I Changed The Title For The Mentally Handicapped...

[ykickamoocow 0]

true.... the minister of health Manto is delebrately use by Mbeki as his mouthpiece on the HIV viewpoint, that's why she looks so stupid when she's intelliegently challenged. and Zimbabwe, I don't know why Mbeki is protecting Mugabe this much with his silent policy, but it has something to do with Zimbabwe assisting us in the apartheid days, which is really sad.

Mbeki is an extremely brilliant "external" brand leader for the world, not for the inhabitants of his country.

Im not exactly certain why Mbeki is or his views but i really do think somebody should do something about Mugabe as he is a brutel dictator who really should be removed from power. Zimbabwe has the highest inflation rate in the world and that is completely Mugabe's fault.

[BradSpeedMan 6]

Im not exactly certain why Mbeki is or his views but i really do think somebody should do something about Mugabe as he is a brutel dictator who really should be removed from power. Zimbabwe has the highest inflation rate in the world and that is completely Mugabe's fault.

not only should he be removed from power, he should be shot or something!

[Max Mosley 2]

true.... the minister of health Manto is delibrately use by Mbeki as his mouthpiece on the HIV viewpoint, that's why she looks so stupid when she's intelligently challenged. and Zimbabwe, I don't know why Mbeki is protecting Mugabe this much with his silent policy, but it has something to do with Zimbabwe assisting us in the apartheid days, which is really sad.

Mbeki is an extremely brilliant "external" brand leader for the world, not for the inhabitants of his country.

I didn't know about Zimbabwe helping SA out - it's interesting. All the other African countries seem to support Mugabe too. It's leading to a humanitarian catastrophe as you know probably better than I do. SA should be the natural leader in that part of the world and it's very sad that Mbeki doesn't take a sensible view on Zimbabwe or AIDS. Partly the UK is to blame as well in Zimbabwe, as we didn't stick to agreed targets for land ownership 20 years ago, I believe.

Don't you think the best thing for South African democracy would be for a credible opposition to emerge? Basically no one is holding Mbeki to account so he can do what he likes. It's not all that different to a dictatorship. In Britain, even if we liked the ruling party, we would never allow one party to be so dominant. People here vote tactically, meaning we often vote for parties we don't agree with, in order to produce a better outcome overall. Don't you think this would be a good next step in SA's democratic journey?

[ykickamoocow 0]

not only should he be removed from power, he should be shot or something!

I know alot of people will disagree with me but i truly believe that Mugabe should be removed from power with military force involving countries such as South Africa, England, Australia, New Zealand and even Canada. Really Zimbabwe is a commenwealth countries problem and should be solved using commenwealth countries. It wouldnt be like going into Iraq as from what i have heard the population of Zimbabwe hate Mugabe as much as we do so it would only be a matter of going in, disarming Zimbabwe's military and calling free elections.

[BradSpeedMan 6]

I didn't know about Zimbabwe helping SA out - it's interesting. All the other African countries seem to support Mugabe too. It's leading to a humanitarian catastrophe as you know probably better than I do. SA should be the natural leader in that part of the world and it's very sad that Mbeki doesn't take a sensible view on Zimbabwe or AIDS. Partly the UK is to blame as well in Zimbabwe, as we didn't stick to agreed targets for land ownership 20 years ago, I believe.

Don't you think the best thing for South African democracy would be for a credible opposition to emerge? Basically no one is holding Mbeki to account so he can do what he likes. It's not all that different to a dictatorship. In Britain, even if we liked the ruling party, we would never allow one party to be so dominant. People here vote tactically, meaning we often vote for parties we don't agree with, in order to produce a better outcome overall. Don't you think this would be a good next step in SA's democratic journey?

well, I don't agree with the way they were evicted.....

Believe me, Mbeki is under a lot of pressure. Not only from opposition parties but his own. He has been sacking ministers without reasons, the press is really hard on him. He can't seem to solve the country's internal problems. That snake Zuma has quite a large following, he's for the people, a more internal brand leader, I really hope he does'nt become president. It would be nice to see more opposition parties, or rather stronger opposition parties, but the ANC have a really firm grip on governance, except the Cape, which they don't rule. The trend lately is that opposition heads change parties, bribed or promised huge incentives. The masses support the ANC, thats the problem, their views and perception need to change, and if the ANC keep on with their non-deliveries, eventually it will...

[Max Mosley 2]

Yeah. An interesting thing has happened in the UK over the last 50 years. In 1950 only 10% of voters voted for any party other than the two main ones here (the Conservative and Labour parties), whereas in 2005 over 30% did. Personally, I think ordinary people generally become less loyal to one party as they become better educated on average. No doubt this will eventually happen in SA, but I hope it happens soon, because there are so many problems that can't be sorted out until then.

[BradSpeedMan 6]

Yeah. An interesting thing has happened in the UK over the last 50 years. In 1950 only 10% of voters voted for any party other than the two main ones here (the Conservative and Labour parties), whereas in 2005 over 30% did. Personally, I think ordinary people generally become less loyal to one party as they become better educated on average. No doubt this will eventually happen in SA, but I hope it happens soon, because there are so many problems that can't be sorted out until then.

EXACTLY! This post sums up 100% of what I feel should happen Mr Murray Walker!!!!!!!!!

[Jem of the Shire 0]

If this is so, why is the FIA continuing with the plan to put an FIA official in the McLaren pits? Certainly if the Spanish motorsports whatever is satisfied, then the FIA should be as well, no?

This reveals the true reason for the FIA official in the McLaren pits. Mosley is playing a game of perception...he's trying, at every opportunity, to erode McLaren's already shaky reputation. These are not the actions of an unbiased governing body. Pathetic.

I agree. And what's more, is it actually against the rules for a team to give preferential treatment to 1 driver? Didnt Ferrari do that for about 10 years, making no secret of it? And what is this scrutineer actually going to do? He/she cant be everywhere at once in the McLaren motorhome & garage. If McLaren wanted to sabotage Alonso's performance they could easily do that, in hundreds of different ways. A scrutineer isnt going to stop that!

This is just the latest on the list of ridiculous FIA decisions. Another thing to think about: can you imagine FIA doing this with Ferrari? I can't.

As for the race issue - best if we all just drop it, otherwise this thread will go on 25 pages and never get resolved, its too big an issue!

[ykickamoocow 0]

As for the race issue - best if we all just drop it, otherwise this thread will go on 25 pages and never get resolved, its too big an issue!

Not true. There is no issue to big for this forum. Later we plan to solve the middle east situation and if we have time we may try and figure out the origins of the universe

[Max Mosley 2]

Ah but don't you think the biggest question of all remains, ykickamoocow?

[pabloh20 1]

Ah but don't you think the biggest question of all remains, ykickamoocow?

Is DC's chin in 2 different time zones?

[BradSpeedMan 6]

Is DC's chin in 2 different time zones?

[LabradoRacer 2]

As for the race issue - best if we all just drop it, otherwise this thread will go on 25 pages and never get resolved, its too big an issue!

We've had 16 races this year. Not one of the threads went anywhere near 25.

[ykickamoocow 0]

We've had 16 races this year. Not one of the threads went anywhere near 25.

He is talking about race as in white and black people not race as in car race.

[Rainmaster 7]

Perhaps everyone should simply agree that everyone is different for many reasons, but deserve to be treated equally, and that sadly, this is not the case.

Just my opinion.

[LabradoRacer 2]

He is talking about race as in white and black people not race as in car race.

Ykick, I was kidding!

[Fed up 0]

I find it annoying that you say this. If anyone said "black people used to be stupid and crude" it would be unacceptable, but I think there is just as much justification to say it. Also it is perfectly possible that there are genetic differences between the races that go beyond skin tone. It just isn't PC to say it.

What justification is that then

[Max Mosley 2]

Well black people have done a lot of stupid things too, about as many and as stupid things as white people have.

[Autumnpuma 0]

I don't know about South Africa, but Kael says that my views are nonsense simply because I'm white (nothing to do with South Africa). I find that reverse racism very annoying and offensive.

In Britain and the US, black people don't yet do as well as white people. Black people don't have the same chances in life in Britain and the US, so we simply can't say that the innate ability of each race is the same. There has never been a situation where both races have had equal chances. And that is a disgrace that I agree is "the white man's" fault.

In California, we have a great many incentives and financial aids to get minorities into college. They are rarely used. The black and latino cultures, especially in Los Angeles, do not value an education. Some blame for the poor life quality of black and latinos need to be placed on their own shoulders. You can argue that we evil caucasians 'keep them down' but that only goes so far. Nobody gets a free ride and success needs to come from inside each person, irregardless of the hurdles placed in front of you. The best that we can do as a society is to ensure equal opportunities for those people.

Perhaps everyone should simply agree that everyone is different for many reasons, but deserve to be treated equally, and that sadly, this is not the case.

Just my opinion.

I agree.

[Max Mosley 2]

In California, we have a great many incentives and financial aids to get minorities into college. They are rarely used. The black and latino cultures, especially in Los Angeles, do not value an education. Some blame for the poor life quality of black and latinos need to be placed on their own shoulders. You can argue that we evil caucasians 'keep them down' but that only goes so far. Nobody gets a free ride and success needs to come from inside each person, irregardless of the hurdles placed in front of you. The best that we can do as a society is to ensure equal opportunities for those people.

Yup. I completely agree, and black culture has serious problems in the UK too. I'm a huge rap fan: I admire rappers' verbal creativity and straight-talking. But black women (and gay men) do get treated awfully for example. Likewise, I log on to a lot of rap sites and most of the comments are frankly moronic. The posters seem to take pride in how stupidly they can express their opinions. Typical complementary posts read like "niggas tight, dis iz da ill Sh#t, yall sum gay a## fags". When that's how young people praise each other, it's hard to deny they aren't contributing to their own problems.

[dribbler 6]

You can argue that we evil caucasians 'keep them down' but that only goes so far.

Absolutely. What i think is tragic is how most black Africans i meet are either extremely positive, open and realise that it is them that makes the difference or the complete opposite; they feel that the system owes them something and they play the race card. Luckily, the positive ones are the majority, well at least the ones i meet.

In the gym i go to, i reguarly train with two black African guys. We have a hoot and often make far too much noise. They call me honky and i always complain about the advantage they have over me because they only have to look at the weights to get big, it's f*cking great. I know for a fact that there are white English meat heads who sneer at me and it's not because of the the laughter.

[Fed up 0]

In California, we have a great many incentives and financial aids to get minorities into college. They are rarely used. The black and latino cultures, especially in Los Angeles, do not value an education. Some blame for the poor life quality of black and latinos need to be placed on their own shoulders. You can argue that we evil caucasians 'keep them down' but that only goes so far. Nobody gets a free ride and success needs to come from inside each person, irregardless of the hurdles placed in front of you. The best that we can do as a society is to ensure equal opportunities for those people.

I agree.

Mike, can you see what I was trying to say many posts above - This thread, although not intentioned, has degenerated into a 'race' thread - Murray, previously one of the better posters on here, has slipped his mask to reveal one that thinks black people (per se)

Well black people have done a lot of stupid things too, about as many and as stupid things as white people have.'

Race is one of those issues that always brings the worse out of some people.

[dribbler 6]

Mike, can you see what I was trying to say many posts above - This thread, although not intentioned, has degenerated into a 'race' thread - Murray, previously one of the better posters on here, has slipped his mask to reveal one that thinks black people (per se)

Well black people have done a lot of stupid things too, about as many and as stupid things as white people have.'

Race is one of those issues that always brings the worse out of some people.

Ouch. You need to read a little deeper i fear, my friend. Graham is making an astute and intelligent observation, not a racist remark.

[Autumnpuma 0]

Hm. Murray's quote sounded pretty accurate to me. To say otherwise is to say black people have done no wrong. That is ridiculous.

[Fed up 0]

Hm. Murray's quote sounded pretty accurate to me. To say otherwise is to say black people have done no wrong. That is ridiculous.

It can never be accurate because it is a sweeping statement