Good Old Aunty Beeb (Not)

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

Maybe I shouldn't have used the word 'martyr' as it sounds unnecessarily harsh & critical.

Didn't take it personally!

The only 'justification' I've is that the numerous complaints here sounded straight out of a "First World Problem" meme.

No. Not really. I've watched F1 for 38 years without having to pay.

I've paid for TV before and can afford to do so.

I'm not looking for sympathy. I just want to vent my anger that Bernie yet again is screwing the punters for money.

If I want to go see the race, the cost for a normal ticket is £334 for the weekend. That's one person for one race. 2 people with travel, food, lodging - well over £1,000. I have a holiday booked for a week in the Mediterranean in April and it is costing me half that for two people for a week.

Or I can watch every race by spending £500 on Sky.

What has gone wrong with F1 that it has got to this? Its a rich man's game now - not to take part, but to watch. Who do we, as fans just let them get away with it?

I like F1 but not going to watch it at any price....

[JHS18 0]

Hmmm, James, you're placing too much importance in the British market for F1. The viewing figures are surely a small fraction of the world viewing figures, and Silverstone is going to be packed anyways... At most you might find one or two anti-SKY banners. And well... SKY already paid for the deal, so who exactly is going to be concerned? Not Bernie, I'm sure.

Maybe so, but I just find it amazing the disregard shown by F1 to fans, not just in the UK, but around the world.

I mean, it seems whenever a decision is made in F1 it upsets one fan base. Maybe it is impossible to please everyone at the same time - but when I look at how other forms of racing manage themselves compared to F1, it makes you realise most the time they don't listen to the fans and they don't really care what the fans think.

Okay, the fans don't own the sport, but we spend money buying merchandise, we give up time to watch races, some of us even spend eye-watering amounts of money to get to races live, and all to effectively keep them in business, because again without the fans, there is no F1.

But seemingly they hardly take any notice of the fans. Okay, they invented DRS, but that was only after years and years of people complaining that there wasn't enough overtaking.

I've defended F1 again and again in debates with friends over the years - yet with this I can really understand how F1 can be considered just a rich toff's sport.

If for once they listened to the fans on some issues, some of my prejudices would be wrong.

Didn't take it personally!

No. Not really. I've watched F1 for 38 years without having to pay.

I've paid for TV before and can afford to do so.

I'm not looking for sympathy. I just want to vent my anger that Bernie yet again is screwing the punters for money.

If I want to go see the race, the cost for a normal ticket is £334 for the weekend. That's one person for one race. 2 people with travel, food, lodging - well over £1,000. I have a holiday booked for a week in the Mediterranean in April and it is costing me half that for two people for a week.

Or I can watch every race by spending £500 on Sky.

What has gone wrong with F1 that it has got to this? Its a rich man's game now - not to take part, but to watch. Who do we, as fans just let them get away with it?

I like F1 but not going to watch it at any price....

Again - very well said. Can't add too much more to that.

For too long F1 has just assumed fans will stick by it, but rest assured, viewing figures will be down this year in the UK.

[Massa 0]

But that's the problem, isn't it?

The fans say it bothers them, but:

Do they stop attending races? Do they stop watching races, even the ones live on BBC? Do they stop posting images of cars on forums, giving bonus advertising to the sponsors? Do they stop talking about F1 with co-workers, peers, friends, family, etc.? Do they stop visiting F1-related websites? Do they take down anything F1-related in their homes that may pique the curiosity of a visitor?

F1 will "listen" to the fans when the fans are speaking. But they aren't speaking. Talking isn't speaking. Doing is speaking. If you want to take a stand, you have to really, really, really do a lot to take one, it goes beyond just not subscribing.

I just find an irony in calling out the sport so much as being so awfully run and treating fans so poorly, yet then being sad that you can't see it. Why would you want live, free-to-air coverage of something you don't enjoy or won't miss or is somehow mistreating you?

Now, I personally like F1, I am satisfied with how it is run. I'll be at the American Grand Prix at Port Imperial in June 2013, no matter what the ticket costs, I am there, mostly to meet up with some friends, but still, I am voting with my money that I am pleased.

Just not subscribing to Sky and saying "this makes me angry" isn't going to change the way F1 operates. After all, if they don't even need to show you the races to get you to help F1 by all the little things we do to advertise and support the sport, knowingly or not, well, what have they lost? They still get the revenue from Sky and they still get all the little services we do for F1 by talking about it, posting it, buying things, watching the races we do/can watch, etc.

Worst-case, viewing figures devalue certain U.K.-focused sponsorships and someone on some team gets laid off while the targets of your anger go unscathed. Best-case, viewing figures decline and nothing changes because there's a whole lot more to being a sponsor than put logo on car, get people to watch, people see it, people buy it. Super best-case, highlights packages at the right time appeal to a whole new demographic of fans and viewing figures either increase or represent a more attractive group of people for sponsors and this TV deal propels the sport to ultimate glory.

I'll give it a rest now...I think I've done my opinion on all this to absolute death and I just want to get back to the racing so I'm going to do do that...but if this starts seeping into other threads (i.e. race threads for the ones on Sky or whatever)...

...there is absolutely nothing I can or will do about it...

...but know that I won't be nice about it.

[Massa 0]

Anyway, a final thing...

This might be a good place for people to voice if they will be looking for streams for this year. Then you can all make a group PM together and share resources.

[Quiet One 15]

When I read these kind of things I get so tempted to voice my opinion on piracy and IP, but, regretfuly, it would get me promptly banned everywhere

[yurp 0]

When I read these kind of things I get so tempted to voice my opinion on piracy and IP, but, regretfuly, it would get me promptly banned everywhere

me too!

as someone who used to write a lot of digital music the whole music 'industry' sucks balls. power in the hands of a greedy few is always a bad thing,

a quick word on the bbc...

as someone who spent my formative years in Britain and now 10 years in China I can see both sides of the arguments above.

often times it isn't really appreciated how lucky the UK is to have such an amazingly productive, instructive and high quality institution. I was bought up on David Attenborough's wildlife documentries / bbc science programming / bbc news / blue peter etc etc.

for those in other countries (like China / US) where ad based TV rules supreme, it's hard to fathom why people in the UK feel they deserve F1 for free, without ads (or at least for the small TV licence cost). but actually I think everyone, the world over should be demanding more services like the bbc. it's not entirely impartial (impartiality is always subjective and therefore an oxymoron to a certain extent), but the bbc does pretty well at providing facts rather than opinion (masquerading as fact) when it comes to news - that is an undervalued but extremely important distinction.

it's sad that the bbc is being dismantled (much like the NHS and state education system) in the UK by people supporting the premise that business can always do things better because the money making model benefits them and their friends. I keep hearing 'why should you get things for free?' or 'why should our taxes pay for your TV entertainment' - bulls##t. the bbc makes money from selling top-notch programming to other countries and yes it does get some taxes/tv license money, but the service it provides is unmatched by any similar body the world over. the spurious argument that the bbc should be swept aside in favour of channels that 'pay their own way' is always put forward by people with vested interests in supporting the world view of the murdochs of the world - i.e. that if you support our take over of tv/press etc etc, we will support you politically with our new found (and powerfully corrupting) voice.

here we're talking about F1. 10 years ago it was the loss of premiership football. once the dust settles we'll have an even more poorly funded bbc without the means to produce high quality programming of the past and a bunch of very rich, politically manipulative b#####ds pushing their own agendas across the globe and a whole Sh#tload of crappy channels that are bundled in with the two or three we might actually like to watch. I'm waiting for FOX to start a kids channel where they teach children the evils of socialism and the utopia of a greedy society using puppets.

the bbc and it's remit should be defended to the hilt. unfortunately that will never happen. why? firstly - because we brits have been far to guilty of taking it for granted for far too long - we have ourselves to blame for that. secondly - because each time a little more is eroded, the powers that be hide behind 'necessity in today's market'. and each time the defenders of intellectual honesty accept 'just a little bit more', because hey it's only a little bit. those little bits add up though. it's the long term game plan that satellite providers can afford to play - a little bit at a time until their money allows them to encroach enough that the bbc ends up an emptied out carcass filled with eastenders and neighbours.

but still - as someone who was fortunate enough to benefit from the BBC as a youth, I count myself extremely lucky and I can understand why Eric et al are saying what they are. Brits shouldn't take what the bbc provides as a god-given right and cry when they loose it. if you want great programming, F1, etc etc, then appreciate that you've been extremely lucky to have it for free all these years. at the same time, fight for the right to keep it that way. don't pay for sky. **** sky.

don't ban me please

i already posted my predictions/hopes for the season above. EDIT in the predictions thread.

[HandyNZL 1]

I stopped reading at post 40-something when Jimmy was saying that us others just don't understand (or was that the Fresh Prince)....Jimmy buddy....F1 was hardly ever shown here, or was shown as a 1-hour highlight THREE weeks after the fact, then it showed select races live on free-to-air, like Monaco, Spa etc, and the rest just as highlight packages, then Sky was started here in NZ and they broadcast all races live, so us fans signed on to Sky, and as a bonus, we got lots of other sport and access to a much broader range of motorsport, American sports, movies, Discovery channel etc etc etc....then free-to-air got the rights back again, and the screened every race, but not all of them live, because, sometimes screening a six year old movie was more important than a live sporting event, even one that was on a midnight on a Sunday NZ time.

Then Sky got the rights again, and I subscribed for myself (the first time around was on the parent's dime)...the first season saw every race screened live. The next season we got every qualification and every race live. The third season, and every season since, we have had all practice sessions live, as well as qualification and the race, plus a replay during the week.

From where I am standing, Sky is not the baddy. Free-to-air was holding us to ransom.

I pay for a service, and I get it, and it cost's not much every week, and F1 is not the only thing I watch on Sky, as it would be for anyone in the UK if they bought a subscription.

Rant, out...peace and love and hugs not drugs

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

<sigh>

You guys still don't get where I'm coming from. You're right Adam, I know we are lucky with the BBC and coverage we have had so far, and I can feel much of sentiment. Its either:

"Stop bloody grumbling, we get a crappy F1 tv programme late at night, sandwiched in between 40 adverts and you are whingeing about losing the BBC's coverage??" OR

"Just pay the money and shut up"

You see, this is entirely my point. F1 should not be in either of these places. Why are we as fans putting up with Sh#t coverage? or having to pay a premium? It shouldn't be this way.

Bernie's out of touch with reality. In these cost-conscious times, who can really afford £1,000 to go and watch the sport for a weekend; and is the average fan happy/able to pay the subscriptions?

And Eric - you're also right fans should vote with their feet. I think many will. I stopped watching the 2010 season because it was boring and because I was sick of all the politics and crap going on. The funny thing was I did not miss it. And yes, Eric I stopped doing all the things you mention. F1 disappeared from my life. Completely. I gave it another chance in 2011 to see if it had improved.

So my choice is: watch half the races (what's the point?) pay £500 to watch on Sky (Hell no) or download/stream illegally (which I don't want to do either). So I'll probably just do what I did in 2010.

Which is sad.

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

If you aren't happier about not giving Murdoch money than you would be if you had and were watching F1, then you made the wrong choice. If you are happier, you made the right choice, and should feel good about what you've done. Yes? No? Possibly?

Not really. I'm happy not to give Murdoch one penny of my income. I'm unhappy that he has such a monopoly and that Bernie from one billionaire to another has just handed him a further slice of monopoly.

And the other thing, Adam. Remember the BBC is not free. Every person owning a TV pays a license fee. Public money funds the BBC.

It also annoys me that the BBC bid for the rights then a few years into a long-term contract, went "oops, can't afford it any more". If I ran my job like that I would be fired.....

[HandyNZL 1]

As a matter of interest, what is the licence fee?

[yurp 0]

And the other thing, Adam. Remember the BBC is not free. Every person owning a TV pays a license fee. Public money funds the BBC.

Actually I did write that in my post.

It also annoys me that the BBC bid for the rights then a few years into a long-term contract, went "oops, can't afford it any more". If I ran my job like that I would be fired.....

And yes - that is poor form.

[freaky2 1]

Just one more thing: in Spain a similar situation happened recently when MotoGP had to be cut from the publicly funded TVE's programme. They had been doing a great and exhaustive job for years but when the crisis struck it turned out that they did not meet their planned budget because it was so expensive to follow all the races and send their great crew around the world. So sadly they said goodbye. I don't know when it was decided which channel would have the rights for 2012, but that doesn't matter. What I mean to say is that maybe taxpayer's money isn't enough for everything the BBC want to do, and maybe it is better to let taxpayers keep it rather than investing it in high quality F1 broadcasting. (And with keep it I obviously mean having it invested in something that creates jobs or the like).

On all the concerns about F1 not caring about the fans, well, I have to agree. I just don't feel that F1 has ever cared about me, so it doesn't quite fit into my equation. Rather, as Eric says, if I care about F1 I will watch, if I stop caring I just stop. For other people (and your stand is very legitimate, Chris) it is obviously very different. In the end everyone is free to make their own decision and we will see how it turns out.

[Senna's Ghost 0]

I don't think the BBC will do a bad job with just showing the highlights of half the races. Anyone who has experienced the BBC sports coverage will know that they put out a very good product on any sport and I'm sure they capture and cover all aspects in the races they will be showing as highlights without much loss of context or feel for the race. I understand that the highlights will be an hour long, maybe more. Indeed, if some of the races turn out to be borefests then an hour is perhaps as much as anyone will be able to stomach. My original posting, back on page one, was trying to put across how F1 used to be covered by the BBC back in the 80's. We used to get some full, live races but often the races were ruined by crossing over to other sports happening live at the time; F1 was not a priority sport, it was much lower down the pecking order than Sunday cricket and snooker. I think that we a can confident that it's appreciated more now and will be given treatment that we all think it deserves. As for the live races I am sure that the BBC will continue to cover these as well as they have over these last few years. They've got Ben Edwards as lead commentator and he is someone I like to hear. He's knowledgable, intelligent and enthusiastic, good choice. David Coulthard is his co-commentator. DC has really impressed me with his wit and wisdom. I like him more as a commentator than I did as a driver.

It will be interesting to see how SKY does over the season in respect of new viewers/subscribers to their F1 channel. The trouble is that SKY does not operate to a normal business model. Murdoch is prepared to run a loss leader for years in order to see of a competitor or rival. I hope F1 proves too costly for him, but I doubt it. From the huge advertising campaign that I've witnessed they are really pushing it. But how many people are going to fork out £30 per month for the SKY package that includes F1 in HD. If many of us on this forum who are huge, longstanding fans of F1 are saying it's a bridge too far (to use the bridge metaphor again) then the average SKY punter is either not going to upgrade their package, or if they are already entitled to the service beacuse of their existing subscription fees, not going to bother to tune in. Overall result not many people watching via SKY.

The SKY F1 team is a mixed bag. David Croft as lead commentator. He's good but his knowledge isn't that deep, probably only 10-15 years. Example; he once asked Mike Gascoyne what his favourite F1 car design was and Gascoyne replied that it was the Lotus 88. Crofty didn't have a clue and thought that was the Lotus of 1988. This might seem a bit picky on my part but Murray Walker would know instantly what Gascoyne was refering to. Brundle is a great co-commentator. Ted Kravitz thinks he should be employed by one of the teams as a strategist, I won't miss him at all, far too smug for my liking. Natalie Pinkham knows next to flat nothing about F1 and the same applies to the other bit of eye candy they've got. The main presenter could pass me in the street and I wouldn't know who he is.

I'm not too disappointed in only being able to watch 50% of the races live. It could have been worse, I've got my fingers crossed that in a few years F1 will return to a free to air service and not go the whole hog and disappear to SKY forever.

[JHS18 0]

But that's the problem, isn't it?

The fans say it bothers them, but:

Do they stop attending races? Do they stop watching races, even the ones live on BBC? Do they stop posting images of cars on forums, giving bonus advertising to the sponsors? Do they stop talking about F1 with co-workers, peers, friends, family, etc.? Do they stop visiting F1-related websites? Do they take down anything F1-related in their homes that may pique the curiosity of a visitor?

F1 will "listen" to the fans when the fans are speaking. But they aren't speaking. Talking isn't speaking. Doing is speaking. If you want to take a stand, you have to really, really, really do a lot to take one, it goes beyond just not subscribing.

I just find an irony in calling out the sport so much as being so awfully run and treating fans so poorly, yet then being sad that you can't see it. Why would you want live, free-to-air coverage of something you don't enjoy or won't miss or is somehow mistreating you?

Now, I personally like F1, I am satisfied with how it is run. I'll be at the American Grand Prix at Port Imperial in June 2013, no matter what the ticket costs, I am there, mostly to meet up with some friends, but still, I am voting with my money that I am pleased.

Just not subscribing to Sky and saying "this makes me angry" isn't going to change the way F1 operates. After all, if they don't even need to show you the races to get you to help F1 by all the little things we do to advertise and support the sport, knowingly or not, well, what have they lost? They still get the revenue from Sky and they still get all the little services we do for F1 by talking about it, posting it, buying things, watching the races we do/can watch, etc.

Worst-case, viewing figures devalue certain U.K.-focused sponsorships and someone on some team gets laid off while the targets of your anger go unscathed. Best-case, viewing figures decline and nothing changes because there's a whole lot more to being a sponsor than put logo on car, get people to watch, people see it, people buy it. Super best-case, highlights packages at the right time appeal to a whole new demographic of fans and viewing figures either increase or represent a more attractive group of people for sponsors and this TV deal propels the sport to ultimate glory.

I'll give it a rest now...I think I've done my opinion on all this to absolute death and I just want to get back to the racing so I'm going to do do that...but if this starts seeping into other threads (i.e. race threads for the ones on Sky or whatever)...

...there is absolutely nothing I can or will do about it...

...but know that I won't be nice about it.

So basically, you're saying you are completely happy to be ripped off?

Yes, it is our decision to watch Formula One - and I think if you go way back to when the announcement was made, and all the subsequent fall out I think it is clear that people WILL vote with their feet. For sure it is clear to me, as a British resident, that this will not do the sport any good at all.

As already stated, F1 is now an expensive sport to watch and go to. I guess they really haven't heard of the term "value for money" in Formula One. For years they seem to have had the bizarre attitude that "the less they see, the more they'll pay to see."

Look - it's not as if British fans have had F1 completely, completely free since 2009 - you have to pay the license fee to get BBC, which for some, is not an insubstantial amount of money in itself.

But let's look at it this way. Sky has something like over 2 million subscribers. The whole British population has access to the BBC, because it is a legal requirement to pay the license fee. Programmes that cost two pound and two pence to make on the BBC get around the same viewing figures as live football on Sky.

It is if you see F1 as this invincible thing that will never be impacted by anything. But is it any wonder when ticket prices for Formula One are so high that for a lot of tracks the sport visits have crap track side attendences? It's not bleeding rocket science when F1 offers such bad value for money.

F1 has priced many out of going to races, and the same is happening for watching it on TV. If you're happy with that, great.

Let me give you a small example. In 2009 and 2010 I went to the British Grand Prix, as many of you know. Last year I didn't go, because of it being so expensive and for a few other reasons as well. But I still managed to get to two BTCC rounds at Donington and Silverstone, the World Touring Car Championship at Donington, the Silverstone Classic for two days, and a few smaller events too. All that added up to less than it'd take to go to a GP for three days like I had in the past two years. Is it any wonder something like the BTCC is seeing a big surge in crowds present at the track and F1 continues to complain about how poor some of its attendences are? I think not.

I don't hate F1 at all. F1 has been a big part of my life and will continue to be so. But, as is evident with this forum and plenty of others too, British people are frustrated that it has come to this. I, and many others, don't buy Bernie's nonsense that "this was the only option" - it was the only option because Bernie forced it to be the only option. Simple as.

I'm just frustrated with the overly simplistic views non-Brit members have on this too. Okay, I'm not claiming for a second I'm a complete expert on the situation, but reading what I've read and knowing what I know about how the BBC works and some of the stuff that happened - I think a lot of you guys don't see the whole picture. I hope I don't sound big headed saying that, but as you well know, nothing is ever as simple as you are making out.

And again: if it is so frustrating for you guys to hear us complaining, and if it doesn't apply to you, no need to worry. Simply don't post in here then.

I stopped reading at post 40-something when Jimmy was saying that us others just don't understand (or was that the Fresh Prince)....Jimmy buddy....F1 was hardly ever shown here, or was shown as a 1-hour highlight THREE weeks after the fact, then it showed select races live on free-to-air, like Monaco, Spa etc, and the rest just as highlight packages, then Sky was started here in NZ and they broadcast all races live, so us fans signed on to Sky, and as a bonus, we got lots of other sport and access to a much broader range of motorsport, American sports, movies, Discovery channel etc etc etc....then free-to-air got the rights back again, and the screened every race, but not all of them live, because, sometimes screening a six year old movie was more important than a live sporting event, even one that was on a midnight on a Sunday NZ time.

Then Sky got the rights again, and I subscribed for myself (the first time around was on the parent's dime)...the first season saw every race screened live. The next season we got every qualification and every race live. The third season, and every season since, we have had all practice sessions live, as well as qualification and the race, plus a replay during the week.

From where I am standing, Sky is not the baddy. Free-to-air was holding us to ransom.

I pay for a service, and I get it, and it cost's not much every week, and F1 is not the only thing I watch on Sky, as it would be for anyone in the UK if they bought a subscription.

Rant, out...peace and love and hugs not drugs

Look - I'm not bitter at Sky for a second. I'm frustrated, but not bitter. They were looking out for themselves, so great...

I hope I'm not coming across like I sound like a spoilt brat, but I know what you're talking about.

In years gone by, I could watch F3 and the British Rally Championship on BBC Grandstand. I could watch V8 Supercars and NASCAR on Channel 5. One year I remember watching some of Le Mans on ITV's main channel. I used to be able to watch GP2, the British Super Bikes, World Rally Championship, and FIA GTs on channels I could get, without requiring subscription services. I'm not about to start now.

In recent years the only forms of motorsport that have been live on non-subcription channels have been F1 (ITV/BBC) MotoGP (BBC) and BTCC (ITV).

That is why it is frustrating, after all these years of people within F1 saying they wouldn't go to subscription channels, to stick two metaphorical fingers up at fans here for what many believe is a decision that revolves only around money.

It's like the eBay culture. Goes to the highest bidder with no regard as to whether that deal will actually be for the best of the fans. I honestly think you're having a laugh if you can argue with a straight face that the Sky deal is better than what the BBC have been doing since 2009.

But it is what it is. I can't convince you guys to my way of thinking, but you can't convince me to your way of thinking either.

[Quiet One 15]

So I'll probably just do what I did in 2010.

Which is sad.

Dress like a bumblebee and try to perform oral sex on John Goodman on a stage?

Yes, it is sad.

[AleHop 0]

@Adam, to make it clear:

As I said I don't know how BBC work, I rate it very highly. What I do know is RTVE (Spanish radio and TV). They produce crap, they hail socialism and populism everytime everywhere, they lie about the Spanish Civil War, they rewrite History...

I want RTVE to disappear. Even if they produced better quality it's a huge waste of money Spain cannot afford. I'm glad the BBC is different.

[Rainmaster 7]

I don't think the BBC will do a bad job with just showing the highlights of half the races. Anyone who has experienced the BBC sports coverage will know that they put out a very good product on any sport and I'm sure they capture and cover all aspects in the races they will be showing as highlights without much loss of context or feel for the race. I understand that the highlights will be an hour long, maybe more. Indeed, if some of the races turn out to be borefests then an hour is perhaps as much as anyone will be able to stomach. My original posting, back on page one, was trying to put across how F1 used to be covered by the BBC back in the 80's. We used to get some full, live races but often the races were ruined by crossing over to other sports happening live at the time; F1 was not a priority sport, it was much lower down the pecking order than Sunday cricket and snooker. I think that we a can confident that it's appreciated more now and will be given treatment that we all think it deserves. As for the live races I am sure that the BBC will continue to cover these as well as they have over these last few years. They've got Ben Edwards as lead commentator and he is someone I like to hear. He's knowledgable, intelligent and enthusiastic, good choice. David Coulthard is his co-commentator. DC has really impressed me with his wit and wisdom. I like him more as a commentator than I did as a driver.

It will be interesting to see how SKY does over the season in respect of new viewers/subscribers to their F1 channel. The trouble is that SKY does not operate to a normal business model. Murdoch is prepared to run a loss leader for years in order to see of a competitor or rival. I hope F1 proves too costly for him, but I doubt it. From the huge advertising campaign that I've witnessed they are really pushing it. But how many people are going to fork out £30 per month for the SKY package that includes F1 in HD. If many of us on this forum who are huge, longstanding fans of F1 are saying it's a bridge too far (to use the bridge metaphor again) then the average SKY punter is either not going to upgrade their package, or if they are already entitled to the service beacuse of their existing subscription fees, not going to bother to tune in. Overall result not many people watching via SKY.

The SKY F1 team is a mixed bag. David Croft as lead commentator. He's good but his knowledge isn't that deep, probably only 10-15 years. Example; he once asked Mike Gascoyne what his favourite F1 car design was and Gascoyne replied that it was the Lotus 88. Crofty didn't have a clue and thought that was the Lotus of 1988. This might seem a bit picky on my part but Murray Walker would know instantly what Gascoyne was refering to. Brundle is a great co-commentator. Ted Kravitz thinks he should be employed by one of the teams as a strategist, I won't miss him at all, far too smug for my liking. Natalie Pinkham knows next to flat nothing about F1 and the same applies to the other bit of eye candy they've got. The main presenter could pass me in the street and I wouldn't know who he is.

I'm not too disappointed in only being able to watch 50% of the races live. It could have been worse, I've got my fingers crossed that in a few years F1 will return to a free to air service and not go the whole hog and disappear to SKY forever.

Yep.

[Massa 0]

You know...

In the U.S., four races are on FOX. Three of the races on FOX are not live, and there is no live alternative. Those three races on FOX show about one hour of the hour-and-twenty race by showing twenty minutes or more of ads.

The BBC highlights will show about one hour of the hour-and-twenty race by being an hour-long program, and likely have a higher level of coverage.

Just think of watching highlights like watching American television, only better, because the producer knows what you're going to miss, rather than with ads. I'm jealous of your TV deal, really, I'd love to watch the races in an hour format later in the day, so much so I'll probably just record the live ones, fast forward through the ads, and get exactly that!

Stay positive guys...I have a good feeling about this season and I think you'll want to find ways to enjoy it.

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

Dress like a bumblebee and try to perform oral sex on John Goodman on a stage?

Yes, it is sad.

It was a wasp and we all know it was you really

[Quiet One 15]

It was a wasp and we all know it was you really

Ok, I admit it. It was me. Not John Goodman.

[Insider 0]

You know...

In the U.S., four races are on FOX. Three of the races on FOX are not live, and there is no live alternative. Those three races on FOX show about one hour of the hour-and-twenty race by showing twenty minutes or more of ads.

The BBC highlights will show about one hour of the hour-and-twenty race by being an hour-long program, and likely have a higher level of coverage.

Just think of watching highlights like watching American television, only better, because the producer knows what you're going to miss, rather than with ads. I'm jealous of your TV deal, really, I'd love to watch the races in an hour format later in the day, so much so I'll probably just record the live ones, fast forward through the ads, and get exactly that!

Stay positive guys...I have a good feeling about this season and I think you'll want to find ways to enjoy it.

I think it's worth a mention that Sky's F1 channel subscribers will see the live race without adverts at all. That is part of the deal. Commercial breaks will be limited to the pre and post race shows. Another salient point is that people in the UK generally don't like paying for entertainment - they expect everything for free. The BBC annual licence fee is £145. Peanuts. That hardly covers three monthly payments to Sky or Virgin Media for most families. The content of most BBC channels is world class. One can hardly complain when they have to tighten their belts every now and then. I think for most people over here, the 'Sky' problem is the old phonetapper himself, Murdoch; the George W Bush of the media world. I'm at work 12-14 hours a day, whether I am on the road or not and F1 is my passion. Our Sky package costs me £540 a year which I can ill-afford but it's cheaper than booze for a hell of a bigger buzz. I'll suck it up and stay sane.

[dribbler 6]

I think it's worth a mention that Sky's F1 channel subscribers will see the live race without adverts at all. That is part of the deal. Commercial breaks will be limited to the pre and post race shows. Another salient point is that people in the UK generally don't like paying for entertainment - they expect everything for free. The BBC annual licence fee is £145. Peanuts. That hardly covers three monthly payments to Sky or Virgin Media for most families. The content of most BBC channels is world class. One can hardly complain when they have to tighten their belts every now and then. I think for most people over here, the 'Sky' problem is the old phonetapper himself, Murdoch; the George W Bush of the media world. I'm at work 12-14 hours a day, whether I am on the road or not and F1 is my passion. Our Sky package costs me £540 a year which I can ill-afford but it's cheaper than booze for a hell of a bigger buzz. I'll suck it up and stay sane.

I think people in the UK want to understand why a certain level of service and coverage cannot be maintained for similar amounts of money, not that people in the UK expect everything for free. I'm happy to pay my licence fee. I would be happy to pay significantly more, if it preserved the BBC's excellent Formula One coverage. But I was not given the choice. Who said "calling all F1 Fans, pay up or lose it"? No one.

So, how much extra would I have paid to keep F1 on the BBC? Interesting question. Based on Sky costing me approximately £500 per year, I would have paid at least £200 extra on top of my licence fee. I bet there are a high number of true fans who would have done the same.

I will not pay Murdoch for this blatant scam because I don't want all the other trashy sh*t that goes with the F1 channel.

[LabradoRacer 2]

Rather than create a separate thread, here's my mini-rant: I may miss the end part of the Aussie GP due to the scheduled power cuts.

Ain't life a bitch?

[Insider 0]

I think people in the UK want to understand why a certain level of service and coverage cannot be maintained for similar amounts of money, not that people in the UK expect everything for free. I'm happy to pay my licence fee. I would be happy to pay significantly more, if it preserved the BBC's excellent Formula One coverage. But I was not given the choice. Who said "calling all F1 Fans, pay up or lose it"? No one.

So, how much extra would I have paid to keep F1 on the BBC? Interesting question. Based on Sky costing me approximately £500 per year, I would have paid at least £200 extra on top of my licence fee. I bet there are a high number of true fans who would have done the same.

I will not pay Murdoch for this blatant scam because I don't want all the other trashy sh*t that goes with the F1 channel.

I would have to agree that if the BBC were financed to bid for all the premier sports they once had a monopoly on, [as was promised by the Conservative party at the last election] and succeeded, I would be happy to pay a higher licence fee.

[JHS18 0]

Rather than create a separate thread, here's my mini-rant: I may miss the end part of the Aussie GP due to the scheduled power cuts.

Ain't life a bitch?

Not really. The end's the boring bit.