And Then There Were Three

[HandyNZL 1]

Realistically, Hamilton and Button are out of the hunt for the WDC. Hammy needed a third this weekend to keep him in the game, and Button a win, but alas, neither was to be, no matter how hard Steph was wishing it so.

So we are down to three. Webber, Vettel and Alonso.

If Alonso wins, then he's done it in an inferior car, but if he doesn't do it by more than 7-points, then he'd better chip off some of the trophy and give it to Massa. And, most sadly, it will give Dementia and di Mozerrella justification for doing the deed in the first place, and somebody save us from the verbal onslaught that Luca will give us given half a chance to get onto his high horse about how they won the championship. Alonso will be a three time champ, but not equal to any of the other three time champs, none of whom relied on a team mate pulling over.

If Vettel wins the next two races, and Webber P2's, then we head into the last race of the season on equal points for first place, with Alonso shut out, even if he finishes third in both of them. I think if this were the scenario, then my money will most likely be lost wagering it on Webber. Vettel is just that little bit quicker, but he's still a little rash, and if things don't go to plan, he'll be the one stressing on it, and coming up with the errors - which will suit Webber to a tee. If Webber can win either Korea or Brazil, then I think the title will be his.

So, it's on to Korea for a spot of dirt track racing, and at the end of it, we'll be down to two drivers.

That is, unless Hamilton or Button can throw a spanner in the works...they can't win the title from here, but they sure can affect it's outcome.

Whatever happens though, my prediction in the Car Launches thread of the Red Bull being WCC will surely come to pass.

[BradSpeedMan 6]

Realistically, Hamilton and Button are out of the hunt for the WDC. Hammy needed a third this weekend to keep him in the game, and Button a win, but alas, neither was to be, no matter how hard Steph was wishing it so.

So we are down to three. Webber, Vettel and Alonso.

If Alonso wins, then he's done it in an inferior car, but if he doesn't do it by more than 7-points, then he'd better chip off some of the trophy and give it to Massa. And, most sadly, it will give Dementia and di Mozerrella justification for doing the deed in the first place, and somebody save us from the verbal onslaught that Luca will give us given half a chance to get onto his high horse about how they won the championship. Alonso will be a three time champ, but not equal to any of the other three time champs, none of whom relied on a team mate pulling over.

If Vettel wins the next two races, and Webber P2's, then we head into the last race of the season on equal points for first place, with Alonso shut out, even if he finishes third in both of them. I think if this were the scenario, then my money will most likely be lost wagering it on Webber. Vettel is just that little bit quicker, but he's still a little rash, and if things don't go to plan, he'll be the one stressing on it, and coming up with the errors - which will suit Webber to a tee. If Webber can win either Korea or Brazil, then I think the title will be his.

So, it's on to Korea for a spot of dirt track racing, and at the end of it, we'll be down to two drivers.

That is, unless Hamilton or Button can throw a spanner in the works...they can't win the title from here, but they sure can affect it's outcome.

Whatever happens though, my prediction in the Car Launches thread of the Red Bull being WCC will surely come to pass.

Vettel is going to win the championship!!!.... nuff said!

[yurp 0]

Realistically, Hamilton and Button are out of the hunt for the WDC. Hammy needed a third this weekend to keep him in the game, and Button a win, but alas, neither was to be, no matter how hard Steph was wishing it so.

So we are down to three. Webber, Vettel and Alonso.

If Alonso wins, then he's done it in an inferior car, but if he doesn't do it by more than 7-points, then he'd better chip off some of the trophy and give it to Massa. And, most sadly, it will give Dementia and di Mozerrella justification for doing the deed in the first place, and somebody save us from the verbal onslaught that Luca will give us given half a chance to get onto his high horse about how they won the championship. Alonso will be a three time champ, but not equal to any of the other three time champs, none of whom relied on a team mate pulling over.

If Vettel wins the next two races, and Webber P2's, then we head into the last race of the season on equal points for first place, with Alonso shut out, even if he finishes third in both of them. I think if this were the scenario, then my money will most likely be lost wagering it on Webber. Vettel is just that little bit quicker, but he's still a little rash, and if things don't go to plan, he'll be the one stressing on it, and coming up with the errors - which will suit Webber to a tee. If Webber can win either Korea or Brazil, then I think the title will be his.

So, it's on to Korea for a spot of dirt track racing, and at the end of it, we'll be down to two drivers.

That is, unless Hamilton or Button can throw a spanner in the works...they can't win the title from here, but they sure can affect it's outcome.

Whatever happens though, my prediction in the Car Launches thread of the Red Bull being WCC will surely come to pass.

Pretty much on the money about everything Craig.

Although I'm going to wait until after Korea to sign off on the McLarens completely.

If Webber gets a DNF and the Maccas come 1-2 then they're back in the game with 2 races left.

I don't think that'll happen, but it's not inconceivable. We don't know what Korea's going to be like.

Right now I'm thinking Webber or Alonso for the WDC. Alonso might be helped by Red Bull infighting, otherwise, most likely Webber for the win.

I'm hoping desperately for a Webber DNF in Korea though. Not that I don't like him, but I would like to see the championship go to the wire.

[zanet 0]

Sorry i cant quite agree with this just yet

The three. Webber, Vettel and Alonso. are certainly well positioned, but Hamilton cant be ruled out just yet.

He is the most unpredicatble and with nothing to loose Red Bull may trip over each other leaving a strong push from Alonso Hamilton and Button

I still think its wait and see the 5 way battle, but i still expect Webber to do it

[blackpebel 0]

Vettel is going to win the championship!!!.... nuff said!

I see some fire in vettle, and it just might pay off given that they have an amazing car.

[blackpebel 0]

I'm hoping desperately for a Webber DNF in Korea though. Not that I don't like him, but I would like to see the championship go to the wire.

You, you, devil you................. I'm hoping for the same .

Although I'm hoping for this to happen(And I know the thought is kinda evil but everyone has them),,,,,,,,,, It would be better to see a good fight getting us the next champion rather than someones DNF.

Now I can see a team battle brewing between both red-bulls and Mclaren drivers, jenson has everthing to play for after being 3 point away from hamilton. And vettle is out to give webber a run for the money. And while they maybe busy racing their teammates it may play in the hands of Alonso.

[Quiet One 15]

If Alonso wins, then he's done it in an inferior car, but if he doesn't do it by more than 7-points, then he'd better chip off some of the trophy and give it to Massa. And, most sadly, it will give Dementia and di Mozerrella justification for doing the deed in the first place, and somebody save us from the verbal onslaught that Luca will give us given half a chance to get onto his high horse about how they won the championship. Alonso will be a three time champ, but not equal to any of the other three time champs, none of whom relied on a team mate pulling over.

First things first:

1) Maccas seem out of contention, yes. But only if the RBRs can show the consistency they failed to show during the first half. Ditto for Ferrari who only seem to have found it during the past 6 races. They might dip again for the remaining ones. So, even if things look grim for Whitmarsh boys, lets not forget that they seemed gloomy for Alonso just a month ago. It gets harder as the season comes to a close, but I still wouldnot rule anybody out. DNFs come out easily in this season.

2) [i Alonso T-shirt on] Your comments on Nando are unfair. Had Hamilton won the WDC, he would also have to give at least a quarter of his trophy to Button for a similar number of races where there were no "explicit team orders" oh, no, George forbid! But Button's was told to "save fuel" or Hamilton was "assured" that Button would not overtake him or, simply, a race like Suzuka, where Button's strategy seemed to suck in such a strange way that it would only help Lewis, albeit costing Jenson any chance of doing anything remarkable (first stint way past his tires' useful life? All he managed was to act as some sort of safety car! And on the new set of tires he seemed so competitive after Lewis retired...weird, huh?). What about Kobayashi being let through by Heidfeld? Or, worst of all, Schumi being told that "there are no team orders, but Nico was told not to cut you off if you go for the overtake" I mean, WTF? How are any of those actually different from "Alonso is faster than you. Did you get the message"? I know nobody likes team orders, but lets not be hypocrites about them.

And Alonso being not equal to the likes of Niki Lauda or Piquet Sr.???? Are you kidding? You are familiar with Lauda's history, right? And have you forgotten Piquet Sr's behavior?

Sorry, but I can understand that you don't like Alonso. I don't like Hamilton personality the least, or Schumi's. But to deny Alonso's feats or skills based on a phrase (as if Massa was actually close to give Alonso a challenge if it weren't for team orders!!!!) is just too much. You are missing a lot. [/i Alonso T-shirt off...hey, like my chest hair?]

[Kopite Girl 0]

Realistically, Hamilton and Button are out of the hunt for the WDC. Hammy needed a third this weekend to keep him in the game, and Button a win, but alas, neither was to be, no matter how hard Steph was wishing it so.

So we are down to three. Webber, Vettel and Alonso.

If Alonso wins, then he's done it in an inferior car, but if he doesn't do it by more than 7-points, then he'd better chip off some of the trophy and give it to Massa. And, most sadly, it will give Dementia and di Mozerrella justification for doing the deed in the first place, and somebody save us from the verbal onslaught that Luca will give us given half a chance to get onto his high horse about how they won the championship. Alonso will be a three time champ, but not equal to any of the other three time champs, none of whom relied on a team mate pulling over.

If Vettel wins the next two races, and Webber P2's, then we head into the last race of the season on equal points for first place, with Alonso shut out, even if he finishes third in both of them. I think if this were the scenario, then my money will most likely be lost wagering it on Webber. Vettel is just that little bit quicker, but he's still a little rash, and if things don't go to plan, he'll be the one stressing on it, and coming up with the errors - which will suit Webber to a tee. If Webber can win either Korea or Brazil, then I think the title will be his.

So, it's on to Korea for a spot of dirt track racing, and at the end of it, we'll be down to two drivers.

That is, unless Hamilton or Button can throw a spanner in the works...they can't win the title from here, but they sure can affect it's outcome.

Whatever happens though, my prediction in the Car Launches thread of the Red Bull being WCC will surely come to pass.

Indeed.

I've wiped my salt-watered stained eyes. Lets just say thank goodness I don't wear make-up, only for going on a night out.

Though its not part of my genetical make up to give up hope. I can't. I'll have to wait and see.

Setting myself up for a fall may be foolish. I'd rather be made a fool of than losing hope.

[Eric 0]

Something just feels wrong about a driver of Webber's caliber winning the WDC. He's certainly a competent driver, but he just never had it until he was in the best car out there. If he wins it, and I imagine he will, he's earned it, no question there, but it's certainly out of no where. I've seen it happen a few times in sport, of course (Bobby Labonte in NASCAR when he won the 2000 title at age 36 after being nothing more than a solid top-10 runner the rest of his career, and Tim Thomas in the NHL when he won the Vezina Trophy as the league's best goaltender at age 35 after being a number two goalie who very nearly missed even getting to the professional league), though a sport like F1 that has this whole "pinnacle of motorsport" snobbery attached to it just doesn't seem like the place where guys like Button or Webber could ever get to the top. If only Webber wasn't a total a##hole; I'd really enjoy seeing him win if he wasn't such a whiny piece of trash.

[JHS 1]

For all the analysing and over-analysing that happens on internet forums, no-one can predict the future, however much they'd like to. For now, mathematically there's still 5 guys in contention for the championship. I think the new points system makes the gaps between the drivers look bigger than they really are too, I think if you worked it out using the old point system it'd still be pretty close.

Nevertheless, consistency is going to win this championship. And at the moment, you'd have to say consistent is Mark Webber.

[Adnam 0]

With 75 pts still on the table anything is possible. I think the three leading contenders have drawn enough gap on the Maccas however the Maccas must finish 1-2 in Korea and two of the three leaders having disappointing results.

Webber needs 62 points to guarentee the WDC. This means comming second in the final races will not necessary ensure the championship. If he wins one of the remaining three races, it will be difficult for the other to catch.

Go Webber and secondly Alonso.

[HandyNZL 1]

With 75 pts still on the table anything is possible. I think the three leading contenders have drawn enough gap on the Maccas however the Maccas must finish 1-2 in Korea and two of the three leaders having disappointing results.

Webber needs 62 points to guarentee the WDC. This means comming second in the final races will not necessary ensure the championship. If he wins one of the remaining three races, it will be difficult for the other to catch.

Go Webber and secondly Alonso.

Ah, but grasshopper, you can't say that 75 points is still available therefore Button still has a chance...sure, he could win the next three races (unlikely), but he needs everyone above him to falter and zero score to make those 75 points work. No good him winning all three with Webber on his exhaust pipe...Webber still wins the WDC for over those three races, only 21 points have been realised.

You have fallen into the media trap of theres x-races at y-points for victory so driver "a" who is on x times y points behind can still win....he can't. He won't. Never ever, ever, ever, ever, ever.

[Adnam 0]

Ah, but grasshopper, you can't say that 75 points is still available therefore Button still has a chance...sure, he could win the next three races (unlikely), but he needs everyone above him to falter and zero score to make those 75 points work. No good him winning all three with Webber on his exhaust pipe...Webber still wins the WDC for over those three races, only 21 points have been realised.

You have fallen into the media trap of theres x-races at y-points for victory so driver "a" who is on x times y points behind can still win....he can't. He won't. Never ever, ever, ever, ever, ever.

Thank you wise and honourable Master. I have now seen the light and have written off the chances of the two Maccas. Please can I also write off Vettel as I cannot see him completing six races in a row (the 3 just past and the 3 comming)?

I would not like to be in Horner's shoes right now in terms of driver preference. Potentially dammed if he does and dammed if he doesn't. Watching Suzuka, when Button was backing the Red Bulls up into Alonso and if it continued, would you instruct (with a very secret coded message) for Vettel to let Webber pass to protect the WDC? Luckily, Button pitted and the rest was history.

[Eric 0]

Let's analyze Jenson's situation.

• If Jenson finishes P1 every race, Webber must be P4 every race. Others do not matter.
• If Jenson finishes P2 every race, Webber must be P7 every race. Hamilton must be P3 every race. Vettel/Alonso must be P4 every race.
• If Jenson finishes P3 every race, Webber must be P8 every race. Hamilton must be P4 every race. Vettel/Alonso must be P7 every race.
• If Jenson finishes P4 every race, Webber must be P10 every race. Hamilton must be P5 every race. Vettel/Alonso must be P7 every race.
• After P4, Webber beats Button regardless.

How about Hamilton?

• Hamilton P1, Webber P3, others N/A.
• Hamilton P2, Webber P6, Vettel/Alonso P4, Button P3.
• Hamilton P3, Webber P8, Vettel/Alonso P5. Button P4.
• Hamilton P4, Webber P8, Vettel/Alonso P7. Button P5.
• Hamilton P5, Webber must fail to score, Vettel/Alonso P8, Button P6. After P5, Webber beats Hamilton regardless.

So, it's realistically a three horse race.

[Delta 0]

All it takes is for one of the other big names to have a no score and we are back to square one again. Whilst it is certainly Red Bull's to lose, as dear old Murray used to say "Anything can happen in Formula 1 and it usually does"

[HandyNZL 1]

First things first:

1) Maccas seem out of contention, yes. But only if the RBRs can show the consistency they failed to show during the first half. Ditto for Ferrari who only seem to have found it during the past 6 races. They might dip again for the remaining ones. So, even if things look grim for Whitmarsh boys, lets not forget that they seemed gloomy for Alonso just a month ago. It gets harder as the season comes to a close, but I still wouldnot rule anybody out. DNFs come out easily in this season.

I think Button and Lewis can drive a faultless race, but they will have Alonso (maybe Massa) and Kubica to contend with, taking points. RBR only have to look after themselves, and they can allow Macca to upset Ferrari. Infact, a McLaren win would actually help RBR, so long as they still podium as well. It's a pretty nice place for them to be sitting.

2) [i Alonso T-shirt on] Your comments on Nando are unfair. Had Hamilton won the WDC, he would also have to give at least a quarter of his trophy to Button for a similar number of races where there were no "explicit team orders" oh, no, George forbid! But Button's was told to "save fuel" or Hamilton was "assured" that Button would not overtake him or, simply, a race like Suzuka, where Button's strategy seemed to suck in such a strange way that it would only help Lewis, albeit costing Jenson any chance of doing anything remarkable (first stint way past his tires' useful life? All he managed was to act as some sort of safety car! And on the new set of tires he seemed so competitive after Lewis retired...weird, huh?). What about Kobayashi being let through by Heidfeld? Or, worst of all, Schumi being told that "there are no team orders, but Nico was told not to cut you off if you go for the overtake" I mean, WTF? How are any of those actually different from "Alonso is faster than you. Did you get the message"? I know nobody likes team orders, but lets not be hypocrites about them.

I think it's plain to see for everyone that McLaren let their drivers race each other, until one is mathematically out of the championship. It has always been thus, and to be fair, perhaps this scenario should be in the FIA rules, no team orders given during the race until such time as one driver can not conceivably win the championship. I think all fans could accept this.

Buttons strategy may have paid off - it's worked (kindof) for Sauber at Barcelona, and it worked for Webber not so many races back. I think that the media likes to grab onto anything they can and spin it for the most negative that they can sniff. It may well have worked out that his strategy could have got him onto the podium, but the SC at the start scuppered it to be honest, as the soft tyres were not thrashed so early on by the other drivers. And Lewis did not retire, or were we watching a different race?

I was actually waiting to see what Heidfeld's reaction was going to be...but Kamui was just plain faster throughout the race, and the overtake was genuine. There is a difference between what happened here, and what happened between Alonso and Massa....at only one corner had Alonso ever been up to inspect Massa's exhaust pipe...Kamui was so far up everyone's bottoms, he was checking their spleens. The observer (fan, you, me) could see the superiority that Kamui had. Flip that to Alonso / Massa and we saw Massa with the superiority and track position and Alonso trailing along some several car lengths behind doing, well, nothing. You have to take each instance in context. The context at Suzuka was that Kamui was coming through, no matter what...and at Hungary, the context was, it looked like Massa was coasting to victory.

As for Schumi being told no team orders, I think this was (1) to tell the audience that Schumi had to try and pass...that he is no longer number one of anything...that Mercedes is going to play by the rule book, even though Ferrari has proven you just need to pay $100,000 and be done with it, and (2) to tell him that Nico will defend, and lets not take both cars out of the race by being stupid. And Schumi tried...he was faster....we all witnessed that....and Nico defended every move. And then his tyres fell to the same level as Nico's and that was that. (Except for the detonation pack Schumi had installed on Nico's rear wishbones.....)

And Alonso being not equal to the likes of Niki Lauda or Piquet Sr.???? Are you kidding? You are familiar with Lauda's history, right? And have you forgotten Piquet Sr's behavior? In order of questions....yes, no, yes, no. Never once heard them whinge...nor get a free pass past a team mate. To be a three time champion lets you be called a great....but in my mind, Alonso just has this air of expectation around him, that everyone must do his bidding. And if they don't then his toys promptly get thrown out of the cart. Maybe it's his temperment, but we don't hear Button mouthing off, nor did we hear Kimi mouth off (by this I mean moan, moan, moan). It's one thing to win on the track, but another to be a champion. A little bit of humility goes a long way.

Sorry, but I can understand that you don't like Alonso. I used to support Alonso...thought he was going to bring Macca the championship, so was really looking forward to it....then he turned into a spoilt brat, and whilst I can appreciate his ontrack talents, no one person is above the team And to be really frank, he hasn't driven all that flash ever since his year at McLaren, not even this year....he just brings the car home, gets overtaken by Kamui, and has to ask Uncle Luca to let him get by Massa. I don't like Hamilton personality the least, or Schumi's. Alot of Alonso fans say this of Hamilton, and to be quite honest, I've never seen reported in the media anywhere about arrogance, or anything along those lines. The kid came in, matched the current WDC punch for punch, and just smiled and said thanks to the team the whole time...maybe I'm blind to something here...I dunno. But to deny Alonso's feats or skills based on a phrase (as if Massa was actually close to give Alonso a challenge if it weren't for team orders!!!!) is just too much. You are missing a lot. Never denied his feats or skills. Just saying they have been sadly lacking over the past few years, and he always seems to be near the smoke of most scandals, yet FIA don't seem to mind. If he wins, he wins, good on him, but he'll have an asterisk next to this championship, that's all. Just like Schumi in a way, as in his latter titles he never had to worry about his teammate taking points off him. We, the general public, was robbed due to the Ferrari set up at the time, but can you honestly blame Schumi for making the most of the situation? Ferrari let it be that way, and it worked out good for them. But we never honestly saw Schumacher challenged and put under pressure within the team, which is what is happening now, and to be honest, he's getting trumped. Would he have been trumped five years ago? Maybe...maybe not...but he may not have had such an easy run to the titles. Alonso is going to have Ferrari built around him, I guess we all can see that. I just think "it's not really cricket", as the saying goes. I'd much rather see every team run like RBR or McLaren with equal drivers. Makes it a sport, not a business. [/i Alonso T-shirt off...hey, like my chest hair?] I thought that was some sort of animal - I was going to report you to PETA....

[yurp 0]

Let's analyze Jenson's situation.

• If Jenson finishes P1 every race, Webber must be P4 every race. Others do not matter.
• If Jenson finishes P2 every race, Webber must be P7 every race. Hamilton must be P3 every race. Vettel/Alonso must be P4 every race.
• If Jenson finishes P3 every race, Webber must be P8 every race. Hamilton must be P4 every race. Vettel/Alonso must be P7 every race.
• If Jenson finishes P4 every race, Webber must be P10 every race. Hamilton must be P5 every race. Vettel/Alonso must be P7 every race.
• After P4, Webber beats Button regardless.

How about Hamilton?

• Hamilton P1, Webber P3, others N/A.
• Hamilton P2, Webber P6, Vettel/Alonso P4, Button P3.
• Hamilton P3, Webber P8, Vettel/Alonso P5. Button P4.
• Hamilton P4, Webber P8, Vettel/Alonso P7. Button P5.
• Hamilton P5, Webber must fail to score, Vettel/Alonso P8, Button P6. After P5, Webber beats Hamilton regardless.

So, it's realistically a three horse race.

I totally agree.

But on the other hand one DNF from Webber and it's all back on.

That is what the Maccas need right now - a Webber DNF.

[HandyNZL 1]

Not going to happen....Webber is playing the numbers now....only an engine failure will rob him, me thinks.

He just needs to finish one race ahead of Vettel, and the rest (Alonso, Hamilton, Kubica, Massa, Button) will be too busy taking points off each other that the dominance of the RBR's will get them P1 and P2 in the WDC. Alonso is equal to Vettel because of Vettel's antics mid season....and now it can be clearly seen that no matter what Ferrari and/or Macca throw at them, they can punch back twice as hard.

I honestly can not see a victory to any team other than RBR for the remaining races. Macca may be close in Korea thanks to the long straight, but Brazil and Abu Dhabi will be much the same as Suzuka...RBR 0.5secs faster without sweating.

If we get a 1 - 2 - 3 in the same order as Suzuka we will have:

Webber 220 + 18 = 238

Vettel 206+25 = 231

Alonso 206 + 15 = 221

As you can see he (FA) drifts back....and that is not supposing that Hamilton or Button get ahead of him, which will be highly likely at Korea.

Macca (and to a lesser extent, Kubica) will dictate Alonso's final position, and in the same breath, strengthen Red Bull's.

To cement the crown Webber must finish ahead of Vettel in one of the next three races. By one position will give him one hand on the trophy...two positions, and you can pretty much get the engraver started with "Mark".

It's a three horse race at present, but the prancing horse I do not feel is strong enough to keep up.

Can't wait....I like cliff hangers

[yurp 0]

Not going to happen....Webber is playing the numbers now....only an engine failure will rob him, me thinks.

He just needs to finish one race ahead of Vettel, and the rest (Alonso, Hamilton, Kubica, Massa, Button) will be too busy taking points off each other that the dominance of the RBR's will get them P1 and P2 in the WDC. Alonso is equal to Vettel because of Vettel's antics mid season....and now it can be clearly seen that no matter what Ferrari and/or Macca throw at them, they can punch back twice as hard.

I honestly can not see a victory to any team other than RBR for the remaining races. Macca may be close in Korea thanks to the long straight, but Brazil and Abu Dhabi will be much the same as Suzuka...RBR 0.5secs faster without sweating.

If we get a 1 - 2 - 3 in the same order as Suzuka we will have:

Webber 220 + 18 = 238

Vettel 206+25 = 231

Alonso 206 + 15 = 221

As you can see he (FA) drifts back....and that is not supposing that Hamilton or Button get ahead of him, which will be highly likely at Korea.

Macca (and to a lesser extent, Kubica) will dictate Alonso's final position, and in the same breath, strengthen Red Bull's.

To cement the crown Webber must finish ahead of Vettel in one of the next three races. By one position will give him one hand on the trophy...two positions, and you can pretty much get the engraver started with "Mark".

It's a three horse race at present, but the prancing horse I do not feel is strong enough to keep up.

Can't wait....I like cliff hangers

Again - I entirely agree. apart from the first sentence. First - an engine / car failure is always possible. Second - Vettel, Alonso, Hamilton and Button will be desperate to take a run at Webber given any (even half a) chance. That could easily end in a DNF for Mark. Hamilton's overtake in Singapore could easily have ended Webber's race. I know he'll be trying to stay out of trouble and playing the numbers game, but these things are sometimes out of one's hands. I'll wait until after Korea before agreeing with you fully.

I'm 90% sure I will be agreeing with you after the next race, but I'm leaving that 10% open.

What could happen in Korea...

Hamilton P1 - 217

Button P2 - 207

Vettel P3 - 221

Alonso P4 - 218

Webber DNF - 220

If Webber has a DNF, I think this is a very conceivable result (P1 - P4) since Korea may suit the Maccas. As you can see - it opens the whole thing up again, apart from it's bye bye Button.

What I think will probably happen...

Hamilton P1 - 217

Vettel P2 - 224

Webber P3 - 235

Button P4 - 201

Alonso P5 - 216

In which case again it's bye bye Button and very likely goodbye to Hamilton and Alonso too.

Anyhow - this is all pointless. It makes no difference and only shows that you are more willing to bet with the odds then me.

[HandyNZL 1]

So what you are really saying, is that it's bye bye Button because he sucks, aye?

(waits for Steph to jump up and down {just so we can watch her boobies})

[HandyNZL 1]

Something just feels wrong about a driver of Webber's caliber winning the WDC. He's certainly a competent driver, but he just never had it until he was in the best car out there. If he wins it, and I imagine he will, he's earned it, no question there, but it's certainly out of no where. I've seen it happen a few times in sport, of course (Bobby Labonte in NASCAR when he won the 2000 title at age 36 after being nothing more than a solid top-10 runner the rest of his career, and Tim Thomas in the NHL when he won the Vezina Trophy as the league's best goaltender at age 35 after being a number two goalie who very nearly missed even getting to the professional league), though a sport like F1 that has this whole "pinnacle of motorsport" snobbery attached to it just doesn't seem like the place where guys like Button or Webber could ever get to the top. If only Webber wasn't a total a##hole; I'd really enjoy seeing him win if he wasn't such a whiny piece of trash.

To be honest, Eric, when Webber started out I never really thought of him as WDC material, but here he is, after all these years, in with a better than even chance of winning it. He is one of those silent achievers, never flashy, not making headlines for the wrong reasons, never being overhyped by a news-bite-memory-of-a-goldfish media, and just generally putting in the hardwork hoping that one day it will come together.

If he wins, then it will most likely be his only one, but it will be hat tipped to him for doing so. He call's a spade a spade, and we will all know that his championship will have been well deserved.

[JHS 1]

Ah, but grasshopper, you can't say that 75 points is still available therefore Button still has a chance...sure, he could win the next three races (unlikely), but he needs everyone above him to falter and zero score to make those 75 points work. No good him winning all three with Webber on his exhaust pipe...Webber still wins the WDC for over those three races, only 21 points have been realised.

You have fallen into the media trap of theres x-races at y-points for victory so driver "a" who is on x times y points behind can still win....he can't. He won't. Never ever, ever, ever, ever, ever.

How long have you been watching F1? I presume for quite a while?

It's all very well saying that he'll have no chance ever of winning, but this is Formula One, a historically very unpredictable sport. Look at the likes of Alonso, Button and Vettel after Spa. Everybody thought that it was a straight duel between Webber and Hamilton, but two DNFs later for Hamilton, 2 wins later for Alonso and Vettel's latest win means that anything can, and (and to echo Murray Walker's words) probably will happen.

Let's just see what happens. Mathematically both McLarens have a chance (I can't believe I'm trying to talk McLaren's chances up here) and that mathematic chance is good enough for me. It's still a 5 way fight.

[yurp 0]

So what you are really saying, is that it's bye bye Button because he sucks, aye?

Pretty much.

[Hector Troyano 0]

I think Button is gone from the fight and it was very obvious that Macca gave him a super crappy strategy that benefit Hamilton clearly.

So my take is that the team is choosing (surprise!) Hamilton.

But there was some justice happening and he got hit with the gearbox problem that allowed him to pass in front, otherwise I'm sure there

will be other post commenting on what happened in Japan.

[Kopite Girl 0]

So what you are really saying, is that it's bye bye Button because he sucks, aye?

(waits for Steph to jump up and down {just so we can watch her boobies})

:lol: :lol: