Webber & Fisi Collision

[Jet 0]

I don't think his personality has got anything to do with it.

[Jet 0]

Face it guys, Sato doesn

[Monty 0]

Fellas,

The original thread is about Fisi & Webber's collision. This has turned out to be another Sato bashing thread. Lets reallign our energy and thoughts to the original thread.

[Max Mosley 2]

Surely there's nothing left to say about Webber/Fisi? I'm starting to think MW could become another obsession on here along with anyone British, Sato, JV. Please have mercy on us...

Jet you probably know I disagree with you on Sato. I just don't think someone whose staunchest defenders only claim "warrants another try" should be driving for a team at the top of F1. F1 is a tough business with tough choices to be made: remember his second chance came at the expense of Gilles' son who surely also deserved a fast car finally? I admire your faith in the racing gods but I suspect Honda are the ones pulling the strings in this case on the behalf of the chosen one. Regarding JB I think he had an outstanding rookie season (straight from F3 too but with no F1 testing) and the reason he was saved from a dissappointing second year was Sir Frank's justified faith in him. I just don't think Sato in his two years has got anywhere near the promise that JB showed in his first and occasionally in his second.

[pumpdoc 2]

I look at this as a result of the stupid tire rules as it will result in more crashes of this type and even more of the non racing than what has been so far While I aplaude Renault all of the rule changes have not slowed the cars down it's only made for timid racing and drivers not wanting to risk their tires in a overtaking move lest they have a dust up ala Fisi and Webber..........I can hear the tv sets turning offf in droves.........thanks FIA

[rebbewin 0]

Is this forum full of 10 year old Sato fans? The topic was regarding Webber and fisi's incident. If you guys want to discuss Sato vs the world then post it and discuss the never ending cycle of garbage.

The post should read as this 'SATO VS GOD' Who would win!!!!

The same can be said for BUTTON as well!!!

[Monty 0]

I'm totaly with you Rebbewin. There are a few guys whose purpose is to turn each and every thread in to a sato bashing topic and another bunch take up for sato. I have tried telling them to stick to the topic, but to no avail.

I have been looking at a few other forums where there are some meaningful discussion taking place, and trust me it is so much fun reading those posts. I woudn't surpised if people like you and me who are in to this forum just for the fun part and to exchange ideas, leave this forum soon.

Then all that this forum will have is a bunch of few sato and anti sato fans who can keep going on and on about their stupid ideas.

[nojvnof1 0]

once upon a time, in the totalf1 forum land, every thread would divert to the topic of JV with either him being bashed or praised, now times have changed and it is Sato who is diverting most of the topics in this land, I wonder which driver it will be next, stay tuned!!

[ecapdeville 0]

I look at this as a result of the stupid tire rules as it will result in more crashes of this type and even more of the non racing than what has been so far  

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi Pump! nice to see you again!

[Taku 0]

Taku I think we've learned by now that these ppl will never be fair in their arguments. Like I said previously of the Sato montage, half of the pics or more were of incidents that weren't his fault. I mean anyone could come up with the same amount of pictures of any driver.

The only one left that could change their views is Sato himself, but I suspect that even if he wins a race or two they'll still be hard pressed to give him full credit. (eg. so and so crashed out, failed, special Honda engines ect...) I for one am going to let Sato do the rest of the talking from here on in.

The fact that Sato is the only driver who gets attacked like this tells me the opinions are more personal than intellectual, and as I've learned through my travels such personalities will never change, no matter how hard they get hit over the head.

Back to Fisi/Webber - Again a much worse move when compared to Sato/Barrichello, but those same critics are willing to give Fisi the benefit of the doubt, even argue it was Webber's fault and stewards are idiots despite a clearly slower Fisi locking wheels and sliding a car width worth of space into Webber. Whereas Sato's move was in complete control, no locking, and both stayed in the race afterwards, yet not one of the same ppl were willing to acknowledge Barrichello should have seen him coming. Even Ross Brawn acknowledged Barrichello should have seen it and called Sato's attempt a great move, but I'm sure the critics know better than Brawn.

Fact is these are racing incidents. These guys are racing 950 bhp airplanes on wheels, and accidents will happen. Sometimes its clearly one's fault, others its simply a result of racing, which is why we watch it. Sure Fisi was more to blame clearly, but it wasn't a blatant punting move, just like Sato's wasn't.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

murray's attacks don't seem too personal, but others definitely seem so. sometimes i wonder if murray is the more reasonable alter-ego of another frequent poster known by a famous f1 name...

well i totally agree with what you've said, however i will continue to defend sato when i believe he is worth defending, but try to do so in a way that doesn't bore the hell out of everyone else who doesn't really care all that much about sato.

for the sake of the posters-at-large, i call for all sato-bashers to refrain from unnecessary ridiculing of sato, as i always feel obliged to respond. more than half the time it really isn't necessary and attacking him gratuitously only invites passionate, yet intelligent responses from the likes of jet, sato and myself. funny swipes here and there are ok, but don't go throwing his name in the mud for no reason. we all know how you feel, there's no need to keep telling the world at every single opportunity. there are more interesting and pressing issues in f1 to discuss on a regular basis rather than whether sato deserves his seat in f1!

[Taku 0]

Is this forum full of 10 year old Sato fans? The topic was regarding Webber and fisi's incident. If you guys want to discuss Sato vs the world then post it and discuss the never ending cycle of garbage.

The post should read as this 'SATO VS GOD' Who would win!!!!

The same can be said for BUTTON as well!!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i only read your post after i posted the above! i had the feeling you all must be getting tired of this. but you should realise it is always started by sato-bashers. personally, i never go out saying "sato is great" or "sato akhbar!"[hey i like that actually ]. it's others who hijack. i merely come to his defence.

[Taku 0]

I'm totaly with you Rebbewin. There are a few guys whose purpose is to turn each and every thread in to a sato bashing topic and another bunch take up for sato. I have tried telling them to stick to the topic, but to no avail.

I have been looking at a few other forums where there are some meaningful discussion taking place, and trust me it is so much fun reading those posts. I woudn't surpised if people like you and me who are in to this forum just for the fun part and to exchange ideas, leave this forum soon.

Then all that this forum will have is a bunch of few sato and anti sato fans who can keep going on and on about their stupid ideas.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

no one's making you stay dude. we are all free to come and go if we don't like they way things are, no need to make threats.

but yes, i agree it is getting out of hand. especially since the guy had flu and didn't even race!

[Monty 0]

no one's making you stay dude.  we are all free to come and go if we don't like they way things are, no need to make threats.

but yes, i agree it is getting out of hand.  especially since the guy had flu and didn't even race!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So taku, you are completely for the idea for guys who hijacks each and ever thread that is posted here, and turn and that in to a meaningless sata bashing session. And guys like me who expect to exchange ideas about the original thread have to go with this flow....

Is that what you are saying?

[Sato 0]

did you even read his post before that one?

[Monty 0]

If you read my post, I didn't accuse you guys for taking up for Sato. I said that there were a bunch who turn every thread in to a sato bashing session, and others come for his rescue.

And this remains the fact.

[Sato 0]

im talking about where he was talking about noone should be doing it and asking that they hold them selves back..... the bit where he agreed with what you were saying.....

[Monty 0]

I didn't get your point.

[Taku 0]

everyone's so touchy lately. monty, like sato said, i agree with you. and no i don't think everyone should go with the endless sato-bashing hijack flow.. quite the opposite. come on mate just read what i posted it can't be that hard to understand..

[Jem of the Shire 0]

I still find it completely surprising that some people are such devout Sato fans. I wouldn't say he's in f1 ONLY because of his nationality, because once or twice he's actually driven quite a good race, but I do agree that he's not on the level needed to compete at the front of f1. I'm fedup of people defending that move on Barrichello last year, because it is actually inexcusable. Most will agree that Davidson should be in the race seat, not Sato, and the reason is just that joke of an engine manufacturer, Honda. Am now wishing JB went to williams

[Monty 0]

everyone's so touchy lately.  monty, like sato said, i agree with you.  and no i don't think everyone should go with the endless sato-bashing hijack flow..  quite the opposite.  come on mate just read what i posted it can't be that hard to understand..

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dude I'm with you. It is just that it is so frustrating, that every thread has to end up about Sato this Sato that etc, and we get sidetracked so easily. Ever since I joined this forum, I have learnt so much about F1, because most of you guys are quite knowlegable, and for some reason, these days all I'm getting to hear is about Sato and nothing else.

We were talking about Fisi & webber in this forum, and that was my point and everyone were making some very valid points, and all of a sudden we are in a sato bashing thread. Any ways I sincerly hope that Sato wins a race or 2 this year and hopefully we won't see this madness again.

[Senna 0]

I still find it completely surprising that some people are such devout Sato fans. I wouldn't say he's in f1 ONLY because of his nationality, because once or twice he's actually driven quite a good race, but I do agree that he's not on the level needed to compete at the front of f1. I'm fedup of people defending that move on Barrichello last year, because it is actually inexcusable. Most will agree that Davidson should be in the race seat, not Sato, and the reason is just that joke of an engine manufacturer, Honda. Am now wishing JB went to williams

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes. To clarify matters: I have never made any personal attacks on Sato, my comments have been purely objective and performance based and I sympathise with Monty

[Jet 0]

1. I'm fedup of people defending that move on Barrichello last year, because it is actually inexcusable.

2.Most will agree that Davidson should be in the race seat, not Sato, and the reason is just that joke of an engine manufacturer, Honda.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Inexcusable?? Most will agree??? ..........................

People are going to keep bringing up old events like the Barrichello incident and claim their opinion is the only one that is valid. For example Ross Brawn, at the Autosport Show said, "The last few years we have been increasing the size of mirrors and improving the position of mirrors to help the drivers see, but I think sometimes you see what appears to be a stupid manoeuvre from a driver when he drives into another car, but there is a certain blind spot when he doesn't see. I remember I made the comment last year when Takuma Sato and Rubens Barrichello came together. Sato had made a great move up the inside but Rubens simply did not see him and the driver overtaking has to be aware that the driver in front is not going to see him." Ross states this but still the critics are unwilling to even entertain that is was a racing incident. If the critics feel their views take more precedent over those of the actual Ferrari technical director, how will there ever be a reasonable conclusion to these arguments.

I agree this is getting extremely redundant, and as I first said when I joined into this campaign that I never intended to try and convince the anit-Sato squad of what I believe cause it won't happen, just point out flaws in their argument. However, even that I will resist because when you point out a flaw, you're told it's a fact (not everyone, you know who). Then sometimes ppl respond in anger (like Sato beat them in a race in the past or something) with personal attacks and at that point the debate becomes absolutely pointless, which I think is the reason this discussion is getting tiring, and not the fact we're all passionate of our position.

Like I wrote to Taku, I'm gonna leave the rest of the talking to Sato because after all, in the end it is his job to prove the haters wrong and the only person with the ability to actually change our view be it for or against.

[Max Mosley 2]

murray's attacks don't seem too personal, but others definitely seem so.  sometimes i wonder if murray is the more reasonable alter-ego of another frequent poster known by a famous f1 name...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm sorry Senna. I have failed you again. In future I will try to be more offensive and unreasonable... but yes you'd be surprised how often I do feel like a more reasonable version of him!

[Max Mosley 2]

i only read your post after i posted the above!

[Sato 0]

come on girls, lets stop the sato arguing for alil while unless in a thread that started with Sato in some way

and i still say it was Fisi's fault and hope he all the worst this season.