Creationists Go Round And Round

[pumpdoc 2]

Hmm. If I were to consider the existence of such a deity, then I'd have to surmise that He's fallen asleep at the wheel.

Sleeping and driveing

[goferrarigo 0]

How do you explain the fact that Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs etc all claim to have "found God(s)" in religious experiences just like yours? They claim to have seen miracles and have heard God(s) speak to them.

If your answer is that evil spirits have fooled them, how do you know that you aren't the one being fooled by them? If your answer to that final question is that it says that you aren't the one being tricked in the Bible, then how do you know they haven't altered the Bible? And don't say that the Bible says that it hasn't been altered, because maybe they put those bits in too.

I actually await thi answer.... One guy met me in a class and started saying a lot of BS, i shrug him off hoping it's only a few that are missionaries and most claim other religions are not "devil's way of getting you out of Christainity"

[Schumikonen 2]

How do you explain the fact that Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs etc all claim to have "found God(s)" in religious experiences just like yours? They claim to have seen miracles and have heard God(s) speak to them.

If your answer is that evil spirits have fooled them, how do you know that you aren't the one being fooled by them? If your answer to that final question is that it says that you aren't the one being tricked in the Bible, then how do you know they haven't altered the Bible? And don't say that the Bible says that it hasn't been altered, because maybe they put those bits in too.

My answer in very simple thoses people and many other like I alredy told you it was happening in my home with my mother have actually had thoses experience they describe and they even believe by thoses "miracles" they see if you read the bible you will find that Moses went to pharaoh and he put the stick in the floor and this turned into a serpent but pharaot people did the same, they had power and they performed miracle but Moses stick ate pharaoh's and that's the difference today when thoses people got in front of Jesus, thoses demons that actually do thoses miracles are casted out of them, they are put in evidence and in the heat of the fight you can hear thoses demons confesing what they were doing and threatening the rest of the people there, sometimes even blaming people of unknown sins they are doing, Satan always try to imitate the things God does but he doesn't have the power to resist God's

[Schumikonen 2]

I actually await thi answer.... One guy met me in a class and started saying a lot of BS, i shrug him off hoping it's only a few that are missionaries and most claim other religions are not "devil's way of getting you out of Christainity"

All religions are wrong, there is not only one that can make you saved only Jesus can, becasue he is the only one who lived without sin and die for your sins, if you follow any religion even if is a christian one, then you are in the wrong way, you have to follow Jesus and Jesus is not a religion, Jesus is God.

[Grabthaw the Hammerslayer 4]

All religions are wrong, there is not only one that can make you saved only Jesus can, becasue he is the only one who lived without sin and die for your sins, if you follow any religion even if is a christian one, then you are in the wrong way, you have to follow Jesus and Jesus is not a religion, Jesus is God.

I'm sure that all of the other religions would say theirs is the only one. This is the problem...

[Rainmaster 7]

Why some people around here believe that God is limited is beyond me. What I mean to say is that He has created this human civilisation with an incredibly diverse variety of peoples and cultures, yet some feel that He is only capable of providing one spiritual path for all these people to follow. As though a Papua New Guinean tribe would identify with the Bible, and if they don't, well they must be hellbound sinners. Some even think He can only look like a white guy with a beard. Surely God is unlimited??? Surely He is capable of appearing in more guises than we can think of. And surely He answers to more names than we can think of too. Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, Judaism, Science. God, Buddha, Brahman, Allah, Quantum physics. There's so many different paths to match the diversity of cultures out there. So many ways for people to glimpse the amazing creation they're a part of. Perhaps God speaks in many ways. It makes sense doesn't it? Perhaps He just wants His people to act out the highest version of themselves possible, wherever they are on the planet. To realise they are a part of him, and to act accordingly. Perhaps religious variety is another one of His tools. Anyone who thinks God isn't capable of providing all of this and more is, to me, suggesting that the very God they worship is limited.

A very fine post Jez

[Max Mosley 2]

My answer in very simple thoses people and many other like I alredy told you it was happening in my home with my mother have actually had thoses experience they describe and they even believe by thoses "miracles" they see if you read the bible you will find that Moses went to pharaoh and he put the stick in the floor and this turned into a serpent but pharaot people did the same, they had power and they performed miracle but Moses stick ate pharaoh's and that's the difference today when thoses people got in front of Jesus, thoses demons that actually do thoses miracles are casted out of them, they are put in evidence and in the heat of the fight you can hear thoses demons confesing what they were doing and threatening the rest of the people there, sometimes even blaming people of unknown sins they are doing, Satan always try to imitate the things God does but he doesn't have the power to resist God's

That's just a trick. The demons are trying to fool you. They are very good at it, like Derren Brown.

And are you saying that you have actually seen a demon and heard it talk to you and confess its sins?

[Schumikonen 2]

That's just a trick. The demons are trying to fool you. They are very good at it, like Derren Brown.

And are you saying that you have actually seen a demon and heard it talk to you and confess its sins?

Maybe they are but if that is what is going to improve people's quality of life then this is worth to try, I've seen people trying to stop using drugs but after they are libetarated from demon's dominance they stop using them right away, gays change the way they were living when demons are not in the way and many, many others cases people can't stop doing something, people who doesn't even know a demon exist, people who don't know demons have to obey in the name of Jesus, you can see them doing exactly what they ignore, because this is real, not a trick, you can see an evangelist that goes to a tribe in amazon, people who don't know anything about Jesus but their demons obey and get out of them in the name of Jesus, people go to chruch and they don't know about this thing like many of you didn't know about it, but then when the Holly Spirit start moving in the lace you how does demons can't resist the holly presence of God and then they get manisfeted, the change in people's life is a good reward for this, if they are fooling us they are doing a very good job.

Not confesing its sins a demon don't have sins because a demon can't be saved people is saved by faith but given that demons were angels they can not use faith because they already know God, they have been in his presence so faith doesn't work for them they are eternally condemned, that's why they want to carry with them as many people as they can, we are God's creation and they are against everything that comes from God, but yes I have heard some of them talking, that's a normal thing in many churches, if you goes to Argentina I can tell you about someone that you can contact to see this for yourself, i told you that science is not interested in finding God there are places adn things that they can study to see if what we say is truth or not.

[Schumikonen 2]

I'm sure that all of the other religions would say theirs is the only one. This is the problem...

yes that's what they do and that's why they are wrong, you won't hear me talking about a religion I just talk about Jesus.

[goferrarigo 0]

All religions are wrong, there is not only one that can make you saved only Jesus can, becasue he is the only one who lived without sin and die for your sins, if you follow any religion even if is a christian one, then you are in the wrong way, you have to follow Jesus and Jesus is not a religion, Jesus is God.

From what they teach in class about Christianity is that Jesus is God's Son... Now your telling me he is God Himself???

I'm sure that all of the other religions would say theirs is the only one. This is the problem...

Nope that is not true... Only Islam and Christanity from what we read in my world religion class, have the only one path.... Hinduism and Buddism definatly believe in many paths to God...

The parable i like is the Blind men and the elephant. We all are blind in front of God and try to describe what we touch, but we all are right and wrong at the same time... No one can fully describe God.

[Schumikonen 2]

From what they teach in class about Christianity is that Jesus is God's Son... Now your telling me he is God Himself???

Nope that is not true... Only Islam and Christanity from what we read in my world religion class, have the only one path.... Hinduism and Buddism definatly believe in many paths to God...

The parable i like is the Blind men and the elephant. We all are blind in front of God and try to describe what we touch, but we all are right and wrong at the same time... No one can fully describe God.

That's one of the biggest mysteries of the bible teaching I need time to tell you about this, I will do it in a couple of hours when I get home.

[goferrarigo 0]

That's one of the biggest mysteries of the bible teaching I need time to tell you about this, I will do it in a couple of hours when I get home.

Ok sure.... I will then forward this to my TA and look smart

[dribbler 6]

If God existed wouldn't it be far safer for him to not allow us all to question his existence? If he is controlling us all, what we think, say and write, why is he allowing this?

Animals and are only allowed to act in a certain way uo to a certain point. They are limited. We are limitless. Or are we? Are we being constrained but don't realise it? Just like animals?

Too much wine..........or maybe not enough...............

[Schumikonen 2]

If God existed wouldn't it be far safer for him to not allow us all to question his existence? If he is controlling us all, what we think, say and write, why is he allowing this?

Animals and are only allowed to act in a certain way uo to a certain point. They are limited. We are limitless. Or are we? Are we being constrained but don't realise it? Just like animals?

Too much wine..........or maybe not enough...............

That is because we have some of God's atribute and that is one of them, we can make our own choices we have freedom to do that we can choose between right or wrong we are not programmed, God gave us that he does not control our thought, what we think or say, he can do it but he doesn't do it, Jesus said "here I am at the door knocking, if someone open the door I will enter" but never breaks the door to get in, this is just for the one who choose to let him in, you will find many passages like this in the bible, this is what we call free will.

[Schumikonen 2]

From what they teach in class about Christianity is that Jesus is God's Son... Now your telling me he is God Himself???

I told you this is a mystery, not everybody is aloud to understand it because this is one of thoses spiritual thing that natural men can not understand and is a crazy thing for them, anyway I will let you know some of the passages in teh bible that talk about it starting by my favorite

1 Timothy 3

16Beyond all question, the mystery of godliness is great:

He appeared in a body,

was vindicated by the Spirit,

was seen by angels,

was preached among the nations,

was believed on in the world,

was taken up in glory.

Here when it says that was seen by angels is because angels in heaven can not see God, the bible explain that he dwells in a light so bright that noone can see inside, there are certain kind of angels that are the closest to God and the bible explain that they cover their eyes when they get close to him, so angels were awating for this moment to see Jesus (God) because until that point they were not able to see him.

John 14

8Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us."

9Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'? 10Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me?

John 20

26A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you!" 27Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe."

28Thomas said to him, "My Lord and my God!"

29Then Jesus told him, "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."

1 John 5

20We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true

[Schumikonen 2]

here is the story of Lazarus for thoses who never had the chance to read it

John 11

The Death of Lazarus

1Now a man named Lazarus was sick. He was from Bethany, the village of Mary and her sister Martha. 2This Mary, whose brother Lazarus now lay sick, was the same one who poured perfume on the Lord and wiped his feet with her hair. 3So the sisters sent word to Jesus, "Lord, the one you love is sick."

4When he heard this, Jesus said, "This sickness will not end in death. No, it is for God's glory so that God's Son may be glorified through it." 5Jesus loved Martha and her sister and Lazarus. 6Yet when he heard that Lazarus was sick, he stayed where he was two more days.

7Then he said to his disciples, "Let us go back to Judea."

8"But Rabbi," they said, "a short while ago the Jews tried to stone you, and yet you are going back there?"

9Jesus answered, "Are there not twelve hours of daylight? A man who walks by day will not stumble, for he sees by this world's light. 10It is when he walks by night that he stumbles, for he has no light."

11After he had said this, he went on to tell them, "Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep; but I am going there to wake him up."

12His disciples replied, "Lord, if he sleeps, he will get better." 13Jesus had been speaking of his death, but his disciples thought he meant natural sleep.

14So then he told them plainly, "Lazarus is dead, 15and for your sake I am glad I was not there, so that you may believe. But let us go to him."

16Then Thomas (called Didymus) said to the rest of the disciples, "Let us also go, that we may die with him."

Jesus Comforts the Sisters

17On his arrival, Jesus found that Lazarus had already been in the tomb for four days. 18Bethany was less than two miles from Jerusalem, 19and many Jews had come to Martha and Mary to comfort them in the loss of their brother. 20When Martha heard that Jesus was coming, she went out to meet him, but Mary stayed at home.

21"Lord," Martha said to Jesus, "if you had been here, my brother would not have died. 22But I know that even now God will give you whatever you ask."

23Jesus said to her, "Your brother will rise again."

24Martha answered, "I know he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day."

25Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me will live, even though he dies; 26and whoever lives and believes in me will never die. Do you believe this?"

27"Yes, Lord," she told him, "I believe that you are the Christ, the Son of God, who was to come into the world."

28And after she had said this, she went back and called her sister Mary aside. "The Teacher is here," she said, "and is asking for you." 29When Mary heard this, she got up quickly and went to him. 30Now Jesus had not yet entered the village, but was still at the place where Martha had met him. 31When the Jews who had been with Mary in the house, comforting her, noticed how quickly she got up and went out, they followed her, supposing she was going to the tomb to mourn there.

32When Mary reached the place where Jesus was and saw him, she fell at his feet and said, "Lord, if you had been here, my brother would not have died."

33When Jesus saw her weeping, and the Jews who had come along with her also weeping, he was deeply moved in spirit and troubled. 34"Where have you laid him?" he asked.

"Come and see, Lord," they replied.

35Jesus wept.

36Then the Jews said, "See how he loved him!"

37But some of them said, "Could not he who opened the eyes of the blind man have kept this man from dying?"

Jesus Raises Lazarus From the Dead

38Jesus, once more deeply moved, came to the tomb. It was a cave with a stone laid across the entrance. 39"Take away the stone," he said.

"But, Lord," said Martha, the sister of the dead man, "by this time there is a bad odor, for he has been there four days."

40Then Jesus said, "Did I not tell you that if you believed, you would see the glory of God?"

41So they took away the stone. Then Jesus looked up and said, "Father, I thank you that you have heard me. 42I knew that you always hear me, but I said this for the benefit of the people standing here, that they may believe that you sent me."

43When he had said this, Jesus called in a loud voice, "Lazarus, come out!" 44The dead man came out, his hands and feet wrapped with strips of linen, and a cloth around his face.

Jesus said to them, "Take off the grave clothes and let him go."

The Plot to Kill Jesus

45Therefore many of the Jews who had come to visit Mary, and had seen what Jesus did, put their faith in him. 46But some of them went to the Pharisees and told them what Jesus had done. 47Then the chief priests and the Pharisees called a meeting of the Sanhedrin.

"What are we accomplishing?" they asked. "Here is this man performing many miraculous signs. 48If we let him go on like this, everyone will believe in him, and then the Romans will come and take away both our place and our nation."

49Then one of them, named Caiaphas, who was high priest that year, spoke up, "You know nothing at all! 50You do not realize that it is better for you that one man die for the people than that the whole nation perish."

51He did not say this on his own, but as high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus would die for the Jewish nation, 52and not only for that nation but also for the scattered children of God, to bring them together and make them one. 53So from that day on they plotted to take his life.

54Therefore Jesus no longer moved about publicly among the Jews. Instead he withdrew to a region near the desert, to a village called Ephraim, where he stayed with his disciples.

55When it was almost time for the Jewish Passover, many went up from the country to Jerusalem for their ceremonial cleansing before the Passover. 56They kept looking for Jesus, and as they stood in the temple area they asked one another, "What do you think? Isn't he coming to the Feast at all?" 57But the chief priests and Pharisees had given orders that if anyone found out where Jesus was, he should report it so that they might arrest him.

[LabradoRacer 2]

Schumikonen, do you know that you could be sitting on a potential goldmine? You just have to peddle yourself as the panacea for insomnia.

[Jez 0]

Christians go round and round

Just rise to the height of your halo, I say, and let others do the same using the method that rings true to them. Schumikonen you've enjoyed the experience of finding a path that feels right and applying yourself to it, it's only fair that others should enjoy the same freedom. God gave us the ability to feel right about something. You can feel it in the gut. He also gave us an abundance of choice. I think I've tried to say just about all I can. Over to you friends.

[goferrarigo 0]

Interesting story Schumikonen, It may seem that in Christanity that Jesus is God, i obviously have no idea, but it was an interesting read... Thanks....

[dribbler 6]

That is because we have some of God's atribute and that is one of them, we can make our own choices we have freedom to do that we can choose between right or wrong we are not programmed, God gave us that he does not control our thought, what we think or say, he can do it but he doesn't do it, Jesus said "here I am at the door knocking, if someone open the door I will enter" but never breaks the door to get in, this is just for the one who choose to let him in, you will find many passages like this in the bible, this is what we call free will.

Or so you think..........

[Schumikonen 2]

Christians go round and round

Just rise to the height of your halo, I say, and let others do the same using the method that rings true to them. Schumikonen you've enjoyed the experience of finding a path that feels right and applying yourself to it, it's only fair that others should enjoy the same freedom. God gave us the ability to feel right about something. You can feel it in the gut. He also gave us an abundance of choice. I think I've tried to say just about all I can. Over to you friends.

My answers are only for thoses who want to hear it, just read my posts and you will find things like "if you want to know more just ask" if nobody here want to know what I have to say then I would not answer anything but I keep answering because people keep asking, if you notice I stood out of this thread for a while after the race but thoses questions made me answer, I am giving everybody the freedom to stop asking or the freedom to ask, if they ask I will answer, if that is what you mean I think I am giving you all the freedom to be here in this thread, you know what is this thread about and if you are reading here is not my fault, probably I miss your point, if I did I am sorry.

[Schumikonen 2]

Schumikonen, do you know that you could be sitting on a potential goldmine? You just have to peddle yourself as the panacea for insomnia.

I think I know not quite sure but I think I know

[Jez 0]

My answers are only for thoses who want to hear it, just read my posts and you will find things like "if you want to know more just ask" if nobody here want to know what I have to say then I would not answer anything but I keep answering because people keep asking, if you notice I stood out of this thread for a while after the race but thoses questions made me answer, I am giving everybody the freedom to stop asking or the freedom to ask, if they ask I will answer, if that is what you mean I think I am giving you all the freedom to be here in this thread, you know what is this thread about and if you are reading here is not my fault, probably I miss your point, if I did I am sorry.

True you've not let your firm beliefs interfere with your sense of respect to others in this thread.

And I guess you believe in what you do for reasons that feel right to you. That's a good thing.

[Max Mosley 2]

Yes. Even though Schumikonen is wrong he is certainly a good-natured person whose heart is in the right place. I'm sure God will forgive his dodgy theology.

[LabradoRacer 2]

I think I know not quite sure but I think I know

I've got to hand it to you. I'll say it again that you're a good sport!

Actually come to think of it, we both worship the same god.. Michael Schumacher! & the same religion ...Ferrari.