testamount to a great team efort.

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer]

One conclusion is that the series has been a lot better with:

• Less scandals
  
• Less faffing about with the rules/spec
  
• No refueling (hee hee I know I threw this one as a contentious one, but still think the refuelling business was tedious)

[DPR]

There is still enough races remaining for me (and every other fickle numpty on the planet) to completely change my opinion on this season.
The only thing that's' missing for me is another young gun to scare the establishment to death!
I'd love to think that a WDC in the next few years will not be a former/current WDC. New blood please!

Edited by DPR, 07 November 2012 - 10:41 AM.

[freaky2]

Hmm, but the WDCs on the grid (bar Schu) still have quite a few years in them so that new guy would have to be very good and obviously get himself into a good car.

I don't see it for next year, but my prophetic vision is limited and I think that there should be enough talented youngsters to start challenging in 2014 and beyond, provided they get into a good team

[Quiet One]

BradSpeedMan, on 07 November 2012 - 05:08 AM, said:

You realy think so? He drove really well in a car equal to Ferrari and Mclaren, put himself in a position to pounce when Alonso had dnf's, and like his first year winning the  WDC, performed when he really needed to. Don't forget how hard he worked with his team to bring the car up to scratch and to bring the car more to his liking, the way the car moved forward is testamount to a great team efort.

RBR proved they are one of the best teams in the history of F1 despite their short history. Marko and Horner might be somewhere between annoying and downright disgusting, but they are the pinnacle of annoying and disgusting people This year finally, the car seemed merely a fast car and not a supercar for a while. But when the car wasn't there, Vettel was, or the strategy was. Did they got "lucky" this weekend? Of course they did! Even their mistakes helped them. But that is only because they react so fast to whatever you throw at them is amazing. In that sense,
As for Vettel, like I said, I am comparing each driver against themselves in the past. In that sense, the Vettel from 2011 was better than the Vettel of 2012. So, if for example I say that Vettel seemed more prone to crashes it would not be meant as "he crashes more than Maldonado", but "he crashes more now that he did in the past" So I am not saying he did a bad job at all this year, only that there was a better version of him in the past that would have probably  done better.

Grabthaw the Hammerslayer, on 07 November 2012 - 09:20 AM, said:

One conclusion is that the series has been a lot better with:

• Less scandals
  
• Less faffing about with the rules/spec
  
• No refueling (hee hee I know I threw this one as a contentious one, but still think the refuelling business was tedious)

Agreed with scandals.
Not so sure about the rules/spec thing. There has been plenty of complaints and rules clarifications and such, but none of them too annoying, that's true.
100% agree with you. I have no idea why everybody calls for the return of refuelling when they watch 4 laps in a row without an overtake.

DPR, on 07 November 2012 - 10:40 AM, said:

There is still enough races remaining for me (and every other fickle numpty on the planet) to completely change my opinion on this season.
The only thing that's' missing for me is another young gun to scare the establishment to death!
I'd love to think that a WDC in the next few years will not be a former/current WDC. New blood please!

Why completely change the opinion? I think it has been great, and even if the last two races were dominated pole to finish by Vettel and Alonso has to abandon both races before turn 1 it would still be great as a season (even if not so good for my fanboi side!)
James Allen made a very interesting article a couple of months ago about the lack of young blood. A little too alarmist for my taste, butu good food for thought.

[Quiet One]

freaky2, on 07 November 2012 - 11:46 AM, said:

Hmm, but the WDCs on the grid (bar Schu) still have quite a few years in them so that new guy would have to be very good and obviously get himself into a good car.

I don't see it for next year, but my prophetic vision is limited and I think that there should be enough talented youngsters to start challenging in 2014 and beyond, provided they get into a good team

Indeed!