Mario Wanted Jv-kubica Shoot Out

[stopkidding 0]

As a driver that always stood for what he believed in, JV in his first public interview after the fall out between him and BMW has revealed the reasons why he quit

http://www.speedtv.com/articles/auto/formulaone/32305/

As he rightly says, you have have shoot outs between rookie drivers to acess the speed of two rookies. To ask a former WDC to go for a shoot out with a rookie is absurd, either MT gave JV the 2007 or didn't. To keep him in the dark and talk about silly shoot outs shows the arrogance of BMW and MT. I think BMW will pay the price of this for the remaining season and probably next year as JV was a real asset in terms of developing the car.

Sorry folks don't mean to start another JV thread, but this is outrageous behaviour from MT and I don't approve.

WOOHOO I AM AN ESTABLISHED DRIVER NOW! POP THE CHAMPAGNE FOLKS

[Blitzkrieg 0]

Villeneuve also revealed that he hasn't decided on his post-F1 racing plans, but outlined that only Le Mans and NASCAR - especially the latter - would hold appeal to him.

"If I was going to drive [full-time] again, it would have to be NASCAR, that's all. Of course, when you look at the cars they're big and heavy and it's different, but the races look very exciting, and there's a lot of talent in there.

I agree, he has already been disgraced from F1, follow Montoya's footsteps, but I dont know if he would even last there. It would be better if he just followed the music industry.

[stopkidding 0]

I agree, he has already been disgraced from F1, follow Montoya's footsteps, but I dont know if he would even last there. It would be better if he just followed the music industry.

dude, you are misquoting here, i think JV said those words not me....

[narain fan 0]

dude, you are misquoting here, i think JV said those words not me....

Villeneuve said he quit BMW Sauber because he had not wanted to get involved in a 'shoot-out' with Polish test driver Robert Kubica for the 2007 race seat.

"After having been in F1 for 10 years and having won the championship and so on, even though it's quite a few years ago, I wasn't ready to stay home some weekends just to see how the other guy would go and to then be compared to him," he said.

"Not because I was worried that he would go faster or slower, it could happen both ways and that would be life," added the Canadian.

"It's just not something that anybody that's been there and won races would accept basically, that's all.

"I knew that after that I wouldn't be able to give everything I had. It just doesn't feel fair, so I wouldn't be able to train like a maniac and take all the risks that I took racing, basically."

this is the interview ....

and to be fair to Mario this is what he said when JV retired (dumped)

"We fully understand that it is difficult for Jacques to maintain his natural level of commitment in circumstances of UNCERTAINTY. We respect his position and wish him well for the future.”

[cavallino 2]

As a driver that always stood for what he believed in, JV in his first public interview after the fall out between him and BMW has revealed the reasons why he quit

http://www.speedtv.com/articles/auto/formulaone/32305/

As he rightly says, you have have shoot outs between rookie drivers to acess the speed of two rookies. To ask a former WDC to go for a shoot out with a rookie is absurd, either MT gave JV the 2007 or didn't. To keep him in the dark and talk about silly shoot outs shows the arrogance of BMW and MT. I think BMW will pay the price of this for the remaining season and probably next year as JV was a real asset in terms of developing the car.

Sorry folks don't mean to start another JV thread, but this is outrageous behaviour from MT and I don't approve.

WOOHOO I AM AN ESTABLISHED DRIVER NOW! POP THE CHAMPAGNE FOLKS

What a prize idiot, throwing his toys out of the pram for that. He could have seen the wind blowing and announced his retirement early this season, and gone out with pride, and BMW would have milked the publicity. Instead he has to go bawling, cursing all and sundry for his own mistakes.

Let me quote from his interview, the part in bold is mine:

[Autumnpuma 0]

The man is one of a few select individuals that are Formula One World Champion. A little respect for that is in order, I think.......

EDIT: I had to fix the 'championship' thing..it was bugging me...

[Ctrl300 0]

The man is one of a few select individuals that are Formula One World Championship. A little respect for that is in order, I think.......

Second that

[stopkidding 0]

I think it is clear now that Mario needs people and drivers that will listen to his way. With Williams he tried to have his way with Sir Frank Williams and they got booted and he tried to have his way with JV and eventually JV quit. Now he has three young drivers who will listen to whatever he tells them to do. F1 drivers are increasingly getting spineless.

[Ctrl300 0]

MT has a very, very old-school managerial philosophy. IMHO this will make it harder for the team to go all the way to the top. Just look at FB in comparison. He gives his employees room to make deceisions themselfs. My philosophy is that if you delegate someone a task or a responsibility you also delegate them the right to make mistakes. MT seems to be the opposite.

I can't stand BMW Sauber F1, and hope they end up becoming another Jaguar.

[stopkidding 0]

MT has a very, very old-school managerial philosophy. IMHO this will make it harder for the team to go all the way to the top. Just look at FB in comparison. He gives his employees room to make deceisions themselfs. My philosophy is that if you delegate someone a task or a responsibility you also delegate them the right to make mistakes. MT seems to be the opposite.

I can't stand BMW Sauber F1, and hope they end up becoming another Jaguar.

I was super excited about this team at the start of the year. For one it was JV's team and second I work for their major sponsor so there was a lot of excitement in the company over this sponsorship. Now I couldn't care less.

You are right about the Old school manaherial philosophy, its ironic how the recent BMW ads seem to be quite contrary to MT's behaviour and actions. Recently a top exec in our company was commenting about how BMW had taken the whole Pit Lane park to be an exclusive BMW promotion event even though Intel coughed up most of the $$ and provided a significant about of the technology experience.

[cavallino 2]

The man is one of a few select individuals that are Formula One World Championship. A little respect for that is in order, I think.......

Respect? For JV?

I've been thinking, is JV the most undeserving World Champion since Rosberg? Who else fits the bill? Hill

He thinks by being a competitive driver 10 years ago he has won some eternal right to not be compared to young upcoming drivers? After being beaten by Button, Massa and Heidfeld?

[Karta 0]

JV ego could not take shoot out? Well, i cant blame MT for asking for that 2007 as JV was not really his choice in first place and RK has not done bad as well. All i can say about 2007 JV arrogance cost him chance to be in F1, 10 years ago won championship wont weigh much seeing what followed it.

Now this mid year replacement i dont like and imo MT should have kept JV.

[Autumnpuma 0]

Respect? For JV?

I've been thinking, is JV the most undeserving World Champion since Rosberg? Who else fits the bill? Hill

He thinks by being a competitive driver 10 years ago he has won some eternal right to not be compared to young upcoming drivers? After being beaten by Button, Massa and Heidfeld?

In my opinon, there are no undeserving World Champions. The game is accumulating points over a season and they all beat out lesser, and greater, men for the crown.

[cavallino 2]

Less deserving then, JV must be one of the least deserving world champions of recent times (or earlier too?, my knowledge of times before that is limited).

[Autumnpuma 0]

Less deserving then, JV must be one of the least deserving world champions of recent times (or earlier too?, my knowledge of times before that is limited).

I see what you're driving at here. JV won the championship in a vastly superior car. By that logic, a certain German also won a few championships in a vastly superior car. Would that German also be less-deserving of a championship? I don't think so. You gather enough points and you win the WDC--it's that simple. Each champion has faced unique challenges* on their way to the pinnacle and each champion deserves the crown they won.

*In JV's case, he battled against his own team owner/chief engineer...Patrick Head. Not many drivers have the mental fortitude to battle Patty, on his own turf, and win.

[Jem of the Shire 0]

Surely this shoot-out would've been during the off-season, so why didnt JV just quit at the end of the year?? I think BMW would've put Kubica in the 07 seat whether he was faster than JV in testing or not

[Schumikonen 2]

I see what you're driving at here. JV won the championship in a vastly superior car. By that logic, a certain German also won a few championships in a vastly superior car. Would that German also be less-deserving of a championship? I don't think so. You gather enough points and you win the WDC--it's that simple. Each champion has faced unique challenges* on their way to the pinnacle and each champion deserves the crown they won.

*In JV's case, he battled against his own team owner/chief engineer...Patrick Head. Not many drivers have the mental fortitude to battle Patty, on his own turf, and win.

That german did something that just a few man have done in F1 and is that he developed that car to the point that it was vastly superior, JV came to a team already in the top with that vastly superior car already winning races and championships, when that german when to Ferrari they were struggling a lot trying to win a championship and that's the difference here, he also he to develop the benneton team's car to take to that point to were he won two WDC with then, he left the team and nobody else could do the same even with the same car, only now that Ferrari had a bad year is when that now Renault won another championship but just because of that Ferrari was out of shape.

[Ctrl300 0]

That german did something that just a few man have done in F1 and is that he developed that car to the point that it was vastly superior, JV came to a team already in the top with that vastly superior car already winning races and championships, when that german when to Ferrari they were struggling a lot trying to win a championship and that's the difference here, he also he to develop the benneton team's car to take to that point to were he won two WDC with then, he left the team and nobody else could do the same even with the same car, only now that Ferrari had a bad year is when that now Renault won another championship but just because of that Ferrari was out of shape.

I have never, ever seen such drivel.

If you are going keep talking about Ferrari, and nothing but Ferrari, could you at least try to keep your feet on the ground instead of constantly treating us to something that is so far from the truth it hurts?

[Argento Reloaded 1]

I agree, he has already been disgraced from F1, follow Montoya's footsteps, but I dont know if he would even last there. It would be better if he just followed the music industry.

By the way, about Schumi

[c21 0]

I can't stand BMW Sauber F1, and hope they end up becoming another Jaguar.

Time out, play nice!

[Fer 0]

Surely this shoot-out would've been during the off-season, so why didnt JV just quit at the end of the year?? I think BMW would've put Kubica in the 07 seat whether he was faster than JV in testing or not

Jemstride,

It's my understanding that the shootout was to begin post-German GP with Kubica driving in Hungary to take a "looksy" at his ability with MT using relative performance to Heidfeld as the yardstick. So Jacques would be in the car for some of the remaining 2006 races and out for some- a situation he deemed to be unacceptable. His performance relative to Heidfeld this season I don't think warranted the shoot out. Most agree JV's performance was at least on par with Heidfeld's, so why not stage a shoot-out between Kubica and Heidfeld? We all know the answer to this- sprechen sie Deutsch anyone? (not sure about the spelling)

[c21 0]

Jemstride,

It's my understanding that the shootout was to begin post-German GP with Kubica driving in Hungary to take a "looksy" at his ability with MT using relative performance to Heidfeld as the yardstick. So Jacques would be in the car for some of the remaining 2006 races and out for some- a situation he deemed to be unacceptable. His performance relative to Heidfeld this season I don't think warranted the shoot out. Most agree JV's performance was at least on par with Heidfeld's, so why not stage a shoot-out between Kubica and Heidfeld? We all know the answer to this- sprechen sie Deutsch anyone? (not sure about the spelling)

Das, und er haben ein lange ziet vertrag mit dem BMW Sauber.

Im still learning too

[Blitzkrieg 0]

dude, you are misquoting here, i think JV said those words not me....

yeah i know?

I have never, ever seen such drivel.

If you are going keep talking about Ferrari, and nothing but Ferrari, could you at least try to keep your feet on the ground instead of constantly treating us to something that is so far from the truth it hurts?

that is infact the truth, like it or not.

[Argento Reloaded 1]

That german did something that just a few man have done in F1 and is that he developed that car to the point that it was vastly superior, JV came to a team already in the top with that vastly superior car already winning races and championships, when that german when to Ferrari they were struggling a lot trying to win a championship and that's the difference here, he also he to develop the benneton team's car to take to that point to were he won two WDC with then, he left the team and nobody else could do the same even with the same car, only now that Ferrari had a bad year is when that now Renault won another championship but just because of that Ferrari was out of shape.

Perhaps, I

[Fer 0]

Das, und er haben ein lange ziet vertrag mit dem BMW Sauber.

Im still learning too

Agreed c21, Heidfeld is holding a long term contract although my point is still relevant. If Heidfeld was comprehesively outperforming Villeneuve that is one thing but to have JV and NH performing at similar levels there is no justification for a shootout against Kubica. If MT paid attention to the BAR situation in 2003 he would know how much Jacques likes shootouts. Remember that Dave Richards was fcuking with JV suggesting a reality show where JV would be in a shootout against young drivers to determine who gets the 2004 BAR race seat alongside Button. So I think MT knew what Jacques reaction would be a priori so the suggestion of a shootout was just a way to get JV to quit. The only way for JV to keep the 2007 seat would be a comprehensive trouncing of NH by JV which did not happen.