226 replies to this topic

[BradSpeedMan]

Insider, on 27 April 2012 - 06:23 AM, said:

I thought Kimi could have won this race. Lotus were a little off the ball.  McLaren have seemingly gone into reverse while Red Bull made a step and Ferrari are all at sea.  While I support the the tyre variables scenario overall, I feel the operating window is far too narrow this year.  It's just a coin toss as too which of the top three teams find the magic window, it seems. The actual car appears to be making little difference which, to my thinking is not what F1 is about.

What exactly is wrong at Mclaren???? How could they go backwards after race 1 when they were so dominant and always the most improved team over a season??? It defies logic!!

If Vettel had their car it would've been 4 wins in a row!!! EDIT: Barring cucumbers on the track of course

Edited by BradSpeedMan, 27 April 2012 - 06:56 AM.

[dribbler]

BradSpeedMan, on 27 April 2012 - 06:38 AM, said:

What exactly is wrong at Mclaren???? How could they go backwards after race 1 when they were so dominant and always the most improved team over a season??? It defies logic!!

If Vettel had their car it would've been 4 wins in a row!!! EDIT: Barring cucumbers on the track of course

With the car performances being so close, I just think the smallest nuances are making big differences in 2012. There's no crisis at Woking, they just didn'r get it spot on in Bahrain. Put into context, if they had a bigger advantage over their rivals, such a slip in optimum set up wouldn't have been so apparent and they may still have won. That's how I read it. It's just going to be crucial that every element involved in a race win will have to be correct. That's why Nico won in China, but was only fifth the following week.

If no clear pattern emerges in Spain, I really do think we have got an incredibly close and unpredicatable season on our hands. Just brilliant!

[LabradoRacer]

BradSpeedMan, on 27 April 2012 - 06:38 AM, said:

If Vettel had their car it would've been 4 wins in a row!!! EDIT: Barring cucumbers on the track of course

Unlikely. Hitting the tires' sweet spot is a lottery this year; there's no way you can hit it 4 times in a row, best car or not.

[freaky2]

I agree that it's quite brilliant, because the odds are that the team that's best at set up and the most adaptable drivers will make the difference, and the car attributes at the start of the season will be evened out by all the variables. That's the closest to a "the person matters more than the machinery" that we're ever going to get.

Now just introduce a rule that drivers are responsible for setting up the car and that's the driver making 100% of the difference

[DPR]

Quote

Now just introduce a rule that drivers are responsible for setting up the car and that's the driver making 100% of the difference

If that were to happen, Vettel would not have won the last one. He was p**sed off that the team forced him to adopt the webber setup.

For me, when any single element of the technical ecosphere is dominating the outcome - I hate it!
I hated it when ground effect was everything, I hated it when active suspension was king. Don't get me wrong - I love innovation, I would rather just have more balanced innovation.
Sure, tyre management is part of it - but not ALL of it. Thank god Berger doesn't drive these days, he used to chew up tyres back when they were not made of flubber.

[Caesar]

i just watched bahrain race edit in F1.com, it is funny that they show team radio of Team Lotus where they said to Grosjean :  "Raikkonen is faster than you. Do not hold him up."
really ironic choice of words. but why did they say after the race : "there was no team orders"
so now we have : "Fernando is faster than you"& "Kimi is faster than you", what do you think who is next "faster than you" driver ?

[BradSpeedMan]

Caesar, on 27 April 2012 - 06:39 PM, said:

i just watched bahrain race edit in F1.com, it is funny that they show team radio of Team Lotus where they said to Grosjean :  "Raikkonen is faster than you. Do not hold him up."
really ironic choice of words. but why did they say after the race : "there was no team orders"
so now we have : "Fernando is faster than you"& "Kimi is faster than you", what do you think who is next "faster than you" driver ?

Caesar... Team orders were UNBANNED after the Alonso/Massa fiasco. end off.

How's your brother doing btw, he must be pleased that Kimi is back...

Edited by BradSpeedMan, 27 April 2012 - 07:25 PM.

[Caesar]

BradSpeedMan, on 27 April 2012 - 07:21 PM, said:

Caesar... Team orders were UNBANNED after the Alonso/Massa fiasco. end off.

How's your brother doing btw, he must be pleased that Kimi is back...

teams always used team orders , even when they were banned, i have nothing against Lotus team orders, but i will say it again: if those words came from Alonso, press would eat him alive.
after Malaysia they wrote for a week about Sauber (Ferrari) team order to Perez, after Bahrain they wrote about cryin spaniard who expected from Rosberg to let him go, i will not even mention press conference after 2010 German GP.
english press is biased towards Alonso.
it isn't my brother , it is my cousin. he is very pleased to have Kimi back, and i must say i am happy he is back.
such talent to be wasted is a sin. don't get me wrong , if Alonso doesn't win WDC , i wouldn't mind if Kimi wins it.

[Quiet One]

Darn! I missed that transmission.

Interesting points:

1) The phrase "Do not hold him up" is a clear team order. The phrase "Raikkonen is faster than you" is not. The whole rucus about team orders because of an observation was pointless.

2) Of course, we are not stupid, are we? We KNOW that "X is faster than you" means "Move over, you pile of useless carbon, oxygen, hydrogen, nitrogen and traces of other elements". So if somebody last year dared to make a point like 1) he would anyways be attacked because: "Nurr nurr, Alonso needs team orders to overtake Massa...he is pathetic!".

3) You get the drill

4) Yes, I'm in a ranting mood and need to vent some steam! GRRRRRRRRRRRR
I'll kill ya! I'll kill y'all! Ohhhh...dinner time! Have a nice day!

[Massa]

If I'm a fourth line grinder, and we're in a line change and I somehow have the puck and a first-line marksman is there, you think I'm going to go for glory and shoot it, or you think I'm going to pass it off to him?  Exactly.  Team orders are wonderful because they're efficient.  Efficient things are nice.  Using resources appropriately is nice.  I don't like Romain Grosjean much.

[Rainmaster]

I agree with everything Eric said after "exactly". Everything before that I don't understand. Goujon should have moved out of the way. But Raikkonen's driving was not perfect either (he made a mistake on lap 3) so Vettel's driving was probably more precise on this one and that's part of why KR didn't win, too.

[F1 FANatic]

in the end though lotus did not give kimi the opertunity to even fight for the lead. it is one thing for a driver to mess up. it is another for his team to not do everything it can to help him win.

[Quiet One]

I think they just weren't ready for such a case to show up.

"Emmh...Eric...Eric...ERIC!!!!!"

"Wha...? What??? Some people is trying to play Angry Birds here, you know?  You may think it's easy but it's not! Geez!"

"Listen, remember all our big talk about we being a contender in 2012 and that we have a great car and we are too good for Kimi and later we are so good we even have Kimi, etc.?"

"Yes, of course. Was hard to keep a straight face at press conferences and meetings with sponsors...I mean, nobody noticed the big LADA logotype? I always thought somebody will at least get suspicious!"

"Well, guess what? Romain and Kimi are actually on their way to a probable double podium. A win, maybe, in the hands of Kimi"

"WHAT??? No way!! Let me see that! No, no need of the telemetry monitors, I know I have some app here on my Iphone...let me save my game first...."

"Hurry up! We need to make a decision! Should Romain let Kimi and give a shot for a win? Or stick to a double podium finish?"

*mumbling to himself, not paying attention* "There must be some 'save' option somewhere...and...oh, I should turn off the music player as well...now, let me check the apps...ahhh this was a good one! Hey, wanna check the pic I edited of Norbert Haug with bobbing boobies and...well, actually it wasn't edited at all..."

"Come on! It's now or never!"

"Har har har! Look! See his boobies? Now let me try with Bernie!"

"Too late!"

"Hey look, do you need a light? Har har har! Looks just like a cigarette lighter doesn't it?"

[Caesar]

well, it only means that there is 'litle cheating crying lying monobrowed spaniard' hiding in every driver

[freaky2]

Why not just state that starting now "X is faster than you" is the cue for team orders and whoever doesn't use it gets a penalty? Alonso deserves to be vindicated XD

[Delta]

Forcing a driver to arbitrarily move over for another just so their favourite can take the glory is tacky. Not forcing one to move over when one is clearly faster than the other and has a chance to deliver your first win in 3 1/2 years is stupid. Lotus called it wrong in my opinion.

[dribbler]

1. Hindsight is a wonderful blah.....
2. Kimi should have been more assertive with his move on Seb'.
3. I like chicken goujons.