Valencia, Es La Tierra De Las Flores...

[Quiet One 15]

Yep! He's definitely still got that respect and intelligence that he always seemed to have when battling other drivers. It was exactly that part of the race I was thinking of, when he was behind Alonso, that I thought he was a little tame. Lack of aggression is not something I'd usually associate with Kimi's driving, based on his first career in F1, so maybe he's just rusty..

Not really, I just think it highlights one of the favorite topics in all F1 discussions: why is that the guy that wins from pole to finish is not automatically considered the best?

In this race, Alonso (for upteenth time imho) showed he is definitely a legend and we are all lucky to be witnessing him as those of us that enjoyed Senna/Prost were lucky at the time. But in this race his outstanding skills were on display right until he made it to P1. Afterwards, he showed just that he is a great race driver to stay up there till the finish line. So, 90% of his genius (and if it makes you happy: his luck, the other guys misfortunes, conspiracy theories at McLaren, FIArrari, Communists plots against Lewis, etc.) took him to P1. Only 10% of that was needed afterwards to keep him there to the finishing flags.

Kimi could have easily won this (or GRO, HAM...pick your hero). He had a better, faster car that's for sure. But when the time came he couldn't even get close enough to make a statement. Why? Because of the penalty of not being at the front. Being at the front starts a virtuous circle. You are there, you get less tire degradation, you can pretty much establish your own race pace and if you can't, at least minimize the others that are catching up, etc.

When Kimi finally got to P2, and able to hunt down and challenge ALO, his possibilities were truly over because his tires were cooked by the extra effort. So, once Kimi was in P2 was ALO so great or Kimi so mediocre that the Lotus couldn't even challenge him? No, he just had a much better prospect.

That is why a Vettel win might have won him lots of respect, but never as much as any of these guys' victories. You still need to be falwless, you still need to be quick, but you got a lot of things in your favor once in P1. The merit is in getting there.

In this race luck went to ALO. Had it gone to Kimi, or HAM, or GRO it would have been equally valid. As for Alonso legendary status, it is just because when that olf bitch we call luck is looking for a lover, it is always ALO who is hard and ready and not just in this race . Kimi needs too much foreplay and Hamilton still has a hairy trigger...

Vettel? Well...maybe she was asking for more than a finger this time

[Massa 0]

Well I still think it's a really neat track, and was very impressed with the track and the surroundings during the part of the race when Vettel had it all won (and I wanted that to be clear, this isn't a post-race "oh it was a good race must be a good track" reaction, it was a two laps in "wow this is a cool track" reaction). It's set up well for good battles when cars do get alongside, where you can do a lot of counter-attacking and make a battle last over a few corners, and the DRS zone isn't a free-pass kind of place. So it's a little flat, but I don't see anything wrong with this track, not at all. It seems pretty unique to me and it's visually pleasing. It's a challenge to pass, but, well, we were all complaing that DRS makes passing too easy so I figure challenging passes are what we like...no?

I can't figure you guys out at all. At least a Valencia procession is prettier (cars cornering has a nice artistic look to it) than a procession somewhere else and that's just sort of the nature of F1, no matter what track.

But no, to each one's own, I think this is a really great facility they've built and I hope it has a nice long-term future, even as an alternating race, because like Felipe Massa, everyone else hates it but I like it a lot. Maybe it's the pretty colors or something and maybe I'm just partial to seeing that HUGE crowd which is something I'm not used to (almost every race in the U.S. is just bare aluminum all the way around...none of us attend races anymore, and some of F1's country's, people never did and likely never will).

I thought the circuit was cool, even when the race wasn't very eventful, and therefore it must be the best track ever. Tilke successfully pulled the wool over my eyes and used colors and buildings and grandstands and bridges and boats and deep green water to convince me that his design was really cool (either that or I just really, really, really like how the corners go such that you go inside-outside-inside-outside when you're alongside someone and you have to really fight and maneuver and all that to battle another car...we had some great moves that were a result of the driver responding to the track's changes as much as the changes of the defending driver and I think that's just fun and awesome and great, sincerely).

WOO VALENCIA!

[Ikyrotz 0]

Not really, I just think it highlights one of the favorite topics in all F1 discussions: why is that the guy that wins from pole to finish is not automatically considered the best?

I agree with you on your description of Alonso here, but not with your conclusion that Kimi or Lewis or some others are less capable. They have both shown before that they are able to produce similar drives as well. Like Rainmaster speculated, I think Kimi is still a bit rusty and takes it unnecessarily carefully at times when it comes to overtaking others. However, better that than out of the race in the first corner (like could've easily happened had he been more aggressive with Maldonado when Pastor blocked him in the first corner. I have to admit I yelled at the tv when he lost all those positions he had just gained off the start line due to being so "soft" .)

[Quiet One 15]

I agree with you on your description of Alonso here, but not with your conclusion that Kimi or Lewis or some others are less capable. They have both shown before that they are able to produce similar drives as well. Like Rainmaster speculated, I think Kimi is still a bit rusty and takes it unnecessarily carefully at times when it comes to overtaking others. However, better that than out of the race in the first corner (like could've easily happened had he been more aggressive with Maldonado when Pastor blocked him in the first corner. I have to admit I yelled at the tv when he lost all those positions he had just gained off the start line due to being so "soft" .)

HAM and RAI are both capable . Everybody agrees. Vettel too. Petrov, probably . But then you need the coulda/woulda/shoulda to explain why they were capable but not able.

A.J.Liebling once said "I can write faster than anybody that can write better, and I can write better than anybody that can write faster". Button last year at Canada made an epic drive for the history books. Choose your favorite from Kimi's records if you are a Kimi fan. Or bring back old Lewis memories (or even last race's win) if you want to praise Lewis. Any of those could be painted in epic colors just as this win could be for Nando. So yes, there's no question any of them could make epic wins. Panis will have bards singing his lone win for generations to come. Somebody (I'm sure) with proper writing skills could write a modern era Oddisey about Ralf victories.People still go lyrical over Hulkenberg's "perfect qualy lap" at Interlagos....see a pattern?

Many drivers can do that. The more they do, the better they are considered. Gilles won just 6 GPs and 13 podiums. How come he is a legend? Massa has 11 wins and 33 podiums and he is considered laughing stock! Why? because the short and not so brilliant (in numbers) career from Gilles is filled with epic moments, whereas Massa's career glories are concentrated on half a season with a couple of epic drives and a good deal of love for the underdog. Everything else he did is closer to his 5 spins at Silverstone that his heroic race at Interlagos 2008.

It leaves much to subjectivity? Yes, that is why legends are only built after many races and different conditions. In due time, Hamiilton, Kimi and Seb can very well reach Alonso's level and even surpass him. But, to be clear, legends are made of more than statistics. Schumacher with 7 WDCs and pretty much every record that is out there is still no Ayrton. Some things are simply best experienced than calculated.

Meanwhile, enjoy. Even if you think I am completely in teenage fanboism over Nando for this win, there is no question that Alonso, Kimi, Seb, Ham, Web, Schum and Jens have the right skills and so far close enough cars to make this one of the best season's lineups ever.

Valencia this year was helped a lot by a better placed DRS and Pirelli tires, but without drivers of the proper caliber you would have not have witnessed such a race.

[Ikyrotz 0]

Meanwhile, enjoy. Even if you think I am completely in teenage fanboism over Nando for this win, there is no question that Alonso, Kimi, Seb, Ham, Web, Schum and Jens have the right skills and so far close enough cars to make this one of the best season's lineups ever.

I think I can agree with most of what you said there, definitely with this line. I'm just not sure if there are more of those coulda/woulda/shoulda races with other top drivers than with Alonso (maybe there are, though certainly there are such races for Alonso too, he has not been this good every season he's been in F1 ).

[Rainmaster 7]

Not really, I just think it highlights one of the favorite topics in all F1 discussions: why is that the guy that wins from pole to finish is not automatically considered the best?

In this race, Alonso (for upteenth time imho) showed he is definitely a legend and we are all lucky to be witnessing him as those of us that enjoyed Senna/Prost were lucky at the time. But in this race his outstanding skills were on display right until he made it to P1. Afterwards, he showed just that he is a great race driver to stay up there till the finish line. So, 90% of his genius (and if it makes you happy: his luck, the other guys misfortunes, conspiracy theories at McLaren, FIArrari, Communists plots against Lewis, etc.) took him to P1. Only 10% of that was needed afterwards to keep him there to the finishing flags.

Kimi could have easily won this (or GRO, HAM...pick your hero). He had a better, faster car that's for sure. But when the time came he couldn't even get close enough to make a statement. Why? Because of the penalty of not being at the front. Being at the front starts a virtuous circle. You are there, you get less tire degradation, you can pretty much establish your own race pace and if you can't, at least minimize the others that are catching up, etc.

When Kimi finally got to P2, and able to hunt down and challenge ALO, his possibilities were truly over because his tires were cooked by the extra effort. So, once Kimi was in P2 was ALO so great or Kimi so mediocre that the Lotus couldn't even challenge him? No, he just had a much better prospect.

That is why a Vettel win might have won him lots of respect, but never as much as any of these guys' victories. You still need to be falwless, you still need to be quick, but you got a lot of things in your favor once in P1. The merit is in getting there.

In this race luck went to ALO. Had it gone to Kimi, or HAM, or GRO it would have been equally valid. As for Alonso legendary status, it is just because when that olf bitch we call luck is looking for a lover, it is always ALO who is hard and ready and not just in this race . Kimi needs too much foreplay and Hamilton still has a hairy trigger...

Vettel? Well...maybe she was asking for more than a finger this time

Stop using my posts to go on long rants! Beautiful metaphor at the end there, the kind only you could conjure But yes, I agree, except for the "not really" part at the beginning.

[Quiet One 15]

Stop using my posts to go on long rants! Beautiful metaphor at the end there, the kind only you could conjure

Why, thank you! I just wanted to make clear that Lady Luck will always look for Alonso when she wants a real d#ck!

No...wait...

[Rainmaster 7]

You've clearly got Alonso's 6 tenths on your brain.

[Rainmaster 7]

Edit: I'm tired.

But, making something of this double post: I just watched some highlights, and Ben Edwards' commentary is so over the top and annoying. CALM DOWN IT'S JUST A RACE. Brundle was a gift.

[Massa 0]

The only time I'll ever sympathize with you BBC/Sky people is that the deal spreads a thin pool of good commentators over two channels rather than having all the good guys together on one and most of the not-so-good guys covering motorsport sideshows. I can't stomach Ben Edwards or Leigh Diffey; shouting kind of cheapens the broadcast to me. Not talking can build a lot of suspense. And engine noise is cool. I say it 1,000,000,000 times and I'll say it again: the old Indy 500 broadcasts where they were silent during the prowl and concise during the action won awards. The modern "radio on TV" non-stop talking stuff never even gets nominated...

...except for hockey, and don't ask me why I'm fine with a loud hockey broadcast but not racing, I don't know, I wonder...if you unplug the middle audio cable thingy if it will take out the commentary and the L/R will have the engine noise, or if they blend all of it together over all three channels or whatever (I know very little about how this all works, or how anything works).

Not that it all really matters because the race was good and I like the track for the track, not even for the race it produced, for the track. The layout and the surroundings. Still. A track needs thirty races, even processsional ones, to be run on it and it's an automatic "you can't lose this event." But the same people who demand history wish all the tracks away before they can accumulate any. And the same people who hate Valencia, which looked sold out to me, tell us to get away from Bahrain etc. because it's empty and there's nothing around the track.

I'm consistent; I just like all things that suck.

DEFEND VALENCIA. NEVER DEFEND POOR COMMENTARY.

[Rainmaster 7]

The only time I'll ever sympathize with you BBC/Sky people is that the deal spreads a thin pool of good commentators over two channels rather than having all the good guys together on one and most of the not-so-good guys covering motorsport sideshows. I can't stomach Ben Edwards or Leigh Diffey; shouting kind of cheapens the broadcast to me. Not talking can build a lot of suspense. And engine noise is cool. I say it 1,000,000,000 times and I'll say it again: the old Indy 500 broadcasts where they were silent during the prowl and concise during the action won awards. The modern "radio on TV" non-stop talking stuff never even gets nominated...

...except for hockey, and don't ask me why I'm fine with a loud hockey broadcast but not racing, I don't know, I wonder...if you unplug the middle audio cable thingy if it will take out the commentary and the L/R will have the engine noise, or if they blend all of it together over all three channels or whatever (I know very little about how this all works, or how anything works).

Not that it all really matters because the race was good and I like the track for the track, not even for the race it produced, for the track. The layout and the surroundings. Still. A track needs thirty races, even processsional ones, to be run on it and it's an automatic "you can't lose this event." But the same people who demand history wish all the tracks away before they can accumulate any. And the same people who hate Valencia, which looked sold out to me, tell us to get away from Bahrain etc. because it's empty and there's nothing around the track.

I'm consistent; I just like all things that suck.

DEFEND VALENCIA. NEVER DEFEND POOR COMMENTARY.

Agree about commentary. I think that style (leaving silences, building tension, etc) takes much more confidence than just shouting.

[Massa 0]

But anyway, my obsession with criticizing sportscasts and with loving this track aside, penalties:

1. I don't like, and you all know I don't like, penalties applied to sessions in which the incident did not occur. I just think it's laughable to decide what will hurt the driver more when penalizing. "Well Maldonado had a point, so we'll penalize him for the race, but Kobayashi and Vergne were out, so we'll get them next time." It's just sloppy to me. I realize penalizing Kobayashi and Vergne would be useless, but since they screwed their own days up, oh well, let it go. I guess it just looks wrong to had out penalties in the same race and some apply to the race and others don't. I understand the thought process but I don't like it.

Besides, just like penalizing Kobayashi and Vergne twenty seconds like Maldonado is useless, penalizing Vernge ten grid spots is useless if he qualifies dead last anyway. So, applying the penalty to the next round doesn't make it have any more of an impact necessarily, which negates the whole concept to me.

2. Maldonado...that's a reputation penalty. I'd just not penalize either him or Hamilton, but whatever. I'm just not sure there's much merit in it other than Maldonado's had a few incidents so it's just easy to blame him any time there's contact involving him. He attacked and Hamilton defended and it just kind of happened. Weird to me, and I just wonder if another driver, without a reputation of dumb stuff, does it and gets away unscathed.

3. Vergne...good call there. I like the guy but that was an asbolutely reckless move. Horrid.

4. Kobayashi...no argument. You don't take Felipe out like that.

[Quiet One 15]

You've clearly got Alonso's 6 tenths on your brain.

Bah, you only say that because Kimi keeps getting sloppy seconds.

[Massa 0]

And even beyond my last post, that was a cool race no matter who got penalized and why. F1 just has something really awesome about it that I haven't appreciated until recently; it's always just been a racing series like the other racing series until now. It's fast and it's strategic and that's how I like my races...I prefer drama to outright action (but drama is meaningless if it never culminates in action) and F1 has so much drama, and now these drivers get a chance to do something with it, and man, they do it well. I have a hard time getting behind these drivers as sportsman but as racers, these guys are pretty exciting. I am glad I grew up to appreciate F1 because this is a really fascinating sport to follow...I guess F1 has a way of surrounding the show with over-the-top things while keeping the show as pure as possible given a modern audience, whereas the other series I've followed have made the show itself over-the-top and surrounded it with corn fields and cow manure, which are, at times, more interesting than NASCAR, but nevertheless, I've no need to put down the other series to just say that F1 is really just great this year.

[Rainmaster 7]

Bah, you only say that because Kimi keeps getting sloppy seconds.

Alright, you got me.

[HandyNZL 1]

I fell asleep at lap 10. (It was 12:30am ish my time by then). I awoke to Ben Edwards screaming about Kimi passing Hamilton. My blurry eyes (2am and a bit in the morning), watched the last three laps unfold with Hamilton being nurfed by Maldonado. Then a red car won the race. I was like "what the? how the? say what?"

Might be I watch the recording tonight...since it appears the race was a good'un.

[AleHop 0]

But no, let's just cancel a great event because they don't overtake enough...and of course if they did, they'd overtake too much and be cheapening overtaking as an art or whatever.

Now I see you were telling the truth when you said you didn't watch the races in past seasons. This race in Valencia has nothing to do with the previous ones. If that would have been the show in previous seasons nobody would be unhappy with the GP. Althoug F1 fans are hard to pleased, you know?

It isn't.

They confirmed officially a month or so ago that it was alternating with Barcelona. Barcelona in 2013, Valenca 2014, etc, etc.

True buuut... They said that officially but I think they didn't officially confirm it. In summary, the GP may be removed from the calendar in 2013, 2014, etc.

Not really, I just think it highlights one of the favorite topics in all F1 discussions: why is that the guy that wins from pole to finish is not automatically considered the best?

In this race, Alonso (for upteenth time imho) showed he is definitely a legend and we are all lucky to be witnessing him as those of us that enjoyed Senna/Prost were lucky at the time. But in this race his outstanding skills were on display right until he made it to P1. Afterwards, he showed just that he is a great race driver to stay up there till the finish line. So, 90% of his genius (and if it makes you happy: his luck, the other guys misfortunes, conspiracy theories at McLaren, FIArrari, Communists plots against Lewis, etc.) took him to P1. Only 10% of that was needed afterwards to keep him there to the finishing flags.

Kimi could have easily won this (or GRO, HAM...pick your hero). He had a better, faster car that's for sure. But when the time came he couldn't even get close enough to make a statement. Why? Because of the penalty of not being at the front. Being at the front starts a virtuous circle. You are there, you get less tire degradation, you can pretty much establish your own race pace and if you can't, at least minimize the others that are catching up, etc.

When Kimi finally got to P2, and able to hunt down and challenge ALO, his possibilities were truly over because his tires were cooked by the extra effort. So, once Kimi was in P2 was ALO so great or Kimi so mediocre that the Lotus couldn't even challenge him? No, he just had a much better prospect.

That is why a Vettel win might have won him lots of respect, but never as much as any of these guys' victories. You still need to be falwless, you still need to be quick, but you got a lot of things in your favor once in P1. The merit is in getting there.

In this race luck went to ALO. Had it gone to Kimi, or HAM, or GRO it would have been equally valid. As for Alonso legendary status, it is just because when that olf bitch we call luck is looking for a lover, it is always ALO who is hard and ready and not just in this race . Kimi needs too much foreplay and Hamilton still has a hairy trigger...

Vettel? Well...maybe she was asking for more than a finger this time

A long rant, but a beutiful one. I do it mine.

It leaves much to subjectivity? Yes, that is why legends are only built after many races and different conditions. In due time, Hamiilton, Kimi and Seb can very well reach Alonso's level and even surpass him. But, to be clear, legends are made of more than statistics. Schumacher with 7 WDCs and pretty much every record that is out there is still no Ayrton. Some things are simply best experienced than calculated.

Maybe Vettel's problem is Newey. I mean, he's been driving such a good car in the past few years where he's won so much that he didn't have the chance to show all his greatness. I'm not at all impressed with Vettel's achivements because most of them were accomplished in the best best, can I use bestest?, car and his F1 life is pretty much reducible to Red Bull and Webber as the strongest teammate. I consider him a very good driver because F1 people says he is that good and I trust them, not because I'm impressed from what I've watched so far. But it doesn't mean he isn't a great driver, like Napoleon winning most of his battles with a stronger army doesn't mean he wasn't a great General.

Why, thank you! I just wanted to make clear that Lady Luck will always look for Alonso when she wants a real d#ck!

No...wait...

I understood that today she wasn't looking for a finger.

The only time I'll ever sympathize with you BBC/Sky people is that the deal spreads a thin pool of good commentators over two channels rather than having all the good guys together on one and most of the not-so-good guys covering motorsport sideshows. I can't stomach Ben Edwards or Leigh Diffey; shouting kind of cheapens the broadcast to me. Not talking can build a lot of suspense. And engine noise is cool. I say it 1,000,000,000 times and I'll say it again: the old Indy 500 broadcasts where they were silent during the prowl and concise during the action won awards. The modern "radio on TV" non-stop talking stuff never even gets nominated...

...except for hockey, and don't ask me why I'm fine with a loud hockey broadcast but not racing, I don't know, I wonder...if you unplug the middle audio cable thingy if it will take out the commentary and the L/R will have the engine noise, or if they blend all of it together over all three channels or whatever (I know very little about how this all works, or how anything works).

Not that it all really matters because the race was good and I like the track for the track, not even for the race it produced, for the track. The layout and the surroundings. Still. A track needs thirty races, even processsional ones, to be run on it and it's an automatic "you can't lose this event." But the same people who demand history wish all the tracks away before they can accumulate any. And the same people who hate Valencia, which looked sold out to me, tell us to get away from Bahrain etc. because it's empty and there's nothing around the track.

I'm consistent; I just like all things that suck.

DEFEND VALENCIA. NEVER DEFEND POOR COMMENTARY.

You are so right!

But about Valencia GP I didn't like Valencia races. I think one of them was good, 2010? We are too harsh on some tracks and love some others so our judment is always biased.

2. Maldonado...that's a reputation penalty. I'd just not penalize either him or Hamilton, but whatever. I'm just not sure there's much merit in it other than Maldonado's had a few incidents so it's just easy to blame him any time there's contact involving him. He attacked and Hamilton defended and it just kind of happened. Weird to me, and I just wonder if another driver, without a reputation of dumb stuff, does it and gets away unscathed.

Some learn the easy way, some the hard way and some never learn. Let's see what group Maldonado is in. I think it's good that drivers, specially young ones, get a penalty that match the offense. That's the only way they can ponder on what they've done and improve.

You know what people used to say about Alonso when he was in karts and F3000 when they were asked about his more remarkable trait? I think it was his mentor Adrián Campos or Genís that said he never makes a mistake twice. So there was no need for penalties for Alonso but for any other it's better to penalise them.

With Stella, he knows them all very well.

WTH is Alonso doing?

Nothing like a win at home!!!

You've clearly got Alonso's 6 tenths on your brain.

It's even on Alonso's brain. :-D

P.S. Did I say that I hate the new forum software. Going backwards like crabs!!! How do you post videos from youtube and the likes? Maybe I'm getting old.

[AleHop 0]

Yes, I'm getting old. It now posts itself automatically.

I still don't like it but...

[Insider 0]

Eventful race. It was clearly Red Bull's day - they had the fastest machines out there. Not even the mecurial Grosjean in a hugely improved Lotus could put a dent in Vettel's total dominance. Romain is a considerable amount quicker than the Kimster and he'll be in to a run of podiums sooner rather than later. I thought the safety car was completely unnecessary - one could be forgiven for thinking the whole thing was staged - especially as there was as much debris and incident on the track before and after Charlie made the call. Alonso was magnificent, irrespective that he lucked into the top step and though Lewis is arguably the fastest pure peddler out there, McLaren seem incapable of providing him with a car worthy of his talents this year. He has the air of a man who is committed to moving on. Even if he hadn't been nurfed by the dolt from Caracas he would have probably ended up a yard in front of his team mate, such is the cut of the poorly balanced, tyre eating MP4-27s. To my eye, Massa is just driving badly. A move away from Marinello could re-energise his career completely. Webber did well to advance via the bad fortune of others into fourth. He does deserve some luck though. As for the rest, Force India were quick with good strategies, Sauber continue to improve, as do Williams and though there is little behind them, Caterham visibly made a big step. STR seem lost.

[dribbler 6]

Eventful race. It was clearly Red Bull's day - they had the fastest machines out there. Not even the mecurial Grosjean in a hugely improved Lotus could put a dent in Vettel's total dominance. Romain is a considerable amount quicker than the Kimster and he'll be in to a run of podiums sooner rather than later. I thought the safety car was completely unnecessary - one could be forgiven for thinking the whole thing was staged - especially as there was as much debris and incident on the track before and after Charlie made the call. Alonso was magnificent, irrespective that he lucked into the top step and though Lewis is arguably the fastest pure peddler out there, McLaren seem incapable of providing him with a car worthy of his talents this year. He has the air of a man who is committed to moving on. Even if he hadn't been nurfed by the dolt from Caracas he would have probably ended up a yard in front of his team mate, such is the cut of the poorly balanced, tyre eating MP4-27s. To my eye, Massa is just driving badly. A move away from Marinello could re-energise his career completely. Webber did well to advance via the bad fortune of others into fourth. He does deserve some luck though. As for the rest, Force India were quick with good strategies, Sauber continue to improve, as do Williams and though there is little behind them, Caterham visibly made a big step. STR seem lost.

Browsing through the 'post' shop, I'll steal this one.

Got to add that I was thrilled for Michael, lucked or not.

Great enterntainment.

[Quiet One 15]

Staged? There was debris everywhere, most of it courtesy of the STR guys...so I assume iti was staged by RBR and Whitting...to benefit Alonso, Kimi and Lewis?

Am I missing something?

[JHS18 0]

Which looked sold out to me

There is a very good reason for that:

http://totalf1.com/f...duces_capacity/

45,000.

That's more to do with how f*cked the Spanish economy is more than anything, but I guess it is not hard to make an F1 race look busy if there's only 45,000 seats...with the exceptions of China, Turkey, Korea, Bahrain and a whole bunch of others as well.

I think when drivers criticise a track for being lame it speaks for itself. Valencia has been on the calendar since 2008 and has only produced one decent race. I doubt many will be upset to see it go to sharing races with Barcelona, or even if it disappears off the calendar entirely.

Plenty better tracks are missing off the calendar...

No, I'm perhaps being too harsh. It is just such a bland venue. Flat, slow with way too many corners, few passing places, nothing that is really that challenging on cars or drivers. Without a doubt cars look more spectacular on some tracks than others...this isn't one of those tracks.

[Massa 0]

We'll just have to disagree. Just about everything you see in the track, I see the opposite, so I'll just assume I was swayed by this race being in high definition whereas most aren't and somehow that made everything more pleasant to the point I said it was the track.

(But seriously, I'm not calling this the greatest track of our time, just one that is way too underrated. There's merit in having one track that has a lot of corners. Corners in succession lead to battles/crossovers/counter-attacks, whereas corner-straight corner-straight leads to overtake and fly away. Not exclusively in either case, but at Valencia, if, big if, you could get alongside, you could stay there a while and that was fun to see in one round of the championship, I thought...I'll stop repeating myself and just accept that no matter what I say, the race's future is what FOM decides it will be whether I want it there or not).

[AleHop 0]

That's more to do with how f*cked the Spanish economy is more than anything, but I guess it is not hard to make an F1 race look busy if there's only 45,000 seats...

It has a lot to do with the economical situation in Spain but under such circumstances people realise they're not going to pay for a ticket if they aren't going to enjoy the show. Even more if the race of our national hero has been screwed up most of the times by external factors there.

If you're attending a GP in Spain, people prefered Barcelona or going abroad even if it means breaking the bank. I'm sure this race has changed that point of view because a track is as good as its last race too so a Valencia GP in 2013 would probably have more attendance.

[Rainmaster 7]

I found the following interesting,

• Sebastian Vettel's retirement marked the first mechanical failure for Red Bull since the 2010 Korean Grand Prix, when the German's engine gave up. That makes two failures for him in 29 races (not including his tyre deflation in last year's Abu Dhabi race). Vettel's team-mate Mark Webber, by contrast, hasn't retired through mechanical issues since the 2009 Singapore Grand Prix. Vettel’s evident frustration after retiring on Sunday is well justified though, the last four times he has run into mechanical trouble he was leading the race: Valencia 2012, Abu Dhabi 2011, Korea 2010, Australia 2010.
  

So much for the "No.2" curse with Vettel retiring more than Webber. Also, Vettel's stats would be even more ridiculous if not for car failures, which is horrible.

• Mark Webber started from his worst grid position since the 2009 Japanese Grand Prix (19th). Curiously in the race he performed exactly as he had in China last year, gaining the same number of positions in the race. In Shanghai he went from 18th to third and in Valencia from 19th to fourth.
  

Expect Webber to win when he starts 16th.

About the podium and Alonso:

• The top three in Canada created the sixteenth youngest podium in F1 history, with Lewis Hamilton, Romain Grosjean and Sergio Perez averaging 25 years and three months, all three being former GP2 drivers. The following race in Valencia saw the 59th oldest one, with Alonso, Kimi Raikkonen and Schumacher averaging 35 years and eight months. Not one of them raced GP2, as the series did not even exist before they were in F1. The most recent 'older' podium was the 1994 Australian Grand Prix, where Nigel Mansell, Gerhard Berger and Martin Brundle averaged 37 years and three months.
  

• It's the second time that Alonso has raced from outside the top ten to achieve glory, and only the 26th time in 866 Formula 1 world championship events that a driver has managed such a feat (and three of those were Indianapolis oval races).
  

Lottery, or are the cars just closer in performance:

• In 2010 and 2011 the first ten in Q2 were separated, on average, by 1.1s and 1.5s respectively. This year the average has been 0.533s.
  

• In 2010 and 2011 the minimum gap between first and 11th in Q2 was 0.571s (Europe 2010) and 0.977s (Great Britain 2011) – in both instances that's higher than the average gap for 2012 among the first ten. In Valencia we saw the smallest gap for the last three years, both between first and 10th (0.214s) and between first and 11th (0.218s).
  

• The gap between first and 10th in 2012 has never been higher than 0.850s (Australia), while in 2011 it only once went below a second (Great Britain: 0.948s). And, in the last three races of 2012, the average between first and tenth in Q2 was less than four tenths (average 0.373s).
  

This is from an Autosport article by Michele Merlino.